To think this friendship is finished?

[DaisyDuke111]

DH and I have very long standing friends. Over 20years of friendship.

Our children went to same primary school and we did lots of things together when they were young holidays, days out, camping etc.

We have all been through tough times over the years but class each other as extended family. The lady, let's call her J doesn't have siblings and would call me her sister.

As the DC got older we didn't meet up as much but always got together for special occasions and spoke regularly on the phone, especially if either one of us had a problem. She was my go to for advice and me her.

Last year I was having a particularly bad time. One of my family members was very ill and we came close to losing them a few times. Thankfully they improved, when they did I can only describe what I had as a nervous breakdown resulting in a long hospital stay.

J did text me and sent love and seemed really happy when I was discharged. I was always careful when we spoke so it wasn't all about me, enquiring on her and her family etc.

However, contact between us became bare minimum. A week after my discharge I had a car accident which resulted in having major surgery. When I was discharged from hospital after 3 weeks I text her why I hadn't been in contact and she messaged back to say how awful and hope you recover etc.

I never got a card, visit, or any offer of help.
All the time I was in hospital J never reached out to my DH or any of my DC.

Today was our wedding anniversary and she sent a card. My DH said how lovely but I can't help feeling really upset in her lack of concern or support. If it had happened to her I would have wanted to visit and help out.

Im so upset about this and due to my mental health problems I can't stop thinking about it. My family just say "forget it and she obviously isn't a true friend." But I can't help going over and over it and wondering what I have done wrong?

It's my birthday next month and if she sends a card I don't want to phone and say thank you. I feel that it's pretty laughable to send cards and just ignore someone who has been through so much.

Half of me wants to message her and ask why and what have I done? The other half says ignore and rise above it.

Wwyd and AIBU to feel like this?

Sorry for the length of the post

I agree, this is the issue - sometimes people think they have given as much as they have taken and it’s not the case at all.

My trauma dumping friend would listen to me talk about a late train or an annoying colleague and seemed to think because I’d droned on about that for a few minutes it was fair game for her to share heavy details Of trauma with with no warning for several years on the trot . She would say she loves how we support each other - she didn’t have a clue. It was a very unequal friendship for several years and it got progressively worse.

It’s likely here the friendship has been very one-sided and Op’s friend doesn’t have any further capacity. The problem is a lot of those demanding friends be there in need always do a vanishing act when that same friend tries to lean on them. And they probably don’t even realise.

Many posters piping up to say friends should always be there in difficult times are probably the type of people who drain those around them. Either that or or they’re martyrs who get some sort of ego boost /sense of identify from having people pour out their trouble to them all the time.

Of course I’ve been there for friends in hard times, and them for me but there are limits as I realise people have others to support, as well as their own lives and personal struggles.

I have had various mental health issues since I was a tween, as well as difficult life circumstances as an adult and may share bits with friends here and there but I’m mindful that they’re not my therapist and I don’t know what they are going through.

Friendship shouldn’t be solely based on how much someone can listen to your trauma.

I would downgrade rather than end the friendship. Expect less, contact less and see less.

Keep chat superficial.

" If it had happened to her I would have wanted to visit and help out"

I think this is the important line here. You're judging her and finding her wanting based on what you would do.

And everyone is an individual with different ways of doing things and dealing with things and what individuals think is very different.

Some people seem to think there's this unspoken social/friendship contract that everyone is aware of and agreed to and that isn't the case.

As we see time and time again on MN.

It doesn't mean anyone is a bad friend if they don't meet your expectations of what you would do as a friend.

When was the last time you sent her a card or gift, invited her out, rang up for a chat?

I withdrew from a good friend who was in an abusive relationship, knew she was but stayed and wanted me to continue to socialise with him, listen to her dramas and traumas and say the bare minimum, just 'be there for her' as she said. Fuck that! People do not have to bleed themselves dry in order to 'be there'. Everyone has their limits. And luckily, when she was no longer propped up by listening ears, she saw the light and left his sorry ass. We're great friends again.

She is your friend, speak to her. I'd be more concerned if i felt i couldnt speak openly and honestly to someone who i had been friends with for 20years.

Important point. Also agree with possible lack of emotional bandwidth. I have a lot less these days. Doesn't mean I don't like or care about my friends, but life is a lot.

J did text me and sent love and seemed really happy when I was discharged. I was always careful when we spoke so it wasn't all about me, enquiring on her and her family etc You may well have, I'm sure you did! But the truth is, when you have a lot going on, a lot of worries you're talking over with your friend, when it comes to their turn to talk they may simply not feel you have any resources left to give in return and so they clam up or say all is fine. That's ok, she was still there for you and still listening when you spoke. And possibly it took it's toll on her inner resources or possibly she is simply busy giving to herself, as you were in your recovery.

Op have you heard of vicarious trauma? It's where what you hear or see negatively affects you, you don't actually have to experience it to be negatively affected.

Surely after all the trauma you have suffered, would it be a good idea to arrange something really nice to look forward to and invite her along so that you can put the bad things behind you and focus on the positive?

I think you are cutting off your nose to spite your face if you have been really close friends until all this kicked off.

It is better for your mental health to acknowledge what has happened to you but try to see the future in terms of positivity instead of wallowing yourself in the misery of the past few months and wanting to blame and shame instead of taking the attitude of, wow, that was then,this is now, time to kickstart the good times again with her

I would (and did) feel the same as you. Those friends who walked away from me when I needed them most I refused to have in my life when things got better. This who distanced themselves (but didn't walk away completely) I kept that distance, I was politely friendly and saw them at social functions, kept them as acquaintances, but the "friendship" was gone. I don't need friends who won't support me when I need them the most.

All those saying that there may be reasons that they couldn't cope with what was going on in my life, well too fucking bad. It wasn't like I was leaning in them heavily. But an occasional listening ear or joining me for a cuppa to get away from everything really shouldn't have been that much of an ask.

The silver lining for me was finding that some casual friends were actually amazing and I became closer to them as a result.

I very much see your point. I’ve had a lot of really horrible things happen over the last four or five years, and have been surprised how many, what I thought were, really good friends completely dropped off the radar. I was very hurt and haven’t much picked up the friendships since. But it seems that most people on here agree that they’d not expect a friend to be there for them and it’s out of order to be upset, so perhaps I’m just not normal thinking friends are there for each other. I remember a “share this” type thing on Facebook recently berating friends that dropped people because they’d not contacted them - it also said those people might have things going on that people didn’t know about. I thought it was a bit nasty, but most people were applauding it. So perhaps I’m just not normal. Perhaps I over share. I try to keep myself to myself nowadays.

I honestly think the huge number of 'why do you expect anything more?' posts is due to it being on AIBU, @Honeyroar. It's so clear that people just wait to pounce on an OP and tell them how unreasonable they are, whatever the circumstances. YANBU and nor is the OP, imo.

But the OP hasn't at all suggested that their friend wouldn't be 'there for them'.

The OP didn't actually ask anything. The OP just had an expectation that the frend would do certain things based on what the OP would do. Which seemed to be around action, being sent cards or chocolates, offers of visits or some undefined practical 'help'

And that isn't necessarily universally known that that's what some people expect of friends. The OPs friend could very easily think they were giving the OP space to recover and their texts were enough and balancing caring and not being intrusive so that was the best thing they could do as a friend.

And the friend clearly cares enough to remember the OPs anniversary and send a card. So it's not like they don't care.

OP is judging a 20 year friendship on what she would do. And that isn't the same thing as what every friend should do or is aware of being expected to do.

it's not "pouncing" to have a different opinion from yours BluebellsForest.

Ultimately, you cannot expect other people to have the strength, the energy, the headspace to deal with your problem on top of their own.

Sometimes people need to walk away to protect their own mental health and not be drawn into full drama. It's a sad truth that everyone around you will have a sick relative or friend right now, or health scare themselves, and countless issues.

it's not "pouncing" to have a different opinion from yours BluebellsForest.

And I didn't suggest that it was, @DoubleTequilaSunrise. I was making a wider point about AIBU.

What a depressing thread.

My parent was sectioned when I was a child. Their siblings never visited when they were in hospital for months. At the time I judged them and felt they’d treated my parent and me awfully. However, looking back they did what they could do and others who could do more than them did and that was really helpful. However, I think now that if you want someone to accept you as you are then you need to accept them as they are. It sounds as though she hasn’t abandoned you completely and still wants to be your friend. You now know that she doesn’t offer what you would offer in a crisis situation. That may change how you feel about your friendship. No amount of wishing she is different will change her. Tackling her on it won’t change her either. You’ve had a very difficult time. All the best with everything.

Also just because she wasn’t able to provide the support you needed, doesn’t mean you didn’t need it. And it is is sad for you that you didn’t have the support you wanted.

I have a feeling that this friendship is over.
She wasn't supportive to you when you really needed her.
If there's no good reason for this, I can see why you can't forgive her.

Her husband says she has messaged you but got no response. You don't think she has. Maybe that message from her got lost in cyberspace. It does happen.

My honest opinion - contact her and say "Hi J, really sorry - hubby has said I have not responded to a message from you recently. Its been such a difficult time and my head is all over the place, I think I may have missed some messages, so how about a long awaited catch up over a bottle of wine when the men next go to football?"

Or however you would word it.

OP didn't say they needed it. They seemed to be very well supported by many.

OP said she expected more from their friend based on what OP would do in a similar situation .That's not the same as OP needed anything

In fact, OP seems to have not really needed anything from the friend. But is offered that it wasn’t forthcoming or offered

This, what I've inferred from op and other posters is that you'll only consider someone a friend if they do what you want, when you want, even if they may not know what it is you want. It also doesn't matter if they have anything going on for themselves, why should it as that's not about you?

I agree Op seems to be well supported. Unfortunately some people demand ALL hands on deck when they’re going through something.

I am single , live alone and don’t enjoy close relationships with my immediate family but my friend who kept trauma dumping had a live in partner/father to her kids, a decent relationship with her Dad and very close to two of her cousins and had an NHS therapist.

Its unfortunate that people who already have a very strong support network seem to think every friend needs to be part of holding them up, even if those friends don’t have as much of a support system as they do.

This many not apply to OP but generally speaking I’ve came across this a few times and it’s the height of selfishness.

A friend of mine use to borrow a lot if money from me, and I’d always say she didn’t have to pay it back and she never did which is fine. However, what eventually made me stop doing it was her pointless comments about how she would “treat” me if she came into money. It was really annoying because instead of dealing with the reality she was placing her genorisity in some sort of conditional fantasy future. She could have paid for a coffee or a meal once with the money she had now and showed her gratitude with what she actually had instead of meaningless comments about what she would do.

It’s too easy for people to say they “would do” x and y if the tables were turned but we don’t actually know.

I'd be very hurt, poor you OP

Anewnamea

However, what eventually made me stop doing it was her pointless comments about how she would “treat” me if she came into money.

That's some weird version of future faking!

Sorry but I think that's a bit harsh, it takes a long time to build yourself back up after a breakdown and believe me a psychiatric hospital is not a health farm.