Lying on school application

[strikemehigh]

School mum friend told me yesterday that she's used her NC DM's address for her child's high school application.

Her DM lives in a different county (the one I live in) and friend lives just over the border into a different county. Both our DC are at primary school in her county but obviously I'm applying to my county for high school place.

We are quite rural. Her fake address is middle of nowhere and her real one the same but miles away. Hence the distances to schools.

Anyway, this would be bad enough but she's put 2 schools that as the crow flies from the fake address her child is unlikely to get into. First choice school A, the furthest please given based on distance last year was 3.3 miles and address is about 5. Second choice school B is almost ten miles from fake address and already oversubscribed. DC has no other factors such as EHCP which might help.

She has not put a third choice so 'they'll have to give me one of the choices'. When I explained that isn't how it works child will likely be allocated school C which is the nearer fake address she said she would just appeal.

AIBU that this is short sighted and bonkers? Also fraud - which if she wasn't so unlikely to get her way based on the choices I'd be thinking of reporting.

I would feel annoyed. I'd appeal.
And then I'd get over it and get on with my life and that experience wouldn't then make me consider reporting a friend for lying on this way because this is a petty thing and I don't think you should be reporting friends for petty crimes.

HNRTFT but as the Mother of a child who was directly effected by other parent’s lying I feel very strongly about the liars and frauds!
My daughter passed 11+ and she was not offered the school that she and we expected her to go to because we were 500 metres out of catchment area !!
This had never in the history of that Grammar school ever happened.
To cut a very long story short we appealed,she still didn’t get in , we then got evidence of the kids that did get in whose parents had lied.
We went to ombudsman and we won .
The stress and absolute f…ing fury I felt in the process ,was absolutely bloody hideous . Daughter had to first start at the school offered ,which was very disruptive to her mental health and it also meant that the girls that got in because of their lying parents had to leave. So a lot of young girls were effected by the lies of their parents !

You’d get over it and move on?

Nah, not when it comes to my children and something as critical as their education

@Universalsnail .It is not petty ,I speak as a Mother whose child was directly effected by lying ,fraudulent parents !

Who's address did you use though? Are they aware you've done that?

My daughter passed 11+ and she was not offered the school that she and we expected her to go to because we were 500 metres out of catchment area !! Z.
This had never in the history of that Grammar school ever happened.

Half a kilometre (in urban areas… that’s a very substantial distance) outside the designated catchment area ie only if undersubscribed would it take children from outside the catchment, which never happens with grammar schools, well - it was a bit daft to put that school as one of your choices!

A school place obtained by fraud can be revoked. Some councils have a link so you can anonymously grass people up for school address fraud. Here's Haringey's message

If you suspect someone intends to use, or has used, a false address to obtain a school place, please click the red button below to let us know by completing the e-form. All submissions will be investigated.

You can submit this form anonymously, and any details you do submit will be kept confidential.

The local authority will almost definitely check her address on council tax records, see it doesn't match, and ask for proof of address before allocating her a space at either of the schools if they're oversubscribed (even if she has higher priority than children living closer).
On what ground does she think she'll appeal? 😂

I have heard of few people who did this one for her first choice the child had just started school and then her place was revoked. I believe one of the other parents dobbed her in as. She was given a school miles away with a really bad rap. She was furious

The other that lied got found out earlier in the process and didn't get any of her choices. She's been on the wait list and still trying to appeal.

Don't worry op karmas a bitch.

My DD was not offered a place at our local school. We were 3rd on waiting list on allocation day, 8 metres outside furthest distance offered. We then went down to 12th on the list after the first round waiting list places were offered. I was totally fuming as I knew one person who had put a parent's address and figured there were probably 2 other frauds in the cohort of 300, that caused me months and months of stress. Because we didn't get in on the first round, and then got bumped down the list by every person changing their preference or new mover in who lived closer, we never did get offered a place off waiting list, despite being 3rd on offer day. She got a place via appeal at the end of May.

You would get over it.

You're not going to be crying in ten years time because your kid didn't get their first choice school place.

It was the local grammar school. You don’t know all the details but your comment is very rude .The one she was offered was 10 miles away.
It was the liars that put her out of the catchment area for the local one and eventually they had to find another school for their little princesses because they had lied . Far dafter of the lying parents thinking they would get away with it !!

Depends whether the school they went to was a dump and the school they missed out was superb

your chilled about your children’s education
I’m not

🤷‍♀️

It is a petty crime though in a scale of severity of crimes.

I have no doubt your experience was very stressful from what you have said about it above, but like your kid didn't have to go to a grammar school, and you took a risk applying for a school that you were not in catchment for. If the school was that important to you that it would cause you so much intense stress if she didn't get in why did you not move in catchment? It's always a risk applying to an out of catchment school

It’s fraud @Universalsnail

That isn’t as a “petty crime”

You are lying to a public body in order to obtain something that you are not entitled to.

Fraud is a spectrum crime with a huge variation in severity. This is not serious fraud.

Let her crack on with her crazy behaviour. I’d ignore and rethink whether someone deceitful and dumb was a good friend

This is like the fraud equivalent of shoplifting from Tescos. It's wrong but it's petty.

Depriving a child from what is rightfully their school place … for 6 years?

Yes I would argue it is serious.

Can you imagine your children having to attend a dump of a school known for not dealing effectively with bullying, for example, and you have to watch you child endure unrelenting bullying.

Or perhaps a school with a dire SEN department and your child has an SEN. But he school your child should be at and why you selected it - was because it had an outstanding Sen department

are you getting it now @Universalsnail ?

Head. Wall.

did you have a very positive school experience and your children to?

Grass 'em up I say.

We were not out of catchment area ,the liars were the reason she was pushed out! We livec1.5 miles from the school !

I would suggest you tell her that fraud and obtaining services by deception are criminal offences that could result in a prison sentence.

If then you are reasonably certain that such an application is going to be made, then I think you should report it. Better for it to be stopped before places are allocated than afterwards.

The points about the impacts on other children especially those with SEN are well made.

There really is such a thing as catchment - both the primary school and secondary school my children went to have catchment areas as does the secondary school I work in and the primary school I was a governor of.

Exactly how places are allocated depends on the schools admission policY but in general they go something like:

1. PP / EHCP students
2. Catchment siblings
3. Catchment by distance
4. non catchment by distance

Of course where places run out can vary significantly year to year and so will effect where in the admissions policy places are allocated to.

tbf… you said you were 500m out of the catchment area