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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Trial by media circus

644 replies

Maatandosiris · 17/09/2023 09:42

The first thing to say is anyone who has committed rape absolutely needs to be brought to justice. The criminal
justice system needs to become more effective in protecting all victims of crime.

However, AIBU unreasonable to think that this weekends story about RB has been sinister for many other reasons, none of which are to do with RB.

Firstly the SM posts whipping people into a frenzy of some big reveal like some secret album release. Clues planted through various carefully placed posts, giving just enough detail to let people work things out (plus making people suggest other names) . It was an absolute circus, in the case of rape it turned accusations of serious crime into entertainment, no thought how anyone would be affected, whether ultimately guilty or innocent (maybe c4/The Times were trying to get new stories). Extremely bad taste at one end of the spectrum, devastating for innocent people at the other.

The ultimate agenda of both The Sunday Times and C4 is to make money. That’s it, neither is set up as the states arm of justice. There’s no inbuilt checks and balances. Yet somehow they are allowed to name an individual, accuse them of crimes (and effectively say they are guilty) without any of the safeguards and checks and balances of the criminal justice system applying.

People have lost all sense of justice. We have a man accused of something, an hour and a half of heavily hyped TV which holds some accusations but mainly a character assassination, The Sunday Times probably selling many more copies/getting many more subscribers with more of the sane one sided accusations.

Even on Mumsnet we have people already calling him a Rapist, people feeding into the frenzy of “he’s a creep”, “he’s a sex pest” etc etc. in other words, convicting him in their minds before this has gone anywhere near a court or jury.

How will this ever now be a fair trial? How will they find a jury who can 100% not have their views affected by this whole circus? If he is guilty will there ever be a safe conviction, how can we be confident that real justice has been done? What’s the risk of any conviction being overturned? This is not in the interests of either the alleged victim or the alleged perpetrator.

Questions are circulating all over SM as to the agendas at play. It’s fairly clear that the Sunday Times has been searching out victims. What were they saying to these people? What promises have been made?

if a crime has been committed this should be with the criminal justice system not Saturday night prime time TV with an associated heavy advertising campaign.

Im not sure whether RB is guilty or innocent, but that’s not what this post is about. AIBU to think that the way this witch hunt (which is what it is regardless of whether RB sinks or floats) is abhorrent and flies in the face of justice and that this has far wider and scarier implications for society than just this case. Who or what is next?

OP posts:
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MrsPepperp0t · 17/09/2023 09:46

It's not trial by media circus. It's the result of years of serious investigative journalism.

I find it interesting that this hand wringing never takes place over other types of media exposé eg corruption.

donquixotedelamancha · 17/09/2023 09:47

Much of what he's accused of (like Kevin Spacey and Harvey Weinstein) is not actually criminal or would be impossible to prove in court.

That doesn't mean it shouldn't be made public. Dispatches and the Times are reputable media outlets who have spent over 3 years investigating this.

It's entirely possible to accept he isn't a proven rapist while thinking he's an abuser who should not be given a public platform.

HRTQueen · 17/09/2023 09:54

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Maatandosiris · 17/09/2023 09:55

donquixotedelamancha · 17/09/2023 09:47

Much of what he's accused of (like Kevin Spacey and Harvey Weinstein) is not actually criminal or would be impossible to prove in court.

That doesn't mean it shouldn't be made public. Dispatches and the Times are reputable media outlets who have spent over 3 years investigating this.

It's entirely possible to accept he isn't a proven rapist while thinking he's an abuser who should not be given a public platform.

But people are now calling him a rapist without trial. Why do you think he’s an abuser? The heresay of a couple of people.

OP posts:
IClaudine · 17/09/2023 09:55

There’s no inbuilt checks and balances

Do you not think the stories have been through several rounds of legal scrutiny?

RB sent texts to two of the women he raped and assaulted apologising for what he did to them. Why did he do that if he did nothing wrong? The woman he raped went to a rape crisis centre at the time, so there is proof there too.

I will say though that the build up to the stories being released was unnecessary and a bit OTT.

IClaudine · 17/09/2023 09:57

I bet more women will come forward now, just as they did when Weinstein was first accused.

Mrsjayy · 17/09/2023 09:58

MrsPepperp0t · 17/09/2023 09:46

It's not trial by media circus. It's the result of years of serious investigative journalism.

I find it interesting that this hand wringing never takes place over other types of media exposé eg corruption.

This, RB sexually assaulted his "girl friends" they have come forward to expose him RB is/was a predator I'm glad he has been exposed but of course he explains it away with it being "consensual" relationships or let's not forget his sex addiction!

DoorStopper · 17/09/2023 09:59

They allegedly spent three years gathering evidence, but instead of presenting that evidence to the police, they decided to make a programme about it.
Then the audience snapped it up like half starved piranhas.

Maatandosiris · 17/09/2023 09:59

IClaudine · 17/09/2023 09:55

There’s no inbuilt checks and balances

Do you not think the stories have been through several rounds of legal scrutiny?

RB sent texts to two of the women he raped and assaulted apologising for what he did to them. Why did he do that if he did nothing wrong? The woman he raped went to a rape crisis centre at the time, so there is proof there too.

I will say though that the build up to the stories being released was unnecessary and a bit OTT.

Lawyers won’t necessarily say what is morally right or wrong, they will be looking at laws regarding the protection of the media outlets not whether RB is guilty )which they cannot do).

So why do you think there was such over the top build ups?

if no crime has taken place and it was just RB was coercive and obnoxious, why aren’t they investigating the numerous male bosses (poss including those at The Times and C4) who are similar

OP posts:
Puffypuffin · 17/09/2023 10:00

I believe them.

I really can't understand these disciples who slavishly follow every work Brand utters like he's some kind of prophet. That, in my opinion, is far more sinister.

OP you say that people have lost all sense of justice. Is it just famous people who should have justice or can the women involved not expect justice too? No one is untouchable, no matter how much they (and their followers) may believe they are.

Maatandosiris · 17/09/2023 10:00

Mrsjayy · 17/09/2023 09:58

This, RB sexually assaulted his "girl friends" they have come forward to expose him RB is/was a predator I'm glad he has been exposed but of course he explains it away with it being "consensual" relationships or let's not forget his sex addiction!

And has all this been through the criminal justice system?

OP posts:
BeauSignoles · 17/09/2023 10:00

“I find it interesting that this hand wringing never takes place over other types of media exposé eg corruption.“

so true.

PerfectPenquins · 17/09/2023 10:02

Innocent until proven guilty is so important. What's happening now is for no one's benefit other than the increased viewership for the Times and Channel 4.

If anonymous people made claims about you and everyone took them as truth without giving you a fair investigation by police or trial in which you can defend yourself, you would not find that fair and just.

BeauSignoles · 17/09/2023 10:02

“And has all this been through the criminal justice system?”

Do you seriously think the justice system works for victims of rape and abuse? Have you seen the conviction rates?

Southeastdweller · 17/09/2023 10:02

You’re yet another ignorant MNer who can’t be bothered to read the Sunday Times article about this. It’s been a joint three year investigation about this.

Also, do you really think you’re revealing something new about the ultimate aim of companies? Last time I checked, the Times publisher and the TV production company that made Dispatches and News Corporation weren’t charities. That doesn’t invalidate what they’ve uncovered.

BonnieLisbon · 17/09/2023 10:03

Do you think Jimmy Savile was innocent too? He wasn't found guilty in court.

IClaudine · 17/09/2023 10:03

DoorStopper · 17/09/2023 09:59

They allegedly spent three years gathering evidence, but instead of presenting that evidence to the police, they decided to make a programme about it.
Then the audience snapped it up like half starved piranhas.

How many times does it have to be explained to you people? Look up the stats about rape reporting and resulting charges and convictions. Look up how women who report rape by ordinary men, let alone rape by rich, lawyered up men, are treated.

Sausagenbacon · 17/09/2023 10:03

Thanks for posting this op. The utter hysteria on the rb thread on mn is proof of what you say.

Puffypuffin · 17/09/2023 10:03

DoorStopper · 17/09/2023 09:59

They allegedly spent three years gathering evidence, but instead of presenting that evidence to the police, they decided to make a programme about it.
Then the audience snapped it up like half starved piranhas.

You may believe him and think all these women are lying, others will disagree. I didn't watch the programme and have no intention of doing so, but I find Brand's followers to be a particularly aggressive bunch hanging on his every word. Just odd.

Jellycatspyjamas · 17/09/2023 10:04

And has all this been through the criminal justice system?

Given there’s a 2% conviction rate for rape I’m not sure going through the criminal justice system would bring any clarity to things. If the criminal justice system was fit for purpose more women would use it rather than going through the media.

N3philim · 17/09/2023 10:04

Totally agree, OP. I absolutely hate how investigations and trials have been replaced by social media frenzies. It’s wrong on so so many levels.
I think people are so busy “hating” that they don’t spare a thought on the fact that none of these allegations have been investigated yet.

IClaudine · 17/09/2023 10:06

Sausagenbacon · 17/09/2023 10:03

Thanks for posting this op. The utter hysteria on the rb thread on mn is proof of what you say.

Your word choice tell me a lot about you...

Mrsjayy · 17/09/2023 10:06

Maatandosiris · 17/09/2023 10:00

And has all this been through the criminal justice system?

You know women are rarely believed and especially when they are in a relationship with their abuser so I can see why they didn't or wouldn't go to the police maybe they will now. Enjoying rough sex isn't the same as forcing someone to have sex this is where RB seemed confused in his video that he released.

bellac11 · 17/09/2023 10:08

N3philim · 17/09/2023 10:04

Totally agree, OP. I absolutely hate how investigations and trials have been replaced by social media frenzies. It’s wrong on so so many levels.
I think people are so busy “hating” that they don’t spare a thought on the fact that none of these allegations have been investigated yet.

Totally agree. I said the same about Hew Edwards and the same about Schofield

AnImaginaryCat · 17/09/2023 10:09

Im not sure he will go through "trial by media circus'. Unless you consider people accusing him of being a rapist. Which is in fact what he's been accused of. Nor will people say anything they already haven't said about him - though those opinions will be more in the forefront

I'm quite sure the women will go though a trial by media circus. In the form of being ripped apart in the modern day witch hunt.

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