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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

In-laws should be more sensitive about 11+

105 replies

OnlyFrog · 21/10/2023 05:55

I’ll start by acknowledging this is definitely a first world problem.

So, back in their day my husband and his parents all passed the 11+ and went to grammar schools. All very bright and successful in their academic careers.

I did not pass the 11+, which was a painful blow for years, but I went to the local comprehensive, got As and A GCSEs, 4As and A level (no A *available back then), got a first in a science degree at Oxford, PhD, then did graduate medicine and now working as a doctor.

We currently live in a non-grammar school area but DH said we could consider moving over the county boundary to an area with grammar schools.

We were chatting about this with his parents who are pro moving and say there are lots of benefits to grammar schools. I said I didn’t want the kids to go through the 11+ as i think it does a lot of emotional harm if you don’t pass. MIL said the kids are bright so no reason why they shouldn’t pass!

I was annoyed by this as it seems to imply that not passing means you’re not bright.

DH thinks I’m being too sensitive to take it that way. I just felt insulated and annoyed that they can’t see the harm in selecting on a single test. I also don’t like the way they put down comprehensives as being for less bright kids. I am so grateful to my teachers for all their support.

AIBU to be pissed off and think they should be more sensitive?

OP posts:
Danascully2 · 21/10/2023 07:19

I think people who passed some time ago (or their children did) don't always have an accurate view of the 11+. We are in an 11+ area and I think grammar school would suit my child but I absolutely hate having to battle with him to do the work for it at home. Maybe if you can afford private primary it's a bit different as then at least they cover the topics they need in school before the exam. I am not a fan personally of the system even though I do think my child has a fair chance of passing.

RoyalImpatience · 21/10/2023 07:19

But we also have to remember our dc are not us and may feel differently to op

CurlewKate · 21/10/2023 07:24

Is it possible she didn't know/had forgotten that you didn't pass? Or it didn't cross her mind that,
considering your success, you might still mind.

However, it's obvious, not least from posters on here, that people don't understand that failing the 11+ can have a profound and long lasting impact. Which is one of the main reasons the vile, inequitable system needs to go.

shockeditellyou · 21/10/2023 07:26

As someone who sailed through the 11+ and thrived in a grammar school, I am very glad indeed we live in a comp area! Secondary transition is bad enough round here without the added pressure of performance based entry. I’d far rather move to the catchment of a large, well performing comprehensive.

HannahDefoesTrenchcoat · 21/10/2023 07:29

My 75 year old aunty was the only one of 5 siblings not to pass 11+. She still feels it now.

My dyslexic DH remembers results day like it was yesterday. His best friends at primary went to grammar and he went to comp. He hardky saw them again. He ran a very successful business and has retired first. He still feels a failure too.

ScaryHellscape · 21/10/2023 07:33

“You did well without it what difference does it make?”

It makes a massive difference. It’s not the destination, it’s the journey. One of my DC failed the 11+, got in to grammar on appeal and is predicted 3 As at A level. So destination tick.

Journey not so much. The impact of telling a child they aren’t good enough at age 10 shouldn’t be underestimated.

AmandasFleckerl · 21/10/2023 07:34

OnlyFrog · 21/10/2023 06:36

Thank you for the range of views.
it’s true this has touched a nerve. To answer one of the questions, my in-laws know full well that I did not pass and that it knocked my confidence for years.

Edited

Why are you focusing on one exam that you were presumably 11 when you took it? It’s not like you’re someone who has then gone onto academic failure. You were a young child, you’re now an extremely well educated woman. Focus on the things you have achieved rather than one failure. Not passing your 11+ was the making of you.

themothergoose · 21/10/2023 07:36

For someone who is a doctor who made into a very competitive course and university, then went on to do one of the most competitive courses to get into (graduate medicine) + has a PhD . . . you seem a bit soft OP. In the nicest way possible. So what if you didn't pass 11+, what bearing does that have on your career now?

People fail in medical school and have to retake exams. I am sure you have seen this. You get up and keep going. Are you still affected by not passing 11+ after everything you have achieved?

It sounds to me like you are projecting your fears onto your children. DD did well without tutoring. Start early - to remove the pressure / stress. Do a little everyday or every other day. Choose schools your child will most likely get into. Don't pick competitive and academically rigorous schools if your child isn't smart. I have seen a few children without places because parents have high expectations.

I would suggest moving house if you love the house and if it works school-wise. Don't move only for the school. What if your child doesn't get in?

themothergoose · 21/10/2023 07:37

AmandasFleckerl · 21/10/2023 07:34

Why are you focusing on one exam that you were presumably 11 when you took it? It’s not like you’re someone who has then gone onto academic failure. You were a young child, you’re now an extremely well educated woman. Focus on the things you have achieved rather than one failure. Not passing your 11+ was the making of you.

Show quote history

Exactly this!

ScaryHellscape · 21/10/2023 07:38

There’s a lot of ignorance on this thread from people that just don’t get it.

I wonder if any of them experienced such public failure & judgment at the age of 10?

MintJulia · 21/10/2023 07:38

It's clearly touched a nerve with you, but they aren't talking about you or the system 20 years ago.

The senior school system now is different, There are more problems, more behavioural difficulties and less funding. Your ILs are being pragmatic and suggesting what they believe to be the best route, that's all.

Rather than take sides, it would be far better to let your child do taster days at each possible school, see which they prefer and ask them if they want to try for the 11+.

Encourage but don't push.

Parakeetamol · 21/10/2023 07:41

We are in 11+ area and dd is year4 the competition is insane. Parents boasting about the hours of tutoring and coaching they're doing. We are tempted to move away so my dd gets a childhood!

CurlewKate · 21/10/2023 07:41

"Rather than take sides, it would be far better to let your child do taster days at each possible school, see which they prefer"
Good idea-but not something that could happen.

MintJulia · 21/10/2023 07:44

@CurlewKate Why not? That's what I did with ds, five years ago. Worked for us. Or is the system in London very different?

Edwardandtubbs · 21/10/2023 07:45

It sounds like a throwaway comment that was meant to be reassuring but was ill, if at all thought through.

I assume you are talking about moving to Kent? We have just moved out of Kent partly to save DD9 from the 11+. She would have either failed or we'd have withdrawn her, and the route for those who fail it is awful.

I worked with schools there and the non-grammars, with a few exceptions are hideous places. Children don't go on to do well there. So there's no way I would take the chance of the children failing the exam and ending up in a sink school.

I think moving into a grammar system county, for the schools, is absolutely bananas.

shockeditellyou · 21/10/2023 07:46

I love the idea that schools are just waiting for roll out taster days for kids. Round here they don’t even do school tours - it’s open evening or nothing.

And what do you do if your kid takes a shine to an amazing super selective grammar they have no hope of getting into?

AmandasFleckerl · 21/10/2023 07:48

ScaryHellscape · 21/10/2023 07:38

There’s a lot of ignorance on this thread from people that just don’t get it.

I wonder if any of them experienced such public failure & judgment at the age of 10?

It’s parents that create the judgment though. Like any exam we need to encourage our children to do their best but also let them know that there are other options if they don’t get the result they need. Too many parents put far too much pressure on their children.

Electrictache · 21/10/2023 07:49

There's two issues here. I think expecting people to remember and understand how you felt not passing an exam when you were 10/11 is a bit unreasonable. Especially as although it dented your confidence it clearly didn't impact your education.

I don't think you're wrong to prioritising your children's well-being over the pressure of the test though. Kids don't need to go to grammar to succeed and you're the proof of that.

SparklyStone · 21/10/2023 07:49

I failed my 11+ too. I’ve got a degree and a Masters now, like you I’ve never felt smart enough. I totally understand the damage it can do x

ScaryHellscape · 21/10/2023 07:50

AmandasFleckerl · 21/10/2023 07:48

It’s parents that create the judgment though. Like any exam we need to encourage our children to do their best but also let them know that there are other options if they don’t get the result they need. Too many parents put far too much pressure on their children.

Show quote history

It’s irrelevant where the judgment comes from - and in many ways it’s worse coming from adults that should know better.

A 10 year old knows what different looks mean - tilty head, pretend sad eyes etc.

Why risk subjecting a DC to that?

Shoxfordian · 21/10/2023 07:51

I failed my 11+, have a great career, a lovely life and I’m not dwelling on something that happened over 20 years ago- maybe try that

MintJulia · 21/10/2023 07:51

@shockeditellyou we must have been lucky. Ds did four taster days. I did four parents evenings. We both chose the same school.

Edwardandtubbs · 21/10/2023 07:52

AmandasFleckerl · 21/10/2023 07:48

It’s parents that create the judgment though. Like any exam we need to encourage our children to do their best but also let them know that there are other options if they don’t get the result they need. Too many parents put far too much pressure on their children.

Show quote history

There aren't other options though. Not good ones. You end up in a terrible school with horrible behaviour problems and the worst teachers in the country. Any 'normal' child just flounders. I was a governor at a school where they were absolutely delighted that ONE child in the entire sixth form cohort got ONE A at A level (and it was in drama). That was an outstanding year for them. There's a reason the 'worst school in the country' is in a grammar county.

The whole thing should be abolished. Sorry to hi-jack the thread OP! I'll retreat now.

SunshineAutumnday · 21/10/2023 07:55

I think it depends on the child and how they cope with exams. How they would repsond emotionally to failure if that happens.

This decision is yours and your children. Your ILs is just an opinion.

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