A woman is a woman

[EmotionSickness]

For those who have been following the Tory conference and general themes of their speeches…

How do you feel about Sunak’s speech?

I know there has been a lot of discussion on here from those who didn’t want to vote for a party that didn’t know the definition of a woman.

Rishi has stated clearly that “a woman is a woman and a man is a man.” While I’d argue that still isn’t a definition, per se, he is appeasing this way of thinking.

So I’m just wondering. Is this enough for you to vote Tory at the next election?

"The reason women have lost many safe spaces is down to spending cuts, my hospital has had to put women in mens wards and vice versa due to not enough staff."

Do spending cuts explain all the trans training in hospitals? The rainbow badges and lanyards? The policies which tell nurses that they must assure women in hospital that a ward has only women when they can see a man (who says he's a woman) in the bed opposite?

Do spending cuts explain all the trans training in hospitals? The rainbow badges and lanyards?

They seem to have plenty of public money to piss up the wall on these initiatives.

Sueveneers

Its far, far more than that. It's not about 'gender', it's about sex. Its about men in women and girls restrooms, change rooms, taking their sports spots. If you you don't see how very serious this is, you're not paying attention”

Shall ask again, how many trans women are there in the UK?

Aged nearly 60, I’ve seen 3 in my whole life. Walking along the street/waiting on a train platform and working in The Range (I’ve possibly seen more without knowing but let’s be honest, most transwomen are probably pretty obvious if you take more than a passing glance, the 3 I’ve seen were).

Never encountered a transwoman in any of the places you mention. Wouldn’t bother me if I did, because they all have cubicles and I imagine those people would just be getting on with their lives, trying on clothes/swimming, whatever, like me.

There are far, far more pressing economic, housing, transport, education, disability and health issues negatively affecting millions of people, many single women parents, every single day. Maybe you’ve not been paying attention because you’re fixated on this one issue that most people don’t much think/care about?

Sunak probably never gave it a moment’s thought until he the script he was given, that was written to try to garner a few more, desperate votes after Braverman took care of the racist, homophobic and misogynistic constituent in her speech. Hunt targeted the sick and disabled last week so it was just the transphobic electorate left to address.

Nothing could induce me to vote for these vile people. Shame on anyone who does. I’m terrified to think of the state of our nation in 5 years if they get in again. Not us, personally, we’ll be fine, probably prosper in fact. Millions will be ground into the dirt though.

Anyone voting purely on this pretty minor, over-emotive issue will have a lot to answer for and will probably live to regret it as they look around and see what they’ve contributed to. Once the election is done and dusted, do they really believe that a Conservative government would care about it one iota?

Legally redefining one half of the population from adult human female to adult human female and men wirh lady feelings without their consent doesn’t seem like a minor issue to me

and again, it’s not about trans people, it’s about women! If theyre such a teeny minority how is it our entire language, law and social contract is being redefined to accommodate them while women’s concerns like eg the right to have intimate care from another woman ir the right to a rape support group without men in it are hand waved away as of no importance?

how are TW concerns so vast and important that everything must be changed to accommodate them even though they’re a weeny minority but women’s are tiny & insignificant even though they’re 50% of the population?

And for avoidance of doubt, I’m still not going to vote conservative

@MrsSkylerWhite - absolutely. To believe that this is an issue which is less immediately important than the other priorities you mention is a reasonable viewpoint shared seemingly by the majority of the electorate.

It doesn't make those of us who think this TRAs or TRA allies either.

@ilovesooty

“It doesn't make those of us who think this TRAs or TRA allies either.”

Quite. I completely agree that a woman is a woman, a man is a man and you can’t just change sex. This time, though, there are far more important problems to be dealt with.

In the loo at a bar nr King’s Cross last week there was an over 6f TW. It was intimidating - I’d feel similarly if I was alone in a non loo space tbf.
At work we have a TW who soeaks up frequently about not feeling safe at work. It’s baffling - the rights of TW where I work is really prominent. They sometimes say they don’t feel safe when in small meetings which is quite bizarre.

Intimidating in what way? What was he doing that made you feel threatened?

Recently returned from a trip to Germany, Holland and Belgium where most of the loos were unisex (as they’ve been in France for decades). Can honestly say I’ve never given it much thought. Certainly never felt intimidated.

It's cosplay.

these were ladies loos - unisex loos are quite differently set up imo.

Intimidating-hard ti describe, I guess unexpected, late, quiet. I’d also not use a unisex loo in the same situation.

They were all just large rooms with cubicles and sinks. No “set-up”.

It's cosplay

This.

It’s perfectly valid for me to say I felt uncomfortable. I’m not sure why you’re trying to dismiss that.

Exactly.

And the Tories don't care about women. Or men particularly unless they're rich ones.

They don't care about the NHS and the women that are the overwhelming majority of workers, usually the least paid ones.

They don't care about working Mums who are disadvantaged by childcare costs. Or single parents who are overwhelmingly women.

They don't care about carers, the overwhelming amount of whom are women.

They don't care about a CSA system where it's far too easy for men to opt out of paying for their children.

I don't think men who identify as women are women or should be in female prisons.

I'm not going to vote Tory to stick it to TRAs and think I'm a feminist because of it.

Anyone who thinks the Tories suddenly give a shit about the issue are fools. They don't. They're desperate and know that putting this out there will win votes by misguided GC women who think they care. They really don't, and that would be clear the second they won another GC. It'll go to beyond the bottom of the list.

It's a political move and potential vote-winner that's all. People have really short memories since they've already forgotten the "350 million we send the EU could be spent on the NHS" idea which was a lie on many levels but also an easy vote winner.

Funnily enough, the NHS seems to be in a shittier position than ever before. Which Brexit has directly CONTRIBUTED to.

There's a TW where I work who usually dresses really feminine, much more so than me but then occasionally comes in dressed masculine. At over 6ft 2, you can tell it is a man even when dressed feminine but when they come in as normal man-mode and head straight for the women's toilets, it is strange and unnerving. It's a bloke in our space, peeing like an horse in the next cubicle.

I cant explain it. I cant explain how silenced I feel and how I get into trouble if I dare say anything.

No, he's just jumping on the right-wing anti-trans bandwagon to try to claw back some votes from people frothing at the mouth over a fraction of a percentage of the population.

Absolutely this. 💯

PomRuns · Today 13:17
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It’s perfectly valid for me to say I felt uncomfortable. I’m not sure why you’re trying to dismiss that”

It is and Im not! How? I’m trying to understand exactly why you felt intimidated by someone who wasn’t saying or doing anything to you, simply using a facility. I don’t understand and would like your perspective because then I might.

Telling you that unisex loos in Europe aren’t a special set up, just a straightforward public facility for all to use and that I’ve never felt intimidated in one is simply factual, it dismissive.

Intimidating in what way? What was he doing that made you feel threatened?

Recently returned from a trip to Germany, Holland and Belgium where most of the loos were unisex (as they’ve been in France for decades). Can honestly say I’ve never given it much thought. Certainly never felt intimidated.

I've travelled in France and never used a unisex loo there, so clearly they aren't all mixed sex.

I live in France and can confirm that loos are mainly single sex.

It is dismissive. She said she feels uncomfortable using mixed sex toilets. It can be intimidating, especially when you're the only woman. It's not for you to pass judgement on her feelings.

Why should a tiny fraction of the population be allowed to have such a negative effect on over half the population then?

I've never travelled in Germany, Holland and Belgium and I'm not particularly interested in whether they do things differently. Many women in the U.K. so not like mixed sex toilets. The end.

HettyWainty · Today 13:17
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Exactly.
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And the Tories don't care about women. Or men particularly unless they're rich ones.
**
They don't care about the NHS and the women that are the overwhelming majority of workers, usually the least paid ones.
**
They don't care about working Mums who are disadvantaged by childcare costs. Or single parents who are overwhelmingly women.
**
They don't care about carers, the overwhelming amount of whom are women.
**
They don't care about a CSA system where it's far too easy for men to opt out of paying for their children.
**
I don't think men who identify as women are women or should be in female prisons.
**
I'm not going to vote Tory to stick it to TRAs and think I'm a feminist because of it.
**
Anyone who thinks the Tories suddenly give a shit about the issue are fools. They don't. They're desperate and know that putting this out there will win votes by misguided GC women who think they care. They really don't, and that would be clear the second they won another GC. It'll go to beyond the bottom of the list.
**
It's a political move and potential vote-winner that's all. People have really short memories since they've already forgotten the "350 million we send the EU could be spent on the NHS" idea which was a lie on many levels but also an easy vote winner.
**
Funnily enough, the NHS seems to be in a shittier position than ever before. Which Brexit has directly CONTRIBUTED “

👏👏👏👏👏

So sad that so many otherwise clearly intelligent women on this thread are being taken in by such transparent politics because they’re fixated on this one issue that in reality is neither here nor there to most women.