It's a neighbours and driveway dispute one. Who IBU

[Whatthematter]

Name changed as the the diagram required is very outing. No idea if my neighbours post on mumsnet, but if they do, hello!

4 houses all bought at the same time. The dotted yellow area was agreeed on purchase to be shared between the 4 houses. This is marked on land registry and the land is split between the 4. There's the right agreements in place for access to the yellow bit only. Fairly common in these kind of sets ups. It was explained when purchased any changes to this land would have to be agreed by all parties and costs etc. Shared equally. It was also explained that access must be maintained.

The yellow bit is gravel. The gravel wasn't well installed by the builders and as gravel does, it spreads a bit. Its also larger gravel not pea shingle type gravel. So a little more annoying generally.

When they moved in all the houses discussed potentially swapping the gravel to block paving. Nothing was formally agreed, but there was a consensus it may look better. But no one wanted to do anything until the rest of the development was complete. There was also some concerns about cost and finances as several parties explained they didn't have the money to hand.

So now to the Who IBU question.

Houses 2, 3 and 4 are now wanting to get the blocked paving done. They've been getting quotes. However house 1 are saying they no longer want to do the driveway with blocked paving.

The reasons cited are

1. They had to replace a bathroom in their 3 year old house recently due to a water leak and resulting damaging. Costing they say £8k. The builders would not cover this or any of the resulting damage and the LABC cover would also not cover despite it being due to i stallation error. Houses 2, 3 and 4 have thankfully not had these issues. Although they apparently have some savings using them would mean they were left with very little as a contingency. Which with cost of living and job insecurity they're worried about.

2. They have now decided they prefer gravel. Their driveway is 'blind' coming out so prefer the gravel as they can hear. They also have a young child so gravel is a good warning of car. Other parts of the development with blocked paving encourage high speeds from residents and delivery drivers, which they're concerned about. They also prefer gravel as it improves security.

3. The driveway doesn't impact them hugely visually. They have tarmac to the front of their house. They struggle to see the benefit in spending potentially £6-7k on something that offers minimal benefit. They cite if they had that money spare they'd rather spend this on things they've not done in their home that would benefit them more.

4. They have concerns about maintaince. The parking driveways for houses at the moment is block paved and has constant weeds. No one really maintains their own that well. They have concerns about long term maintaince of it.

They agree the current gravel isn't ideal. As an alterntive to blocked paving they have suggested getting quotes for laying pea shingle and a proper base. Which would cost less. They have also offered to put some gravel of the current kind and rake it out which they believe would improve the look. Houses 2, 3 and 4 are against this as gravel is too dusty and noisy.

So Who is being unreasonable?

YANBU = Houses 2, 3 and 4 are right. It needs block paving and house 1 should suck it up and find the cash.

YABU = House 1 is right. Their reasons are valid and houses 2, 3 and 4 should be more open to the alternatives.

Or other. Let me know.

House 1 doesn't want houses 2, 3 and 4 to split the cost as it leaves them fearful for their every expenditure being scrutinised going forward. It also doesn't outweigh their other concerns.

If I was your neighbours I’d be pissed off with you, but if you don’t want it done and you’re able to insist it isn’t done, then don’t worry about it.

The wording of the agreement is the key. Because if I was houses 2, 3 &4 and I REALLY wanted it done, I’d think I was in the majority and might as well press ahead and pay for it.

Houses 2,3 and 4 have been quite hostile to house 1 for a while. Ignoring them, deliberately driving on their driveway to bate them.

House 1 cannot afford it without risking having no savings and with insecure jobs and the prospect of further children is a huge risk. House 1 did have money set aside for this as was aware it was wanted by the other houses. However this money went to fixing their bathroom and the subsequent water damage.

Houses 2,3 and 4's recent actions suggest that they would be likely to scruitise house 1's expenditure. They have been clear they don't like them. However no idea if they'd force it. As i know at one point they didnt have the money for the driveway either. So not sure they could afford a legal route.

Yes I am house 1.

I feel for house one. If it were me I'd rather spend my money on a holiday or couch or whatever. I can understand how youd be worried that if the other three split it they'd be raising an eye brow at every take away or delivery that arrived. "Couldn't afford the driveway but plenty of asos bags rocking up etc"

If house 1 can’t afford it or don’t want it then not much can be done. You can’t touch the bit on their deeds.

It's pretty much a moot point, to change it requires all parties to agree (and pay) and house 1 doesn't want to. The other 3 can't force them so they have to just accept it

Maybe get some information about gravel grids from reputable sources and see if that will help address neighbour's concerns.

I don't personally understand the dusty comment but have always had smaller gravel.
I get their noise comment on a shared road

Why would house one let their kids play outside on the gravel or block paving if there’s cars, bin lorries and delivery drivers driving around there, that’s a ridiculous statement!

We’ve been in a similar situation recently and couldn’t afford the work the neighbours wanted done.

We just shut it down with ‘we can’t afford it’. It’s none of their business what we choose to spend our money on.

For what it’s worth I think houses 2,3 and 4 are being spiteful and nasty. I wouldn’t do it for that reason alone. How dare they decide how house 1 should spend their money!

Look they already don’t like you so who cares. You don’t want to spend what little savings you still have left and that’s fair.

If they want to pay though I’d also let them too hell with worrying About them judging any spending. You also purchased your house knowing it was blind access so that’s a silly point.

Hate this whole house 1,2,3,4 to start with it was always clear to to see the house 1 would be the one posting as nobody else would know that much about house 1.

House 1 just has to say sorry I can't justify the expenditure

Ignore me. I apparently can't read the difference between 1 and 4 🤦
I also can't figure out how to delete the useless picture 😂

If gravel is a driving security measure they need to seriously rethink their driving license, otherwise if they can't afford it that's down to the other three to suck up or put up.

No because house 4 wants block paving.

No one is being unreasonable, but if House 1 don’t want it, whatever the reason, it’s the end of it isn’t it?

I'm in agreement with you OP and House 1. Although no one is wrong or right in their preferences, the wording of the terms is clear and House's 2-4 can't just go ahead without your contribution either. I have a gravel drive and agree with a lot of reasons you've cited. It's low maintenance and incredible for security or to know people or a car is approaching. I get that's its annoying for the other houses if that's what they want to do, but you can't force House 1 to pay for something they don't want doing, or don't have the funds for. Their retaliation is incredibly petty and I'm sorry you're in this situation.

Why didn’t you go through home insurance for
the leak?

It wasn't covered. Trust me we tried and appealed. But due to the cause it was in their small print as not being covered.

I didn't want to spend 8k for fun. Also tried LABC and sought legal advice.

And I can't see how house 1 drive is blind, they surely have the same as 2 and 3 in that they swing back toward 4 and go out.

Don't charging lines have extensions?

I actually agree with a lot of house 1's reasons.

I think it is a waste of money and the weeds will be a problem.

House 1 does not read enough MN

'That does not work for us' is the only phrase needed, no need to give details.

House 1 the green perimeter is fence the others are lawn.

It doesnt extend quite far enough. A proper charging point is on the list of we wish expenses. At the moment it charges from.a mains socket in the garage.

Added diagram to make clearer the visability. Or maybe its just a load of purple lines on the diagram...

I wanted to try 'no is a complete sentence'. But I was blindsided by a woman on my doorstep moaning about dust and noise and caught off guard.

None of this matters - if house 1 doesn’t want to do it (regardless of reasoning) it doesn’t get done, end of.

@Whatthematter Is this the only access to the houses? Are any services beneath this roadway? (Water, cable, gas etc). Which type of road surface would be easier to relay if it needs excavation? Which would be less likely to be damaged by a removals van / builders van /skip company etc in the future ? Which would be more tolerant of oil spills etc from vehicle? What about future maintenance is any schedule going to be drawn up? Would house 1 be prepared to take on any and all costs of maintenance over the next x years in exchange for not paying in now? Would any of these questions change the overall decision on what surface to go for?

i think both sides have very valid points. But if some one doesn’t have the money or refuses to pay. I don’t think there is much you can do other than split the cost between the remaining houses (and live with any resentment) if you still want to go ahead, or live with it as it is. Assuming you can all agree with that.