To try and dispel some rape myths since we're all talking about it ?

[bemorebernard]

I did some training with one of rape crisis most eminent psychologists.

There are 4 categories of rapist

1. sadistic rapist - the Fred west type , they get off on humiliation, terror , violence , they get salacious pleasure from causing pain . Very rare .

2. angry rapist - the frenzied attacker . Think the Yorkshire ripper . Most likely to come to police attention.

3. the opportunist rapist - they will use violence as a means to and end . But they don't get off on the violence , it's a way to get the sex they want .

4. now this is important so listen up
   The compensatory rapist. Never uses violence .the most complex and clever . The most difficult to investigate. THEY DO MOT SEE THEMSELVES AS RAPISTS. They utilise distorted thinking to justify their actions. "Women like it , when they say no they mean yes , men are t mind readers ," and after the rape they will normalise it . The fact there are often no consequences after will be justification to them. They may perpetrate many sex crimes and the cos will often say there isn't enough evidence. Only if they are reported 4 or 5 times will they statistically start to come to attention.

RAPE IS A RELATIVELY EASY. RIME TO GET AWAY WITH

Now think about it .

This happened to me . All those women saying none of my friends / relatives/ partners would do this , exactly how do you know if they don't see their actions as rape ?

I had a one night stand back in 2015 and what started consensual became something else. That guy left my flat the next day and will have carried on dating , maybe now in a full relationship or married . He tried to go from vaginal to anal sex without asking and pretending not to know what he'd done . It hurt me . I told him what he was doing and he laughed and said sorry .

He might never display that behaviour again. No one would think twice .
And he would deny and refute it if I'd reported it. A mistake he'd say no doubt .

My point is men in cat 4 do not see themselves as rapists so many many men have acted this way then justified it and shaken it off , never to surface again

I tried dating from mid 40s to 50 and the behaviour of men in that category was abhorrent. They clearly had no concept of consent or want that means .

There are many more rapists out there than women think . And until you're the victim , you wouldn't know .

Russell brand has refuted the claims of his accusers . He doesn't see himself as a rapist . He is the majority of men in cat 4 .

• excuse typos

Tbh, I think RB is something different.
Deliberately asking staff to fetch women he likes the look of seems a bit different to category 4

He was in a position to have a lot of sex from willing women . Unusual maybe , but not actually that different to any good looking successful promiscuous man .

Brand for me is definitely cat 4 . She wants it really..... how can she resist .....she's here so she wants it .....

His wife won't relate to that side of him at all . She may well have never seen that side of his nature . These men walk among us , they change , they settle down , they marry .

All those women saying none of my friends / relatives/ partners would do this , exactly how do you know if they don't see their actions as rape ?

Because a majority are innocent that's why and have been brought up to respect women and have some morals.

The legal definition of rape is when a person intentionally penetrates another's vagina, anus or mouth with a penis, without the other person's consent, so yes only men can rape.

But claiming all men do it because even if they do they will deny it to themselves or not understand they raped some one. Is just bollocks and taring an entire group of people with a broad brush. So no I DO know for a fact my husband, sons and father defiantly would not rape any one just because a dirty creep like RB has.

Yes there are a lot of dirty sleazy bastards out their but you are not helping by accusing every single one, get a grip.

I await the usual NAMAL bingo post to pop up now as predictable as clock work, if so bore off 😴

All those women saying none of my friends / relatives/ partners would do this , exactly how do you know if they don't see their actions as rape ?

Because most men do know what rape is, and don’t do it.

You’re generalising massively, perhaps understandably after what happened, but it’s not right to say all men are like this.

I'm quite shocked that an eminent psychologist specialising in sexual offences would be peddling such rubbish - sounds more like pop psychology than qualified opinion.

I'm sorry that this happened to you, but most men are not rapists, and sexual offences are far more complex (speaking from a psychological point of view) than you suggest. And "diagnosing" alleged perpetrators based on media reporting is bad science.

I was raped at 14..A man that was 26 at that time ,knocked on door as I was babysitting and asked for sugar...
He started kissing me as I pushed him away and we know then what happened..
I repeatedly said stop stop but he
didn't ,. I thought it was my fault because I let him in... My mother never lied about sex ,just don't let man touch you..
Well 9 months later I delivered my heart, my son ...So I live with that day for years ,but never so grateful..
We need to learn to talk to our kids that NO IS NO... and a guy can be the nice neighbor...
Don't expect our kids to know..
My life changed that day, now I know it wasn't my fault.but the man that did this is now in jail ..

Mamac
Greensboro nc

I think there are some misinterpretations of my post

I'm not saying g every man is a rapist

I'm saying all men have the ability to rape and of those there are a a category of rapists that do not and would never see themselves as rapists and you don't know know who they are

You don't believe the psychology or professional woman who gave this masterclass ? Yeah ok then . Seems there is a lot of denial out there .

I hope you didn’t pay for this ‘training’

Thanks for that information, OP. This is where I always have a problem with people who assert " It's never about the sex, it's always about the power they have over you". Obviously in most cases, it IS about the sex. Most women who talk about their experiences, are talking about a man coercing / forcing a woman to let them have sex . The sex is the prize they are after . Most men are not Fred West, but they can rape because the sex is driving them and they forget the woman's right to say NO.

You missed a category out op.
One of the major categories too.
Tut tut.

Yeah I think a few people have misinterpreted your post OP

I get what you're saying. Men who do commit rape are thankfully few and far between. But those men who do, the majority won't see themselves as rapists because of their internal dialogue.

I would usually see rape myths as those sorts of things that the rapist tells themselves such as-

"She was drinking so of course she consented"
"She had sex with me the week before, so the next time I was with her of course she didn't say no"
"She was dressed like she was up for it"
"I bought her dinner and she ate that, so of course she wanted sex"
Those sorts of things...

As has been said this is pop psychology, and you’re not helping yourself by your claim all men are rapists. Your style of writing doesn’t help either “listen up, this is important “ is condescending.

Yes I believe in psychology, but not pop psychology, Who gave this masterclass-name her. Has it occurred to you she might be wrong ? What evidence did she present to support her conclusion.

it is true all men have the capacity to rape, and all women have the capacity to make false allegations, or write nonsense on forums. or commit infanticide, so it’s a pointless comment.

Oh. Come ON. They don't 'forget' in the heat of their uncontrollable passion. That's a rape myth.
They DON'T CARE. That's where the exercise of power comes in. Men must have their desires satisfied and women are a means to an end. This applies in many areas and sex is just one.

@Notpooryet Yes agreed, also entitlement plays a big factor.

All women have the capacity for burglary and murder and apple fucking scrumping. They don’t do it because they are brought up to know the difference between right and wrong. If I see a diamond ring left on a bus, I’m not going to take it, no matter how much I would like to own it, even if no one would ever know, because I have a conscience, that ring belongs to someone and they would be hurting,
The majority of men would not rape for exactly those reasons. It is deeply prejudicial to suggest that every man is just waiting for a chance to get away with rape.

Maybe put a trigger warning on you title? This thread is going to be triggering for a lot of people.

As someone who works with men who often fit into the ‘fourth category’, these type of men really don’t always know what they’re doing is rape. They use coercive tactics to get the ‘yes’ and see it as a job well done and an indication of just how charming they are. It’s my job to get them to realise that a no that becomes a yes because of the man’s tactics is not a true ‘yes’ and would be rape. Most of them are open to this conversation.

This is NOT all men and I don’t think all men (apart from having the appendage) have the capability to rape. My DH for example, never uses coercive tactics. If I say no, that’s respected and the matter is closed. We’ve been together since I was 18 and he was 21 and he’s been like this the entire time. He had a few partners before me but I doubt very much that he changed drastically in the few years before we got together.

It’s got “rape” in the title, not sure how much more of a trigger warning you need.

Yes. All the men acting like spoilt babies have the capacity. Arrogant entitled men. Men who are hugely successful, men whose mums dote on them.

How can you read about all these inadequate, coercive, entitled husbands and partners on here and then assume that they suddenly become considerate and careful during sex?

It's weird to think men that steal, cheat, drive aggressively, and throw their weight around in other ways didn't do the same during sex.

Look at the porn they watch with little interest in the safety of the women involved.

How can anyone deny it?

That research in the states that showed that men will have sex with women if they want, whether she's enthusiastic and sober or not.

I think I get what you mean, when I watched Anatomy of a Scandal on Netflix I was thinking that the politician on trial probably didn't really think he'd raped anyone because in one instance they'd had a relationship and the other he was drunk & she'd been kissing him so he could excuse it in his mind

YANBU.
And I agree with you.

I just want to say that here:
All those women saying none of my friends / relatives/ partners would do this , exactly how do you know if they don't see their actions as rape

is where you made ’a mistake’ (you didn’t, you are 100% correct), but this is where you put MN’s back’s up.
And they came to defend men.
When talkimg about rapists, you have to keep it vague and they are strangers and monsters. You’re not allowed to point out that they are ’normal’ men, living among is, we know them.
We’re supposed to think and say they rapist are obvious creeps, single, every woman stays away.

This is why it’s so impossible to talk about this / hope for a change.

Most men hate women, don’t really care about consent.
No, most men absolutely do not respect women, that’s silly thing to say.
(And now I will be blamed: ”sorry you only know men like this, must be you, find better men, whatever non-sense)
If it wasn’t true, our world wouldn’t look like this.

I’m sorry what happened to you op.
I believe you. 💐