To think these are correct table manners or am I just a snob??

[Justintime3]

I was raised with strict table manners, yet I have never been sat at a table with anyone who has the same table manners I do! Are these over the top?

This is what I was taught

1. Do not eat until the person who cooked sits down (excused if the chef says you can start)
2. Do not eat until everyone has their food in a restaurant (excused if the person without their food says you can start)
3. Chew with your mouth closed and do not speak with your mouth full
4. Do not take calls or use your phone at the table. Excuse yourself if you need to
5. Put your knife and fork together at the front of your plate when you are finished
6. Offer the last serving of XYZ to the table before you take it
7. Thank the person who cooked and offer to clean up
8. Elbows off the table
9. Tear bread into small chunks to eat in a restaurant, don't bite off the whole roll

10. Use cutlery correctly

• index finger on top of your knife and fork
• spoons for soup and dessert only. Spoon the soup from the farthest side of the bowl
• load food onto the back of the fork with your knife. (No 'shovelling' as my mum called it)

My mum's always been really strict on it and is the type to point out people's bad table manners so I've always followed these to a T. Thoughts? Is this over the top and I'm a snob, or are these just normal to expect?

Because of how I've been raised I can't help but be put off when I see someone without these manners.

Just keen to see how others were raised!

YANBU, sounds like basic table manners to me.

Sadly DH was not brought up in the same way.🙄

It's normal table manners for some people and not for others.

People are different so try not to judge based on things that are mostly arbitrary.

Bit late @Seadragonusgiganticusmaximus

I can't visualise the index finger the top of cutlery thing. I use them in the manner that I feel comfortable.

I was brought up on all these too. Just basic table manners to me. In fact I can hear my grandma saying "All joints on the table are carved" as I'm reading this thread. 😆

Then I met DH who wasn't brought up the same way and he picked up a lot of stuff from me. I must admit it still makes me uncomfortable when his dad starts eating while his mum is still plating up. It means his dad finishes ahead of everyone else and then he gets up and disappears into the other room back to his paper or his telly. I find it rude and it makes me uncomfortable.

The position of the knife and fork on the plate is not just to indicate to people that you've either finished or are just paused. It's also to save the people clearing the table from the extra effort of moving the cutlery to where they need it to be. If both knife and fork are together they can be picked up easily by someone clearing. If they're just either side of the plate then it takes double the time to pick them up.

It irritates me no end when people don't put their knife and fork together to signify they've finished, especially when in a restaurant. How are the poor wait staff supposed to know when to clear?

But if you're cutting things with a knife and fork then there's an accepted and customary (not to mention easiest) way to do that, surely. Unless you're left-handed, I suppose?

@steppemum if someone didn't finish their plate of food I would think they didn't like it.

but that is because where you are from, that is what it would signify.
But in some places (I have lived in several countries) you always leave food on your plate and in the middle serving dishes, because it says that the host has fed you so well that you couldn't finish it.

The point is that these are not 'good' table manners, they are the manners in one culture context and given that we live in a mutlicultural country it is a little odd to think that everyone should do it the white british way.

I don’t care if I do the bread bun incorrect.
Also I take my own plate to the sink.

YANBU, these are basic table manners!

The reason soup is spooned from the back is to minimise the risk of spilling soup into your lap.

Like this https://www.dailymail.co.uk/femail/food/article-6410493/Youve-using-knife-fork-wrong.html

It gives you more control when cutting food. Holding the knife like a pen makes cutting things like steak more difficult.

Generally agree except no 5
knife/fork go across the plate.
and “no shovelling” is a British not universal phenomenon

however I certainly dispense with some of these at home!

Indeed. Typing very slowly this evening!

YANBU
This was as I was brought up too and I would have these expectations of others 😊

@WhateverMate
I guess saying,
Good bread,
Good meat,
Good God - let's eat!
would also be a no-no? 😁

It's not usually necessary to stipulate "White British" on this website, in Britain where 82% of the population are white.

It is bad manners to ignore the prevailing etiquette of your hosts if from (or you are in) a different culture. It's one of the things I don't like about visiting the US - all that cutting, then switching hands & eating with the fork only!

I was raised with rigid table manners and still apply them - I will, if relaxed, lean on the table a bit and sometimes talk before swallowing (courteous reply comes before continued chewing, but I'd never overfill my mouth). And I confess to hating the back of the fork thing: it's mad & illogical! I 'shovel' unless the situation seems to call for vigilant etiquette.

Most challenging regional etiquette thing I've encountered: cutting and peeling fruit with a knife & fork - South America. There's a logic to it, as hygiene may not be dependable and there's a big taboo on touching your food, but it's really hard if you haven't been practising since nursery.

Most fun thing: scooping food up with a flatbread - much of Asia & Africa.

I eat pizza with a knife and fork 😂

Mostly normal manners but I do admit I let some of these drop at times depending on the circumstances.

Some of these affect the people you’re dining with (no talking with mouth full) whereas others have a much lesser impact, placing cutlery together or correctly holding your knife… so I’d say that some other these are about manners (very important) and some are more etiquette (maybe less important, depending on your surroundings).

Fine dining, dressing up and following all these customs can be very enjoyable but, equally, so can a bit loud feast with people leaning in to serve themselves, sharing dishes, roaring with laughter and having a blast. So I wouldn’t constrain myself to all those rules if it’s not an appropriate time and place

i don't see why people who hold their knife one way should be looked down upon by people who hold it another way.
one thing i hate is diners or even waiters stacking used plates at the table.
i find this disgusting, whether done at home or in a cafe.
i came from a v humble background, and such a thing was never done at the table.

i mean while you are still sitting at the table, of course.
if you all get up and leave the table, and then someone comes and stacks the plates there, then it doesn't matter, as there is no one in situ to be disgusted by it.

It looks sloppy too.

I pity those who have to eat opposite some of the posters here.

Table manners exist so
you don’t gross out other people with your appearance.

No one’s at their most beautiful chewing like a bulldog.

Realistically, I think that the staff may not know about the cutlery placement either. Or perhaps they have enough customers who don't put their cutlery down in a way that means anything that they can't rely on it.

Either way, I find that I'm almost always asked if I'm finished, despite the placement of the cutlery. I went to a very posh wedding a few months ago, with very formal service, and they still asked if people were done.

Sorry didn't realise the op excluded me,should I just assume the posts on this forum aren't directed at me?

Anyway.

These aren't normal manners for me and not what I've been taught.

But would hope the white folk wouldn't think/ comment on my bad manners,the same way I wouldn't when they absolutely butcher and make a mess of their manners when they eat cuisine from my culture.

5 8 9 and 10 seem OTT and ridiculous to me. But all the rest yes, basic manners.

I was going to say exactly the same as this. 1-4, 6 & 7 are actual polite manners; the others are just arbitrary rules that some people prefer and thus like to presume that they must be right and therefore anybody doing anything different must be wrong; and not just 'wrong' but bizarrely somehow 'ill-mannered' as well.

Some of these arbitrary 'manners' seem to be deliberately designed in a way to shame people from other countries or cultures and put them in their (inferior) place and some of them are pure ableist.