To think this “crackdown” on benefit fraud is absolutely pathetic

[MissLou0]

We lose hundreds of billions from tax avoidance compared to 1 billion on benefit fraud and nothing is done about it, because those are the Tory donors. Michelle Mone just stole £28 million from taxpayers for her PPE scam, she’s not in trouble, and she of course also hides her hundreds of millions offshore.

We lose a small amount from benefit fraud, and as a result everyone who claims any sort of benefit including disability benefits banks are going to be monitored.

The graph below doesn’t even scratch the surface of how much is lost to tax avoidance. For example Rupert Murdoch is worth £17 billion and he hasn’t paid tax in years, personal tax or on his businesses. And he’s ONE person. These people are not targeted yet the most desperate and vulnerable are.

This is completely ignored by the media as the majority of newspaper owners are hiding their money offshore.

I’m in a situation where I don’t need to claim any benefits but I have family who are disabled who have had to fight for even the tiniest amount to live on, and they are now having to deal with this invasion of privacy which will make not even 0.000001% of what cracking down on tax avoidance would.

Double standards and hypocrisy at its finest. I am waiting for a FOI request regarding how much this initiative is going to cost in comparison to the projected 'savings'. Government has lost sight (if it ever had sight) of exactly who is supposed to be serving who.

You can get UC even if one is pension age as long as the other isn't. You are unlikely to get free dentist treatment though unless you earn very little as the threshold is lower on UC so you probably wouldn't have been entitled anyway.

Thank you, this is a good idea.

I'd be interested in the answer to that too.

Rupert Murdoch is a very poor example to use. He is American (since 1985 -Australian before then), lives in New York, and has done for many years. He does not hold UK non-dom status as he has no reason to do so - his personal tax liability to the UK is absolutely zero. His companies are global and overwhelmingly North American and Australasian, with only 17% of revenue being European, although much of that 17% may be British (mainly News UK, Talk Radio/TV and HarperCollins UK). His UK companies pay UK tax according to UK law and there has never been any suggestion that they evade or avoid UK tax.

If you want a more relevant example, look to Viscount Rothermere (Jonathan Harmsworth) who is British, lives and works in Britain, owns the Daily Mail, i and Metro through offshore (mainly Bermudan) structures. He holds non-dom status which was inherited from his father, as was his seat in the House of Lords until the 1999 reforms reduced the number of hereditary peers.

My eldest DD has had mental health issues since her late teens, is classified as disabled and lives on benefits. She has to go for regular medicals and interviews even though her psychiatrist says she will never be in a position to work. Every time she has to pay for a doctor's letter saying what medications she takes and pay a return train fare of £30. She also has to go to the benefits office. Every trip costs her around £55 out of a fairly meagre benefit income and seems to happen every 3 months or so. People on benefits do not have this sort of money sitting in their bank accounts.

I agree, but I think it's fair to say my DH isn't alone in working when he shouldn't be (due to ill health) because the benefits system isn't fit for purpose. Zero hours contracts etc.

Benefit fraud figures are around £1bn a year and that includes DWP error too. £38bn is just ridiculuous.

👏👏👏

It’s not sinister, and I apologise if it makes people anxious, but it is happening - a lot of it was announced in the Kings Speech. Since the Tories took over, they have chipped away at disability benefits. This is just the latest raft of changes. If you look at the online newspapers like the Daily Mirror and the Daily Record in Scotland you’ll see the changes set out in various articles there, and the YouGov site carries a lot of information. There is also a disability advisory website called Benefits and Work - you need a subscription for detailed information but they carry a lot of information on proposed changes which is available to the general public.

The Australian equivalent of PIP prescribes how the benefit should be spent. The systems from different countries that the government is looking at to inform how they change our system in the future, includes the Australian model. How much legislation on changing the disability benefits system do you imagine has been pushed through without much opposition ? If you check, you’ll find it’s more than you think.

@Ukrainebaby23 I feel sorry your husband has to work when he's ill.

This government has a lot of links with right wing Aussie politicians and they draw a lot inspiration from their policies.

So not surprised that this is being presented.

Do you have a link to the Australian PIP thing? Not thinking you are making it up... am just interested (and horrified).

Abso-bloody-lutely OP. All these PPs saying that there should be more checks on benefit claimants to prevent fraud obviously have no idea what the impact of these additional checks have on the genuine, often extremely vulnerable people.

These people already have to jump through hoops and undergo humiliating assessments to claim the pittances they are entitled to without adding even more checks to the equation. The pressure and stress this puts on already very vulnerable people is almost unbearable.

Those saying 'if you're not committing fraud you have nothing to worry about' have obviously never had any dealings with the DWP. They will do anything to avoid paying out, including denying genuine claimants what they are legally entitled to and the more vulnerable you are the more they think they can get away with it.

My brother had serious physical and mental health problems all his life (thanks to a near fatal bout of meningitis when he was 8). He was housebound, had severe mobility issues and extremely poor mental health and was battling stage 3 bowel cancer yet in the last assessment he had approx 5 years ago he was deemed as being 'fit for work' (despite supporting letters from his GP and various hospital consultants saying otherwise). I appealed the decision on his behalf (as he was in no condition to) and went through the assessment criteria point by point providing evidence of his limitations. Surprise, surprise, a few weeks before we were to appear at the tribunal I was contacted to say they had reviewed the situation and were now awarding my brother the HIGHEST POSSIBLE AWARD. Just how do you go from being 'fit for work' to being in the highest possible award in just a matter of months?

As I said, my brother was in no state to contest the initial decision and was on the verge of suicide as there was no way he could hold down a job and that was his only source of income. Without me to advocate for him he would have been left with nothing. As it was, he died a year or so later so at least the Government didn't have to 'waste' too much money on him ay?

People really cannot underestimate the stress and anxiety all of these checks and assessments have on these vulnerable people, especially when they know the Government are just looking for any excuse not to pay out. Living in constant fear of being left destitute, on top of having to deal with your disability or illness is immoral and quite frankly disgusting.

Yes there are an (exceedingly small) number of people who take the piss but to demonise and persecute GENUINE claimants for this minority when you've got billionaires getting away with paying no tax whatsoever is quite frankly obscene.

Absolutely this.

Terry Pratchett — 'The news that they have nothing to fear is guaranteed to strike fear into the hearts of innocents everywhere.'

TP knew the score.

Love a bit of TP 😁

Sam Vines boots theory of socioeconomic unfairness is one of the best economic theories ever written IMHO.

Don’t have specific links, sorry. The info has appeared in various public consultations on welfare reform, and more recently, those for the white paper published this year entitled ‘transforming support’. A number of changes to disability benefits were announced in this, including a new UC ‘health payment’ which can be claimed by PIP claimants.

I can't find much about this online.

Do we know when/if this is actually going ahead? All I can see is that it will be mentioned in the Autumn budget.

I've only found this on newspaper sites. I think there's some scaremongering going on. I'll believe it if / when it's announced.

Right. I've found a few newspaper articles all saying exactly (as in word for word) the same thing. So basically just one article disseminated over a few outlets.

Nothing else. Unless I'm just looking in the wrong place. 🤷‍♀️

I guess I'll wait for the Budget

My dh has psychosis amongst a whole load of other mental health issues. Last time he had an attack, just before he got hospitalised, he was running around half dressed telling everyone the government was monitoring him all the time and he was going to be sent to prison (even though he hadn't done anything wrong). This checking of bank accounts, if it happens, is really going to send him over the edge again!

@CherryMyBrandy, thank you. I receive PIP and ESA, nightmare process. Before that I was on DLA and Incapacity Benefit. Remember Cameron’s 2011 Welfare Reform Act which tightened criteria for new PIP (that replaced DLA) and the new ESA (that replaced Incapacity Benefit) creating 2 groups (admittedly ESA began under Labour) which the Tories in 2017 cruelly then voted to reduce payment for one of the 2 groups. Now sounds like they are looking to tighten the screw further, so depressing. Following trajectory of US of offering threadbare state support for the sick and disabled.

We can only hope that there is some work going on behind the scenes by welfare/mental health charities about this.

I have a friend whose son has been experiencing mental health issues. His benefit money goes into her bank account. Will her account be checked too? Even though she is not on benefits herself.

@XenoBitch yes, I pray these changes punishing the sick and disabled don't go ahead. That's terrible if they want to check your friend's bank account, just how far will this go? It's as if they think people on benefits are second class citizens who don't deserve the same privacy as people not on benefits.