To think this “crackdown” on benefit fraud is absolutely pathetic

[MissLou0]

We lose hundreds of billions from tax avoidance compared to 1 billion on benefit fraud and nothing is done about it, because those are the Tory donors. Michelle Mone just stole £28 million from taxpayers for her PPE scam, she’s not in trouble, and she of course also hides her hundreds of millions offshore.

We lose a small amount from benefit fraud, and as a result everyone who claims any sort of benefit including disability benefits banks are going to be monitored.

The graph below doesn’t even scratch the surface of how much is lost to tax avoidance. For example Rupert Murdoch is worth £17 billion and he hasn’t paid tax in years, personal tax or on his businesses. And he’s ONE person. These people are not targeted yet the most desperate and vulnerable are.

This is completely ignored by the media as the majority of newspaper owners are hiding their money offshore.

I’m in a situation where I don’t need to claim any benefits but I have family who are disabled who have had to fight for even the tiniest amount to live on, and they are now having to deal with this invasion of privacy which will make not even 0.000001% of what cracking down on tax avoidance would.

Tbf the levels of benefit fraud shot up during the pandemic when the usual (and perfectly adequate when properly implemented) checks on ID etc were suspended and claims went entirely online. But the answer to that is to implement the existing system of checking details and income properly, not to add an extra layer of intrusion and worry into the lives of every single benefit claimant!

And even if the fraud rate did go up, it was still hugely overshadowed by the level of corruption and financial dodgy dealings and basically fraudulent spaffing of public money that this government engaged in throughout the pandemic and beyond though...

Meh, Tories are chasing votes. Expect an awful lot more of this no-brainer, low hanging fruit, right-wingish shit.
Symptom of desperation!

I think sometimes high taxes in rich are home goals
people avoid it as when you start taking over 1/2 of it in tax on the face of it does seem extortionate

personally IHT I would of encountered the 40% would of quite happily of paid a normal rate of tax 20% but sorted now so will pay nothing

The benefits system is broken. I should be entitled to pip because of my disability but i cannot face the application process and being turned down only to have to appeal.

How can you not understand?

Benefit claimants are being targeted for political reasons, when in fact, it's a tiny proportion of monetary loss to the treasury.

The time spent on policy and the ramifications of implementing any policy is entirely disproportionate to it's impact on monies available to the treasury.

Using a sledgehammer to crack a nut, to show everyone you've got a sledgehammer.

It's typical rhetoric of the right-wing. Give a high profile to any perceived lack of fairness in spending money on the poor, whilst entirely ignoring actual unfairness and inequality that, if solved, would improve the lives of the many.

District and divide. Privatise profits, socialise debts.

It's the Tory way.

It’s not a matter of either/or. They should be cracking down on both.

The hoops people have to jump through already to get benefits are ludicrous now. Yeah - great!! Let's make it even harder for them to claim. I work with sick/disabled people on a dialysis unit and not everyone sits in a wheelchair, but that doesn't mean that they're able to work. For a myriad of reasons.

Life is complicated for some people.

I can't quite get over the number of Tory apologists on this thread.

Yes - the OP is right - with bells on.

Absolutely this ^

The checks would only be on SAVINGS and I would think that most people on benefits (or not) would be hard-pressed to have savings of more than £16k.

WTF???

So you're not paying tax? Did I read that right?

I work in tax and there’s loads more done now in tackling tax fraud than there ever was (have worked in tax for over 25 years), loads more is done now in closing down legal loopholes than there ever was. I say this as someone who hates the tories and what they’ve done but I don’t think their tackling of tax evasion/avoidance is something they’ve done badly at compared to how others did previously/ could potentially do if they were in power.

Inheirtance tax can be reduced with planning.

If it's wrong, it's wrong, whether it's benefits or big business. Whilst I think the penalties should be harsher for big business, I don't agree that it should be ignored because someone is on a lower income.

“They hang the man and flog the woman that steals the goose from off the common / but let the greater villain loose that steals the common from the goose”

Seems appropriate for a party that began government by quoting Henry VIII laws and who have always wet themselves over the amazingly wonderful Victorian period.

Yes

It’s all to stop us looking into and questioning how much of our money the government wastes/ creams off the top for themselves and their buddies.
If we’re all pointing fingers at each other we’re not pointing fingers up at them.

This thread shows why the Tories keep getting voted in. The lax attitude and whataboutery about fraud from lefties drives people who aren’t even on the right to vote conservative just to keep these batshit views away from power.

🙄 another thread of people thinking they know what they are talking about.

Benefit fraud is a mix of small scale fraud and then a large amount of deliberate fraud. People owning houses and setting up false claims.

People with multiple bank accounts and huge sums of money (inheritance). Yes they do leave it in the bank because they think they can get away with it.

Living together as a couple but claiming to be single for full UC.

These can be detected, investigated and losses recovered.

Tax evasion is harder to investigate. Yes, the government should go after them and does when things like the Panama papers reveal info. For all those people jumping up and down about going after tax evasion it would be great if you could explain how you think that can happen (or does that not fit the narrative?).

People should vote with their feet on companies like Amazon where they don’t pay a living wage / treat staff appallingly / etc. but they don’t because, when push comes to shove, people say things but don’t act.

There is a raft of difference between tax planning and legal avoidance than fraud.

I know of highly intelligent people with PhDs who will not work more than 15/16 hours lest it affects their universal credit. These are people who are fit and well but would rather maximise benefits and minimise work. It is legal but morally very wrong. There is work for them to do.

Jobs would soon disappear if the tax system became more punitive.

Claiming for the genuine needs to be easier.

YADNBU.
Its disgusting the lengths people have to go to in the UK to get financial support from the state. I cannot understand why people vote Conservative because they are the decision makers who allow this gross unfairness to continue. It’s disgraceful how many people are treated by the UK welfare system; imo its the worst aspect of UK society. The theft of taxpayers money at the other end of the scale is nothing short of criminal yet nothing done.

Are there actual numbers and not just a graph? The benefit fraud figure looks tiny in comparison to the two huge columns however anything sitting on a scale of billions isn't actually tiny! Both need looked at, of course we know where tories start......

@MissLou0 thanks for sharing stats noone can argue with! It annoys me so much that my little business pays tonnes in Corp tax, I pay tonnes in personal and dividend tax yet the mega rich pay nothing - even Amazon has a tax deal and pays No corporation tax https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2023/jun/01/amazon-uk-services-main-division-pay-no-corporation-tax-for-second-year-in-row-tax-credit-government-super-deduction-scheme

It sickens me. Proportionately the working people in this country are excessively taxed.

My DD was paid £250 towards £650 rent when she was unemployed. How the F are people who are struggling meant to find £400 extra when they don't receive that in benefits- she has a disability and was told by the police to move out as she was at risk. Its disgusting.

We have to get shut of this government and get someone in who gets a grip of tax avoidance and demonisation of those on benefits.

You seem to be suggesting that all the people who are are evading taxes are rich which is obviously not the case. All the ones I know are builders, cleaners, carers etc. If you hate rich people, just say it.

It’s not a matter of either/or. They should be cracking down on both.

^

This

Lots of tradespeople do 'homers', aka cash in hand jobs, nobody few people complains if it means they get a decent tradesman at short notice/cheaper, do they?

I'm pleased there is 1 person on MN who knows what they are talking about 🤔

The arrogance on here is sometimes astounding, in my opinion, obviously.