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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

AIBU to say Taylor Swift is a once in a generation songwriter?

606 replies

HomeatRoseCottage · 27/10/2023 19:33

I’ve had 1989 TV on all day and she’s just magic 🥰

OP posts:
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Original poster
HomeatRoseCottage · 27/10/2023 20:44

Huhuhuhu · 27/10/2023 20:35

It's not the words alone it's the syntax and how they sound without music.
Taylor has 'poetic' words but they just don't fit like a poem. London Grammar's songs do. It's very obvious to me in the lyrics you've posted. The rhythm is off. I could go on but if you're a massive Swiftie there's no point in writing an essay, besides this is all a matter of opinion and you did post on AIBU.

You also didn't bother to check who actually wrote those lyrics - Nightcall is a cover, done on request so not written by LG. Way to prove your point - not. LOL.

Edited
Show quote history

There’s no need to be so snarky!

I actually thought Nightcall was one of their best songs, shame it’s not theirs! I do like LG though, they’re a decent band. I saw them in concert once years and years ago when they were still quite new.

I don’t get your point about how you have to read the lyrics without the music to get some idea of rhythm - they are musicians writing songs, the music is essential. Nessun Dorma doesn’t mean half as much without the music!

OP posts:
Huhuhuhu · 27/10/2023 20:44

EmmaEmerald · 27/10/2023 20:38

But the whole point is how they fit with the music. She isn't selling poetry.

Show quote history

No, they need to be lyrical too. That is how I define a good songwriter. Many can do both so I don't see why I need to change my definition.
But then again people listen to music in different ways. I can hear them together, and apart, even listening to the same piece of music. I am extremely detailed. I play and sing myself. I am also neurodiverse, maybe that has something to do with it.

Taylor probably doesn't care what I think of her 'greatness' though. Given that I listen to her a lot, and would probably have gotten a concert ticket if they hadn't been so expensive.

I like listening but I wouldn't consider her great, as an artist.

Bbq1 · 27/10/2023 20:45

She's massively overrated and not that talented. Aren't all of her songs about her break ups with various celebs?

BehemothWatermelon · 27/10/2023 20:46

100%
I don't like any other "pop" than her. She's a lyrical genius. If her lyrics were anonymised and sold as poetry they'd be lauded. She has a mastery of language which is absolutely beautiful.
Sadly, she always releases her "worst" songs (Shake It Off, Me) and often keeps the absolutely stunning ones for the album. Then people get put off!
Would've Could've Should've could be the best song she's ever written, it's jaw-droppingly real, raw, and heartbreaking!

CantFindTheBeat · 27/10/2023 20:46

This reply has been deleted

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@assignedmeowth

Wow - I've no idea of your ethnicity, but standard bland white girl?

What a hideous person you must be to think in these terms.

shockeditellyou · 27/10/2023 20:46

Isn’t she the poster child for nepo babies?

Huhuhuhu · 27/10/2023 20:46

Bbq1 · 27/10/2023 20:45

She's massively overrated and not that talented. Aren't all of her songs about her break ups with various celebs?

One other thing I admire about her is not giving a f* about what others think, boyfriend wise.
She has had many men, so what?
Male celebs sleep around and don't get as much shtick as taylor. At least she doesn't cheat on her partners. Yet, judged more harshly for being a woman.

ShowOfHands · 27/10/2023 20:46

She's not my cup of tea at all.

My favourite lyricist of the last 15yrs is Mike Rosenberg (Passenger) who is v talented but mainly known for one freak hit which doesn't reflect his other output.

Martinisarebetterdirty · 27/10/2023 20:47

I love her. Went to the Eras cinema show with my DDs, came out fan girling her myself. Anyone who can get a cinema full of teenagers up dancing and cheering each other on even though they don’t know each other is quite frankly a genius. She does a lot for her team, is seemingly good to her fans and calls out bullshit. Cracking role model and I knew far more of her songs than I thought I did. Loved it.

Karmaisagod · 27/10/2023 20:47

It is pointless to argue about these things. Although I firmly believe that Taylor is a genius and nothing will ever convince me otherwise, the deep joy her songs bring me is both undeniable and, ultimately, extremely personal, and I don't need to price a point or convince anyone else of her talent for the joy to continue to exist, unbridled, for hopefully many years to come. I know I'm not wrong about her, but if I was I couldn't care less.

Each to their own!

MassageForLife · 27/10/2023 20:47

Bbq1 · 27/10/2023 20:45

She's massively overrated and not that talented. Aren't all of her songs about her break ups with various celebs?

What, all 200+ of them? Unlikely...

HighlandCowbag · 27/10/2023 20:47

Dd is a massive fan and Ive had her as background noise for years. Then dd made a Taylor Playlist and said I should listen to it if I missed her. Well I did and she's fucking awesome. She's badass in the most recent albums and a proper pop princess early doors.

You have to listen to the lyrics. If ya don't want to that's fine. But as a 46 year old, who loves Pulp and James and Beautiful South I think she's awesome.

sollenwir · 27/10/2023 20:47

I'm glad you enjoy her music, and appreciate her writing skills.

Personally I cannot stand her music though.

Nowherenew · 27/10/2023 20:47

taylorswift1989 · 27/10/2023 20:39

Someone like Rihanna can’t sing or dance well but a lot of the songs she brings out are really good (I assume she doesn’t write them but I don’t know).

Lol. One of Rihanna's biggest hits was written by Taylor Swift.

And I'm sorry, it's just bullshit to think that Taylor Swift could become one of the biggest artists in the world with no talent. The world just doesn't work that way.

Yes lots of people write good songs (pharell williams) and I’m sure she has wrote some songs that are good.

I guess she doesn’t release them herself because her product is a certain image and that’s what she’s famous for.

But it’s not disingenuous to say that she isn’t talented when it comes to singing or dancing.

If she didn’t have rich parents who knew the industry and created her into a character, then she wouldn’t be famous.

She is excellent at what she does, don’t get me wrong.

She definitely has been created into a product aimed at young teen girls, with a ‘good girl’ personality, which is unlike other singers her age. And she has made millions off of this persona, which is very clever.
But it’s not real.

midnights0 · 27/10/2023 20:48

I agree !!!! Been a fan since I was 15 and I'm 27 now. The lyricism is honestly incredible.

CranfordScones · 27/10/2023 20:49

Honestly couldn't name a single song by her.

I keep hearing people make similar claims about her greatness. I don't doubt the validity of the claim, I'm just surprised that not a single TS song has seeped in to my consciousness or crossed my path, whereas plenty of other recent songs have.

sollenwir · 27/10/2023 20:49

Jk987 · 27/10/2023 20:02

Sounds like she's too young and beautiful for some of the mumsnet readers! She's a great artist and performer and I would love to see her live! I like Trouble best.

It's possible to just not enjoy her music, and have no strong feelings on how she looks.....

sleepismyhobby · 27/10/2023 20:50

I love her ! I saw the eras concert at Odeon as couldn't get tickets she was amazing . She's a great songwriter

Screamingabdabz · 27/10/2023 20:51

I agree op but it’s cool on MN to diminish her and right her off as some shallow pointless pop princess. Same way Dolly Parton was treated as a vacuous cheap blonde but who wrote amazing songs that people love and have stood the test of time. People can’t get their head out of their own pretentious arses to admit that Taylor Swift has that talent.

Original poster
HomeatRoseCottage · 27/10/2023 20:52

Bbq1 · 27/10/2023 20:45

She's massively overrated and not that talented. Aren't all of her songs about her break ups with various celebs?

This is just a misogynistic take, tbh. For one thing, a lot of artists song about love and relationships and don’t get criticised for it (especially if they’re male). Taylor seems to be viewed as some serially inappropriate dater when she’s had about 8 boyfriends in her 33 years and her last relationship lasted 6 years.

She has also written a lot of songs which have nothing to do with relationships:

welcome to New York - about moving to a new city when you’re young and hopeful

shake it off - about not taking criticism to heart

long live - about her fans

Marjorie - about her grandmother

mad woman - about the double standards women fact

epiphany - about the Second World War and the covid pandemic

the last great American dynasty - about the life of an oil heiress who owned her house

clean - about recovering from an eating disorder

anti-hero - about feeling like you’re never good enough and don’t fit in

never grow up - about being on the cusp of adulthood and facing change

soon you’ll get better - about her mother’s battle with cancer

I could go on!

OP posts:
WeeStyleIcon · 27/10/2023 20:53

I agree @HomeatRoseCottage she doesn't have a bad so.g. they"'re all good.
Off top of my head, maroon, lavender, exile, gold rush, delicate getaway, King of my heart, ❤️ her

Original poster
HomeatRoseCottage · 27/10/2023 20:53

CranfordScones · 27/10/2023 20:49

Honestly couldn't name a single song by her.

I keep hearing people make similar claims about her greatness. I don't doubt the validity of the claim, I'm just surprised that not a single TS song has seeped in to my consciousness or crossed my path, whereas plenty of other recent songs have.

This is genuinely surprising. Maybe you would recognise some if you were played them?

OP posts:
U2HasTheEdge · 27/10/2023 20:53

I think Taylor is amazing. So very talented. Ed Sheeran? He does not compare, IMO. I don't rate him as a song writer at all.

MelodiousThunk · 27/10/2023 20:53

Her lyrics are good but her actual songs are banal. We’ve heard the same I-V-vi-IV progression (or a minor variation there of) a million times. In the pop genre Billie Eilish (and her brother) do far more interesting stuff. Hell, Brittany was doing more musically interesting things over 2 decades ago.

She’s the female Ed Sheeran.

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