To want to understand and get something to be done about the school toilet issue.

[Rasell]

Until a couple of days ago I was blissfully unaware of the fact that lots of children are unable to go to the toilet all day at school on a daily basis, because lots of schools countrywide lock their toilets during lesson time and then are either too understaffed to open them or there are just too many children trying to use them, there's not enough time to eat and queue up for the toilet so these children are forced to hold it in all day, every day.
This seems to be because of appalling antisocial behaviour, destroying the facilities, bullying and worse but I'm not clear as to whether that's always the reason why.
I very much sympathise with schools having to deal with this and am horrified by the utter lack of values, respect, care, integrity and common decency that some people are raising their children to have. I don't know how to solve that problem but it definitely can't be blamed on schools or government, in my opinion; if you have children, raise them to be decent human beings. That's your job.
Denying children the right to use the toilet is unacceptable, though.
No-one can expect older children to just swan off at any given moment for a wee when they're busy doing a task in a lesson; if I need the loo while I'm busy at work I wait until I finish it then I go. However, if I've got my period and am leaking, or suddenly get a tummy ache or something, then I go immediately. Why should that be different at school? Why should they sit there in a pool of blood or desperately trying to hold their poo? How can they focus or work to their best ability?
This feels like pensioners having to choose between heating their homes or eating, or children coming to school without having breakfast and not being able to concentrate. We can't allow our children to have to choose whether they eat or go to the toilet, or sit in a classroom unable to follow the teacher because they're worried they're going to wet themselves. Boys weeing in bushes and girls holding it in all day...this is madness!!
The thread I was following was a mix of people's experiences from either side of the argument and rants. I really want to understand what's going on because I think we need to do something about it. I'm no-one and don't even have any children going through this but I'm so shocked by it that I want to get some facts and start a petition, I don't know, do something! Please help with useful information and comments. Thank you!

People seem to think that poor behaviour is created by draconian rules rather than considering that the draconian rules may have been brought in to address poor behaviour.

Any teacher who was a victim of the Paul Dix restorative justice fad will understand why the pendulum is swinging the other way.

Oops, couldn't see the whole photo...maybe I'm not ready to change the world! 😂🤦‍♀️

My DD won't drink anything before she goes to school and eats and drinks nothing all day so she doesn't have to go to the toilet at school. It's dreadful. She comes home hungry, thirsty and needing to use the loo. Nothing I say will change her approach.

@JustGotToKeepOnKeepingOn are the toilets locked or is it because the toilets are grim for whatever reason?

That comment may be addressed at me . I think it is probably a bit of both . However an over the top reaction brings another over the top. Reaction and eventually that bubble will burst .
And sometimes the adult in the room has to work out how to stop the viscous circle .

Because they signed up to be educators, not prison guards at Guantanamo Bay.

However an over the top reaction brings another over the top.

I think you’d need to ask teachers whether behaviour is better or worse since stricter policies were introduced.

My general impression is that behaviour is far better.

I can't wait for DD to finish secondary school. It really is getting out of control. Many of the children are incredibly badly behaved. They have no interest in learning, thrive on bullying other children and enjoy disrupting lessons. The stories I hear make me equally horrified and sad.

I really don't know where it's all going to end. The government has systematically underfunded the education sector for years. All the issues we're having now are the result.

But @MargotBamborough additional funding is required in schools, more help for young people, help for dysfunctional families, SEND funding, this is not down to teachers to sort

My children won't use the toilets at secondary school. The doors are always being vandalised. So now no doors. And they are full of kids smoking drugs/vaping. At one point one of the ceiling panels was removed to stash drugs. My friend works in a different local school and says its the same there. Teachers aren't allowed in the toilets and kids that want to misbehave know that so thats where they go. Its a disgrace.

I went to three different secondary schools during the 80s. The first was strict and ran properly. The headmaster took no crap and the place was great. Well behaved children and we were all happy and engaged.

The second amd third were ran by bleeding heart liberals and bullying was rife. As was smoking and vandalism etc. They were awful places and very little learning was achieved.

Trust me, kids need discipline. It does them good. They need to know their place otherwise chaos ensues as it is now.

@crumblingschools the toilets aren't locked but children are not allowed to go to the toilet during lesson time unless they have a pass.

The problem is that children skive off lessons and hide in the toilets, so it's really not a good idea to go to the toilet during lesson time. Children are likely to be bullied/assaulted. Teachers are patrolling toilets to prevent bullying and vandalism but they can't be everywhere.

@flufferknutter

"French schools can still punish children who step out of line?"

Is this a question or a statement?

1 - ask whether school can install vaping detectors in toilets
2 - ask whether there are other toilets she can use now. Almost certainly there are. Explain the problem to the school. They might say yes without you going to the GP. Remember that migraine is a disability and the best thing you can do to prevent them is to avoid the trigger (dehyration) https://www.nationalmigrainecentre.org.uk/understanding-migraine/factsheets-and-resources/migraine-information-for-schools/
School should listen.
3 - if school don't listen, go to GP but explain the above and you need their help.

@Rasell i would start smaller and be armed with data.
start local, gather up the details as to the schools, number of students, the number of toilets, and which ones are locked when. i would contact the heads and ask if it's an issue (mh vs behavior) then petition the mp for either mh or security support in that group of schools. once successful on a small scale (and really i would start with 1-2 schools) i would take it bigger, by that i mean letter writing at a higher level involving more people higher up.
i honestly don't see vague "need more money" petitions going anywhere.

@JustGotToKeepOnKeepingOn this highlights the problem that keeping toilets open doesn’t mean children will have free access as such

A question. I'm led to believe that there is discipline in French schools, but I don't have first hand experience or knowledge.

It's utterly inhumane and one of the reasons I got out of teaching. I will not tell children that they can't go to the toilet.

@greenspaces4peace You'd be better at this than me!
Parents whose children go to these schools would be best...

have a quiet word with school and find out if there are some quiet ones she can use somewhere. There must be

just a different approach. a generic request isn’t bad. it’s a good start.
i’m outside of the uk, my concerns are for my grandchildren who go to school there. currently living very inner city, very deprived area but attend private for now.
a private primary with no locked bathrooms, and family allowed in the building for pick up/assemblies etc.

At DS’ private school children from preschool are encouraged to tell the teacher they’re going to the toilet (not ask for permission) and there are smaller blocks of toilets (2-3)near every classroom rather than one massive one. No antisocial behaviour. I know one of the cleaners who says the students leave them very clean. I think in some schools having huge blocks of toilets can encourage them to be used in the wrong ways.

I’m sure it’s been said many times but just wanted to add my two pence that girls only being able to use one or two pads or tampons in the school day is awful. Smelly for pads and dangerous for tampons, not to mention leaky.

Going to the toilet is a basic human right and it isn’t normal to hold it all day. Being dehydrated enough to do that or holding in your poo must be incredibly uncomfortable

😂🤣😂 Oh, the secret toilet?!

This whole thread and you think a nice, quiet toilet can be conjured up for this one poster's kid?

You're sweet, but fucking nuts 😂🤣🤣🤣

You do realise that there is often at least one toilet that is separate for those who are disabled, with different needs or need a unisex toilet, don't you?

It's not going to help the main thread, agreed, But for those pupils (e.g, two named above) who are withholding fluid during the day, this is a solution that their parents could consider?