It's a neighbours and driveway dispute one. Who IBU

[Whatthematter]

Name changed as the the diagram required is very outing. No idea if my neighbours post on mumsnet, but if they do, hello!

4 houses all bought at the same time. The dotted yellow area was agreeed on purchase to be shared between the 4 houses. This is marked on land registry and the land is split between the 4. There's the right agreements in place for access to the yellow bit only. Fairly common in these kind of sets ups. It was explained when purchased any changes to this land would have to be agreed by all parties and costs etc. Shared equally. It was also explained that access must be maintained.

The yellow bit is gravel. The gravel wasn't well installed by the builders and as gravel does, it spreads a bit. Its also larger gravel not pea shingle type gravel. So a little more annoying generally.

When they moved in all the houses discussed potentially swapping the gravel to block paving. Nothing was formally agreed, but there was a consensus it may look better. But no one wanted to do anything until the rest of the development was complete. There was also some concerns about cost and finances as several parties explained they didn't have the money to hand.

So now to the Who IBU question.

Houses 2, 3 and 4 are now wanting to get the blocked paving done. They've been getting quotes. However house 1 are saying they no longer want to do the driveway with blocked paving.

The reasons cited are

1. They had to replace a bathroom in their 3 year old house recently due to a water leak and resulting damaging. Costing they say £8k. The builders would not cover this or any of the resulting damage and the LABC cover would also not cover despite it being due to i stallation error. Houses 2, 3 and 4 have thankfully not had these issues. Although they apparently have some savings using them would mean they were left with very little as a contingency. Which with cost of living and job insecurity they're worried about.

2. They have now decided they prefer gravel. Their driveway is 'blind' coming out so prefer the gravel as they can hear. They also have a young child so gravel is a good warning of car. Other parts of the development with blocked paving encourage high speeds from residents and delivery drivers, which they're concerned about. They also prefer gravel as it improves security.

3. The driveway doesn't impact them hugely visually. They have tarmac to the front of their house. They struggle to see the benefit in spending potentially £6-7k on something that offers minimal benefit. They cite if they had that money spare they'd rather spend this on things they've not done in their home that would benefit them more.

4. They have concerns about maintaince. The parking driveways for houses at the moment is block paved and has constant weeds. No one really maintains their own that well. They have concerns about long term maintaince of it.

They agree the current gravel isn't ideal. As an alterntive to blocked paving they have suggested getting quotes for laying pea shingle and a proper base. Which would cost less. They have also offered to put some gravel of the current kind and rake it out which they believe would improve the look. Houses 2, 3 and 4 are against this as gravel is too dusty and noisy.

So Who is being unreasonable?

YANBU = Houses 2, 3 and 4 are right. It needs block paving and house 1 should suck it up and find the cash.

YABU = House 1 is right. Their reasons are valid and houses 2, 3 and 4 should be more open to the alternatives.

Or other. Let me know.

I'm still in the House 1 camp is a really bad driver, but I'm with the no is a complete sentence camp.

Everything aside 2,3 and 4 are being arseholes so even if they did get it done
maintenance will be a nightmare to deal with and number 1 will be in the same situation time and time again

What number are you? 2,3 or 4? 😂

I prefer gravel areas too, there is a nice crunch if anyone comes along. My parents are finding their block paving takes a bit to maintain, looks weedy quickly, water collects, need to pressure wash and weed killer often, which isn’t great, they, and their neighbour are saying they wish they hadn’t got it, whereas the gravel has a much more natural look. So it’s very much personal taste.

This is our concern. The newer part of the development had block paving last year. Houses 2 3 and 4 loved it. A year on, it looks awful weeds everywhere. Give it another year may as well just be grass.

As someone who has a block paved driveway which we now hate I'd be against doing a large area in it! The ants love it - they've caused a couple of bricks to subside and the weeds love it more. I spend hours every week weeding the drive, treating with extra strong weedkiller as well as hand weeding. It's relentless. Our neighbours have oil stains all over theirs too - caused by a tradesman with a leaky van - a professional cleaning company havent haven’t even been able to get rid of the stains . We are hoping to replace the drive next year with something else, possibly resin!

We’ve got a shared gravel driveway that we absolutely hate. When we moved in we asked our neighbours what they thought about having it block paved but they said they can’t afford it so that was it. There’s no hard feelings. We can afford to do the whole thing but we’re not. It can stay as it is for now.

Your neighbours are being utterly ridiculous.

I think the paving would look far better and I get why the other three houses would want it . I also probably think the other three houses don't believe your 'new' reasons for not wanting it after previously agreeing provisionally and probably think you are hoping that they will cover the complete cost. Have you don't them you won't agree even if they pay for it?
Of course you are within your rights not to agree but I'd hate to have frosty relationships with all my nearest neighbours but it sounds like ye don't get on anyway so that's probably not a consideration.

Suck it up and find the cash? Really OP? You have no idea of their true financial situation nor should you be dictating what they spend their money on.

This is the situation with these kinds of things, the status quo remains unless all agree to change it. Don’t be so entitled to think you and your neighbours have a right to overrule one very valid view. Frankly even if it wasn’t valid you still wouldn’t be able to override it.

There must be alternatives that are cheaper and better for drainage than block paving. Who wants their street to look like a dull town centre.

How about those grids you can drive over but grass grows through?

You could need planing permission for this sort of area of pavers. Have you had quotes for gravel stabilisation mats? They may work out cheaper than block paving (I don't know). They have the advantage of being self draining so no excess runoff which is bad for the drainage system, no pooling of water if paving has dips over time, no potential flooding in heavy rain. They would stop the gravel spreading and probably reduce noise.

@Alphabet1spaghetti2 "Are any services beneath this roadway? (Water, cable, gas etc). Which type of road surface would be easier to relay if it needs excavation? Which would be less likely to be damaged by a removals van / builders van /skip company etc in the future ? ..."

We have 24hr access over a concrete drive, but our private parking space is gravel over a membrane. Recently the area's gas suppliers were doing loads of digging up of roads for maintenance. For a time our drive became a construction site because they wanted to replace our and neighbour's gas pipes and had to excavate. The shared drive now has two repaired stretches that stick out like a sore thumb, but our gravel drive looks just the same as it did before. After living here for over 20 years there's never been any noticeable damage to our parking space, but the shared drive has been redone once (shared costs) and definately looks like it needs doing again.

Are you always this rude and dismissive of people or do you just save it for strangers on the internet? There’s no such thing as a “non reason” if house one doesn’t want to pay out then house one doesn’t pay out it’s absolutely tough shit and that is life. Nothing obstructive about it. People need to stop feeling obliged to pander to the wants of other people and pushy people need to learn to fuck off and stop guilt tripping and manipulating people for their own end. It’s up to individuals what they’d like to spend their money on. I certainly wouldn’t be spending 6K to replace some gravel and no one would be calling me a “NIMBY” and questioning where I’d spent my money in my house. That’s absolutely nobody else’s business. How unbelievably rude of you. OP The people who want to change it can pay for it, and those who don’t won’t. If people want something badly enough in life they will pay for it. If they don’t want to pay for it then they don’t want it badly enough. If the ones who want it can’t afford it between them then that’s the end of that isn’t it really? There isn’t sod all anyone can do about it.

No we don't get on. We were okay with each other until recently. But we've never really been their kind of people. They're more 'we own a big house look at us' cheese and wine party types we're more, my daughter wears clothes off vinted and we just enjoy simple things in life, folk. I don't need a swimming pool in my garden, a personalised registration or an audi to feel happy in life. I mean each to their own. I don't care how they or others spent their money or time. But we're on slightly different wave lengths innlife and that's fine.

The gravel was described as looking like a 'farm yard' by them. I get the feeling part of the problem is gravel isn't 'posh' enough for them. I don't know if after the initial time it would look better. See many comments above re maintaince and regret. They've offered no alternatives at all.

It doesn't matter what the 'best' option is. House 1 aren't prepared to pay and don't particularly want changes therefore yhe status quo remains.

2,3&4 have cash but no class.

Gravel drives are very posh! Block paving is not. It looks dull and suburban. We are about to upgrade our gravel drive as we have already has some gravel paths done and it looks beautiful. I also agree that it is also good for hearing if vehicles are approaching. We can't see our drive from our house but we can always tell if someone is walking or driving up it. Stick to your guns OP. I am team gravel.

If house 1 can't afford it surely that's the end of the matter? You could agree to review in say 18 months time.

Really hope that house 1 isn't giving loads of reasons to the other houses about why they can't afford it. It's nobody else's business.

You may find that you need planning permission to convert the gravel to block paving. There’s a certain maximum area that you’re allowed to pave without permission, I believe it’s something like six square metres. If the area is bigger than that you need planning permission. This is often why large areas have gravel in the first place, because they couldn’t get planning permission to pave it.

234
”Would you like to share the cost of changing the shared road surface outside our houses”

1
”No we wouldn’t we like it as is”

I suppose 234 could say
”if we pay for it would you like it”

but 1 could respond
“no I wouldn’t”

@Atticustheaardvark you owe your neighbour an apology.

I wouldn't be happy with block paving from the look,maintenance and weeding situation. Sounds like a difficult position to be in OP.

I have a block driveway too. We actually chose this and for 4 years it looked lovely. In year 6 I'm now having to weed it all the bloody time. And as a previous poster said, the ants bloody love it too. It's faded a lot (our fault for not dealing it I guess). No way would I get an actually drive that 4 cars share done with it!
My neighbours got that concrete done that they make impressions in? And dye? Looked lovely for 3 years but again has faded loads and now also has cracks.
Ultimately I've come to the conclusion that no driveway is excellent but I think resin is probably the best from what I've seen. Expensive though

I haven't RTFT but:

"It was explained when purchased any changes to this land would have to be agreed by all parties"

It's not agreed my all parties - where is the confusion?

who pays £7k for unnecessary building work??

House 234 do the blocks from the road after house 1 and everyone gets what they want?