To think my friend will lose her job

[MollyMindy]

Posting for advice as a close friend of mine is in a bind

She started a new job 2 months ago, a promotion, all good.

4 weeks ago her husband walked out, no kids, but she is devastated. Can't function at work, been doing the bare minimum, and what she is doing I gather is pretty poor quality.

Performance is now being monitored, informally for last few weeks, more support given etc. She thinks it is going to get more formal soon, so has got herself signed off for a month with stress.

She is under the impression that although she is on probation she now can't be touched, I think she is wrong but not sure what advice if any to give her.

In the UK an employee with less than two years service can be let go for absolutely any reason that isn’t related to a protected characteristic. Unless a person has been employed for two years they are in a very precarious position.

My relationship of 11 years broke down 3 months into a new job it knocked me for 6 my confidence went I doubted my ability and it was rough. I was open with my line manager he wasn’t particularly helpful but I weathered the storm with the help of therapy through the employee assistance program. It took me about a year to start feeling like my old self I still have dips but feel stronger. I think OPs mate will have to be open with her employers and hope for the best.

As someone who has always suffered with mental health problems this is what happened to me. I had just finished my probation and I went off sick with mental health issues. I sent in a sick note for a month. The second sick note they said they hadn’t received (via post) and therefore couldn't pay me sick pay. I then had a text from my immediate boss asking when I was likely to return to work. I asked him not to put pressure on me as this would exacerbate my condition.
The next step they sent me a formal letter asking me to attend a meeting where they could discuss my return to work and if there were anything they could do to assist me in my job to allow my return to be easier.
I said I wasn’t well enough to attend the meeting and this is how it went on. Eventually they were pushing for a return date and so I handed in my resignation rather than them letting me go.
From research at the time the company did follow the correct procedure.
i think your friend is required to keep them informed and give a possible date she expects to return. But if I remember correctly they can terminate her probation at any time if they have valid reasons.

Thanks everyone

She said her employer has asked if she is up to a chat about cause and what they can do to help and likely return date , they sent this by email, she has not replied as she is adamant when she talks to me that she has been advised that they cannot do anything whilst she is signed off.

I don't want to upset her so now just trying to be there and not advising on job anymore , she refuses to engage with them and will get another doc note if she can in 3 weeks

She's being very foolish. At a minimum, she needs to check her contract/employee handbook as it will most likely state how often she needs to contact them while off sick. She can't just disappear off the face of the earth and expect them to keep paying her.

She has been advised on another forum that if she is signed off with stress she is untouchable....and won't listen to any one disagreeing . She has been told employer cannot contact her etc

This is how small businesses struggle to survive. Is she seeking help ?
I've been through similar but kept going to work which helped keep my mind off the break-up.
If she's just sitting at home expecting to be paid for nothing, it's unfair on the business.

Hi, large business, I think she is just hoping to be paid as long as possible whilst signed off

I'm sorry but your friend is an idiot and I'm beginning to understand why her husband walked out.

I started a new job just as marriage was about to implode. The people I worked with were toxic. I hated every second. I was also fighting to save my marriage. It was hell. The hands down worst period of my life. I used to physically shake on the drive to work, knowing what a fucking horrible day it would be. I used to come home to more shit. But no one knew. I was the paragon of professionalism.

I didn't have any time off. I told no one. I toughed it out and 5 years later am in a very different place. I'm not special or a fucking martyr, I was just brought up to get on with stuff and that you need a job and to save your job at all costs.

One of the most common reasons to fail probation is excessive sick days. Studies suggest that around 50% of workers who were fired during probation had taken too much time off.

When you’re calling in sick, make sure you:-

1. Follow Company Policies on Sick LeaveIf your staff handbook advises you to call your line manager every day you are off, do so.

It’s advisable to follow sickness procedure to the letter. By doing this you’ll demonstrate your ability to stick to workplace procedures. If you are supposed to call in but instead drop your manager an email on the first day, and then don’t keep in touch it might reflect poorly. Following company procedures to the letter is important when you are trying to pass probation.

1. Communicate Clearly With Your ManagerYou are not obligated to provide detailed medical information about your reason for being off.

However, make sure you are not completely vague so you don’t give the impression your reason is not genuine. If your absence is for a very personal or embarrassing reason, you can always say you have a tummy bug. If you are able, do also let your manager know when you think you will return to work. Good communication will help your manager understand your sickness is authentic. Do be aware, however, that if you have repeated or excessive sick days that create concern around your ability to perform your role, you may be at risk of being fired.

She’s completely in the wrong. See the link I’ve posted.
If she’s not speaking to her managers according to company policy, she can be let go without notice.

Huge red flag here.

People who already know that they are going to be "ill" or "sick" in 4 weeks time have a serious issue and I'm sorry but companies cannot cope with people who really need to take a teaspoon of concrete and harden up.

Relationships end, life moves on, your friend doesn't even have kids to worry about. In effect, there is nothing to stop her getting back to work on Monday or she can flush her career down the pan along with her failed relationship.

HR director here. She won't fail her probation while off sick (with antrjong) as probation is around how you do the job and you can't do the job off sick. However she won't pass it either it will be extended for when she is bak. Also she will be subject to the absence policy and won't have employnent rights (apart from discrimination) as she hasn't been there for 2 years. Other posters saying around speaking openly and making sure they know she is committed etc is the right course. My husband of 13 years left me for another woman a year ago and for about 3 weeks I thought I'd never get over it. Fast forward a year later and I could not be happier. She will get through it but you are a good friend in making sure she doesn't drop everything. My job kept me sane.

She is just moving the date of being sacked as they will extend the probation. Presume she has checked how long they will pay sick pay for ! Will be slatted for this but she can't be that stressed if out most nights. She will also loose any support from collegues to have had couple of days off in first month failing at her job and now off sick again.

@Kbroughton also an HR director. It depends on the procedure and the objectives. Key objectives in probation are excellent attendance and punctuality. Both key indicators of performance.

She's an idiot and a piss taker and she deserves to be fired. I couldn't be friends with a waste of space like her.

Is she still getting paid?

She needs to put on her big girl pants and be an adult.

As someone with long term anxiety / depression people like her playing the mental health card infuriate me. The most time I’ve ever taken off for mental health (or any other health issues) is two weeks. Not saying that some people don’t have legitimate mental health issues, they do. Breaking up with your partner, wallowing in self pity and going to the pub every night to drown your sorrows doesn’t excuse you from turning up to work.

She's definitely taking the piss based on your last update. I wouldn't engage with it any longer.

Even if she keeps her job, she could find she is very unpopular when she returns. That in itself isn’t going to make her feel any better.

It's obvious that she is not stressed as she has already decided that she wants to get signed off again in 3 weeks time. Anyone genuinely off with stress wouldn't have a crystal ball to look ahead that far. She obviously is following (wrong) advice on some internet forum assuring her she cannot be fired as long as she is signed off with stress. The only reason to get signed off is to avoid facing the music. I hope she gets the sack sooner than later and it looks her ex partner had a lucky escape from your flakey friend.

If I was a HR officer/manager I’d be concerned at sick time being taken so much in a probation period and would probably extend the period but companies can get rid of you at any time.

I know of people who’ve been let go of during probation for various reasons including, they’re not a good fit. If she’s not been in work to complete training and induction then this will have to be done at some point and some companies have deadlines with these.

Thanks everyone

She genuinely is very stressed, and does need this job, she is renting and I don't think benefits would cover total rent now her partner has left, so that is stressing her even more

She is just burying he rhead in the sand I think as a way of coping and is not thinking clearly

She won't discuss work any more as she doesn't want to hear anything that goes against advice she is following , ie off with stress untouchable so there is nothing I can do now

Very similar situation here, though I was on a time limited 6 month contract. I also had to set myself up in a new house and deal with two very upset young children. I know I didn't do my best work at that time and at the very end told the (very difficult and slightly scary) manager as much and apologised. She said that I had done everything required of me and had no quibble with my work. If you're in a job a length of time you can expect some flex and loyalty, but in the OP's friends situation, I would expect none and she really should have just ploughed on as best she could. Her attitude is actually appalling, who does she think she is to be taking money and creating extra work for the people covering for her?

The assumption is being made by PPs that the friend is simply work-shy and not really suffering from stress. But it sounds like it’s out of character behaviour, as presumably she had a good work record prior to her marriage breaking down? She was after all able to obtain a promotion at a new organisation.

It sounds like she might be developing an over dependence on alcohol and is drowning her sorrows?