to think it's not appropriate for school trip to include a visit to a bullring?

[Merula]

Interested to hear your views. Our school have announced a trip to Madrid, which will include a visit to a bullring. Obviously it will not be while a bull fight is occurring, but there is a fee to visit the bullring, so in effect, by paying for my child to attend, we will be supporting bullfighting. A previous trip to Spain included a visit to a dolphinarium. Would you be ok with this or would you question the appropriateness with the school?

Aah, posted on the wrong forum. Have asked for it to be moved to AIBU.

I don’t think paying to visit a bullring is necessarily supporting bullfighting. I think it’s more like paying to visit a culturally and historically significant building that must cost thousands to maintain. It’s like you’d pay to visit the Colosseum in Rome but that doesn’t mean you condone gladiator fights and animal hunts. Like it or not, bullfighting has been (and sadly still is) a part of Spanish culture, and therefore should not necessarily be ignored on a cultural visit to the Spanish capital.

I see what you're saying, and it's true that I would pay to visit the Colosseum now, however, I wouldn't pay if they were still fighting to the death there today. I don't think it's quite the same.

It's not the same as the Colosseum.

OP, if you want to object go ahead.

The thing I always find interesting about bullring is that there's usually an emergency medical centre next to it - tells you a lot.

I think of they're going when there isn't a fight then it's more about the culture than anything else. You can always keep her home in protest

Not the same as the Colosseum at all, and I agree with you that it's inappropriate.

Yes, it will be about the 'culture', but it's not going to be a balanced portrayal is it? It will be glorified, because they're not going to be showing the prolonged cruelty of it at the bullring - they want to promote it. And yes, if this part of the trip is included, I will keep her from going, but I think it's a shame that the school think it is appropriate.

I would not be happy with this and would raise a concern.

I wouldn't want to visit either a bullring or a dolphinarium tbh. Both are very cruel.

I agree. I mentioned the dolphinarium to highlight that they've made questionable decisions with regards to school trips in the past.

I’d rather the bullring than the dolphinarium.

Bull fighting is a large part of Spanish culture. And every moment of the trip doesn’t need to be balanced, a “pro-bullfighting” trip then followed by a debate (which will almost certainly be part of any GCSE or A Level curriculum) is a good balance. I think ignoring it goes on is much worse than understanding and forming personal views.

The dolphinarium, however, is more insidious in its cruelty, has no deep cultural link, and when I was last involved in education was not actively debated in classrooms.

Bullfighting is a much smaller part of Spanish culture than it used to be.

Only 2% of the population actually attends bull fights.

So not only do I not think its appropriate for a school trip, it's actively misrepresenting the culture they are supposed to be learning about. And no doubt the bullring makes money from these school trips.

As for the dolphinarium, if it's too cruel to have in the UK, schools should not be taking kids to it abroad.

Under no circumstances would I endorse a visit to a bullring and I can’t believe that a school thinks this is appropriate. If they want the pupils to learn about bullfighting, this can be done through educational materials. A visit to the bullring, especially paying a fee to do so, is endorsing animal cruelty. Same with the dolphinarium visit.

Bullring are architecturally stunning. It's good for them to see everything. They don't have to agree with bull fighting and ot will raise interesting discussions for the students. (Which is probably one of the objectives )

A balanced approach to bullfighting would surely start with that it is only popular with a tiny and dwindling minority.

Or for a school trip doing something else that actually represents Spain.

I think if you're studying Spanish and visiting Spain as a student of the Spanish language and culture then a visit to a bullring is justified, because it is an important part of Spanish culture. You may not personally support bullfighting, but that doesn't diminish its importance to Spanish culture. I would question the need to ever visit a dolphinarium for any reason at all, but IMO visiting a bullring is different.

It will be glorified, because they're not going to be showing the prolonged cruelty of it at the bullring - they want to promote it

I think the young people will be able to form their own opinions and it may actually raise awareness.

No I wouldn't be happy about this at all. Can you enlist some other like minded parents and approach the school as a group to outline your objections and possibly suggest an alternative?
When I was 10 I went skiing with my primary school, (mid eighties), and one evening the 'planned activity' was a tour of the local abattoir! My parents thought I was joking when I got home and told them! 😂😂

I visited a bullring in Madrid with my secondary school in year 9.
It was extremely interesting and explored a lot of Spanish history.
The teachers and us pupils were not pro bull fighting but simply learning about this part of their culture.
It was part of a whole trip to Madrid that included visiting lots of the landmarks, including the football stadium.

Let your child go and discover their own thoughts and opinions without their parent controlling their thoughts and sabotaging their experiences.
They’re old enough to question the humanity behind it and no doubt it will be discussed with their peers and teachers.

No I wouldn’t support this at all. And ‘culture’ is often code for ‘doing shitty things that you can’t call them out on for because it’s their ‘culture’.

Why not let them visit it and see what goes on.

Thay can debate it.

You can’t cover their eyes forever.

I've lived in a country where there is bullfighting for nearly fifty years and, alongside the vast majority of the population oppose it and have never felt the need to visit a bullring

I absolutely wouldn’t pay and I’m sure enough kids and their parents would agree that bullfighting is a barbaric custom that a contingent of kids could do an alternative activity whilst this is going on.

dolphin hunts are a part of Faroese culture and I wouldn’t expect to support that either

It must be Las Ventas. It is actually a very impressive historical building. And I say that as a Spaniard who hasn´t attended a bullfight in her 49 years on planet Earth. I visited the Ronda 18th century bullring and found it really fascinating. Few people attend actual bullfights and they take place at certain times during the year only, like the San Isidro fair. Bullfighting was a very important cultural expression and had important influence on the arts at one time and it is still important for the countryside and rural life in certain areas of the country. It will die a natural death once there aren´t enough ticket buyers to sustain them. Right now most bullrings are used for shows and concerts. I remember the last survey I read in Spain as for and against was 49 against-51 for. It is best to let them make up their own opinion, and chill out.

It's not about 'controlling my daughter's thoughts'- she's quite free to make up her own mind. It's about paying money to a business that tortures thousands of animals every year for fun!