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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

The world has tried men in charge and look what they have done

140 replies

Eaglemom · 02/11/2023 23:06

AIBU... if the world was run by women it would not be in this fucking mess. Children’s and women’s lives would be worth more than land or grievances. Young men would not be groomed for war and aggression. What the hell are men doing to this earth?

OP posts:
RonObvious · 03/11/2023 11:32

Some of the most bloodthirsty and violent rulers in history were female - I don't think it's the sex of the people in power that are the problem. I tend to agree with Douglas Adams: "It is a well-known fact that those people who must want to rule people are, ipso facto, those least suited to do it... anyone who is capable of getting themselves made President should on no account be allowed to do the job."

stormteacupandcake · 03/11/2023 11:33

HAHAHA

You only have to read threads on MN, going from the most inoffensive "shoes on/ shoes off", "answering the door/ not answering the door" to the threads about "the other woman" or "school cliques"

and see how nasty, bitter, rude, racists these posters can get and fight so strongly over absolutely nothing. (allegedly mainly women, I haven't personally checked).

Start a thread about MENZ and see how aggressive and unfair women can get too.

People are people, good or bad, the sex and gender is rather irrelevant.

The whole concept of the "sisterhood and being kind" is non-sense.

User135644 · 03/11/2023 11:35

Thatcher's legacy has destroyed Britain.

User135644 · 03/11/2023 11:38

gegs73 · 02/11/2023 23:18

SoupDragon I tend to agree. Men have made a huge mess of it, but I do think if the boot was on the other foot women would end up doing much the same. Has anyone read ‘The Power’?

Truss destroyed the economy in a month on a power trip.

Naunet · 03/11/2023 12:05

BigFatLiar · 03/11/2023 09:32

I think it's delusional to think it would be any different.
It's greed and power that run the world and women are subject to it the same as men.

I think it’s misogynistic to label women as ‘just as bad’ when they’ve never even had a chance.

aswarmofmidges · 03/11/2023 12:07

But is truss representative of all women or is she a women living up to being as manly as the men ?

If the only women chosen to be admitted to those top roles are ones chosen by men as nice and safe and just like them then of course she won't make any better choices

Naunet · 03/11/2023 12:15

ntmdino · 03/11/2023 11:25

Bingo.

And, on top of that, artificially drawing the line according to gender completely ignores the fact that the kind of person who wants to be in charge is usually exactly the kind of person who shouldn't be.

It's nothing to do with gender; it's the fact that having a group of people (any people) in charge automatically creates "haves" and "have nots". The "haves" always want more (which creates international conflict), and the "have nots" always resent the "haves" (which creates national conflict).

And, obviously, it's not like things were any better when we in the UK had female PMs. One created greater inequality than the country's ever seen, the next presided over Brexit (and got nowhere), and the last caused a cost of living crisis that's ruined the majority of the population.

The problem isn't gender, it's ideology and the type of person who feels they should be at the top.

Edited

Nothing to do with gender? Well no, it’s to do with sex, and if you look to our closest cousins in chimps, sex does make a huge difference. Chimps are led by a male, they’re violent and dramatic societies, compared to bonobos which are female dominated and much calmer. Seeing as we have never had a world run by women, you can’t possibly know what it would look like.

ToWhitToWhoo · 03/11/2023 12:23

I think that in general people who WANT to be in charge should be automatically disqualified. At present, these are more likely to be men.

But no, women are not automatically more reasonable. Have people so soon forgotten Liz Truss? And Suella Braverman would be worse.

There is a significant chance that a woman will be the next president of France- and we'd better just hope that this particular woman, LePen, won't be!

User135644 · 03/11/2023 12:23

aswarmofmidges · 03/11/2023 12:07

But is truss representative of all women or is she a women living up to being as manly as the men ?

If the only women chosen to be admitted to those top roles are ones chosen by men as nice and safe and just like them then of course she won't make any better choices

It's predominantly certain personality traits that seek and get great power and wealth.

Being nice, all for equality and a pacifist only gets you so far. Ask Corbyn.

Plenty of women voted Boris. A majority of white women voted Trump over Hilary Clinton.

ToWhitToWhoo · 03/11/2023 12:24

RonObvious · 03/11/2023 11:32

Some of the most bloodthirsty and violent rulers in history were female - I don't think it's the sex of the people in power that are the problem. I tend to agree with Douglas Adams: "It is a well-known fact that those people who must want to rule people are, ipso facto, those least suited to do it... anyone who is capable of getting themselves made President should on no account be allowed to do the job."

I agree!

CHIRIBAYA · 03/11/2023 12:24

I would rather have functional, emotionally and psychologically mature, well-rounded individuals with morals and integrity as leaders; these attributes are not determined by gender.

MrsSkylerWhite · 03/11/2023 12:26

Thatcher, Palin, Braverman, Truss, Dorries, Patel, Keeghan. Could go on and on.

It’s not men that are the issue, it’s politicians. Anyone who believes they should be in charge of a nation shouldn’t be allowed anywhere near the top jobs.

ruby1957 · 03/11/2023 12:26

DysonSphere · 02/11/2023 23:27

No basis for this belief. As for more respect for women and children, I don't believe that either, I've had female bosses be incredibly prejudicial and inflexible as regards my maternity rights. I've never had the same problems under a man. We've seen Nicola Sturgeon supporting male rapists in female prisons. We've seen Teresa May assert she'd happily push a nuclear button if she had to. We've seen the introduction of super brothels with an associated increase in under-age sex trafficking in Germany whilst Angela Merkel was PM.

It just doesn't work that way. You don't necessarily get better government if the person in charge is a woman, anymore than you do if the person is a different ethnicity etc. People are people.

I fact, my personal view is most women in power tend to bend over backwards trying to be manly i and are liable to overplay their hands in order to prove themselves.

Queen Elizabeth the 1st might be an exception.

Absolutely this. Anyone male or female can be a person with power and get it wrong.

BlueEyedPeanut · 03/11/2023 12:48

Surely it depends on the woman/women. Women aren't all one homogenous group of kindness and kittens. There isn't anything fundamentally "better" about women. Women are just as capable of cruelty and stupidity as men. What we need is better individuals in charge. Their genitals don't matter.

Cornettoninja · 03/11/2023 13:08

Naunet · 03/11/2023 12:15

Nothing to do with gender? Well no, it’s to do with sex, and if you look to our closest cousins in chimps, sex does make a huge difference. Chimps are led by a male, they’re violent and dramatic societies, compared to bonobos which are female dominated and much calmer. Seeing as we have never had a world run by women, you can’t possibly know what it would look like.

Chimps and bonobos aren’t even the same species for a start. There are loads of species of animals that don’t display violent territorial behaviours it doesn’t mean that those traits are automatically relevant or comparable.

Voteva · 03/11/2023 14:10

Males are far more violent than females. Look at the crime statistics, look at any species, look at human history in every country on earth. Go to any primary school and look at the playground behaviour differences between boys and girls.

Yes girls can be unkind, but they very rarely beat each other up or stab each other (and on the rare occasions they do, the aggressive girl has always been the victim of male violence, ask anyone involved with the social services).

Men only run the world because they bully women away from power.

And look at the state it’s in. 🔥 🔥 🔥

obje · 03/11/2023 14:11

Yeah.....cos Nicola sturgeon was a great example 🙄

stormteacupandcake · 03/11/2023 14:19

Would the world be very different if women had been in charge?
Certainly.

Would it be BETTER?
Doubt it.

Maybe we should keep raising your daughters teaching them that their sex/ gender don't matter and the West at least is not a "man's world"?

coxesorangepippin · 03/11/2023 14:22

Men will never step back

Why would they

They have all the power

No one willing gives up power

notatthisage · 03/11/2023 14:26

User135644 · 03/11/2023 11:38

Truss destroyed the economy in a month on a power trip.

I don’t think it was a power trip. It was the delusional arrogance of a personality type who refuses to listen to opposing views. She had always been like that, apparently.

When you have poor candidates for political leadership, someone like that can get to the top.

And we perhaps have poor candidates, in part, due to the toxic narrative we have created around politicians and the abuse heaped on them. We are pretty much self selecting for ideologues, fanatics and rich boys who view politics as a hobby to fill time.

JaxiiTaxii · 03/11/2023 14:30

I haven't RTFT...
But it's frustrating when people leap in to use current 'powerful females' to say women are as shit at power as men. No, these examples are women who have risen in a male world and emulated masculine traits to gain power.

These women are still operating in a completely male sphere but with a female body. That's not what a female world would look like.

Zoom out & try to imagine a world run by women, formed around women - just like our world now is formed around men. Childbirth would be factored into working lives - maybe recognised as paid labour. Would we even work 9-5 or use money, would it be more socialist/ communist? Women's health issues would be more widely researched and better understood, working lives would maybe be more about making sure everyone's fed than endlessly making money. Men would definitely not be pandered to like children - but would women?
Buildings would be made for shorter people, I suspect women would not be self-curfewed after dark or travel & dress curtailed by fear of rape, if women were the dominant sex.
But absolutely no doubt there would be bad stuff too. Would it be the spiteful bullies that ruled the school through humiliation & isolation be in charge? Would those be our punishments and what would female crime look like?

Nobody knows because it's so hard to imagine there could be a true alternative to the patriarchal world men created over millennia.
It's almost impossible not to just overlay women into the roles men created now.

Acornsoup · 03/11/2023 14:42

SocksAndTheCity · 02/11/2023 23:34

Yeah, we definitely need the likes of Truss/Braverman/Patel in the chair. Jesus wept.

I give you Boris, Trump, Sadam Hussain, Idi Amin, Vlad the impaler, Kim Jong, Pol Pot, Mao Zedong, Osama Bin Laden, Stalin and Hitler to name a few. Your list is not really compatible, but your misogyny is in full show.

Begsthequestion · 03/11/2023 14:42

I've often wondered about this. Men are the dominant sex because they have had the monopoly on violence - unless women are armed. So it seems like patriarchy was inevitable in a world that developed by distributing power according to brute strength.

Women's physical strengths are different - higher pain tolerance, less prone to infections from birth, the ability to grow and deliver the next generation etc.

If hypothetically women did end up in charge, I don't think we'd be resolving issues using violence in the same way men do. Winning a war would not be the way we decide how to distribute resources, like we do now.

People who point to Maggie Thatcher/other individual politicians as an example of how a matriarchy might function or fail are not really going deep enough into the issue, imo, perhaps deliberately.

Because in fact it's a pretty useless example, because by hypothesising about women in charge we are envisioning an entirely different society altogether - not just looking at how one individual might behave in the society we already have, and judging the alternative based on that one person.

stormteacupandcake · 03/11/2023 15:19

Imagine the world being transformed into one of the satyrical sorority seen in various movies or series 😂

Cornettoninja · 03/11/2023 15:24

Men only run the world because they bully women away from power

undeniable. But those bullying, aggressive traits would still exist in men if women ran the show.

Unless we’re talking about a scenario where men don’t exist at all which has its own, very obvious failings, those traits would still need to be subdued or managed. There would still be an impact on civilisation.

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