Dartford Crossing protester, possible deportation

[WildAlphabet]

Essex radio did an interview with the partner of a protester who climbed the dartford bridge as part of Just Stop Oil.

The gist of it is he was surprised to get three years in prison, they expected a few months. The length of his sentence means he’s facing deportation, as a German national.

They did a phone in, and I was quite surprised that even the angry radio essex listeners they put on, who were massively against his actions, disagreed with deportation as additional punishment. Some wanted community service to make up for the loss they suffered, others name called, but they thought splitting a family was too much.

I was kind of intrigued how the mumsnet demographic would view it, often being quite rule-bound or conservative. Personally I disagree with the one year rule for deportation, particularly for non violent crimes. It’s out of sync with most of the world. I guess also as a second generation immigrant who could also potentially lose the right to stay here if wrongly convicted, it’s scary on a personal level. It’s played on my mind the last few days

Here’s an article https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-essex-66756841.amp

Why have you “sat tests”, etc if you’re a second generation immigrant (as you claim)? I’m a second generation immigrant and have been a citizen all my life as would usually be the case.

Because when I turned 18 my parents didn’t have citizenship. Student visas, then still in the succession of work visa stage.
Your parents need to have full citizenship, and you be their dependent, before you are 18.

I don't know how long ago was that but your parents could have applie for you even if they had ILR not just citizenship before you were 18 considering you were born here and spent childhood here

I don’t know the past laws, I’ve questioned it to be honest. As a very young child I also spent a few years abroad on and off with grandparents that may have complicated it. I’m not entirely sure they couldn’t have better navigated the system and I don’t have clear proof if they had work or ILR then. They had younger children with special needs after me, I was unsure myself the rules, they had financial crisis. I left home young in it all… I think they may have dropped the ball, but I can’t prove it and to be honest what’s the point. It happened and as an under 18 it was out of my hand. I just know when I dealt with it there was no recourse over 18 to claim

pre-settled status under EU law.

Thank you for updating the thread on his immigration status. Unfortunately, the requirements of pre-settled status mean that he would still end up deported either now or when his 5yr visa expired even if he had gotten a much much lower custodial sentence, 1 day even.

”5.7. Breaks in continuous residence due to a prison sentence of any length
Residents with pre-settled status who have been convicted for an offence and receive a prison sentence, or have been detained in a young offender institution, will be considered to have broken their continuous residence regardless of the duration of the prison sentence or detention. As a result, they will not qualify for settled status and would lose their residence rights. These residents will not receive a deportation order if the offence is not sufficiently serious to trigger one, so they would not necessarily be aware that they have lost their right to be permanent status in the future. For example, a 20-year-old with pre-settled status may receive a few weeks sentence for possession of drugs if they had a past conviction (e.g. for shoplifting). This short sentence represents a break in continuous residence which would make them ineligible for settled status.”
https://migrationobservatory.ox.ac.uk/resources/reports/how-secure-is-pre-settled-status-for-eu-citizens-after-brexit/

It doesn’t help that the government changes the immigration rules and laws very frequently so you don’t know from one year to the next what you could or could not apply for. I’m really glad you managed to navigate it all and get the citizenship in the end. It must have been really challenging as an 18yr old.

He chose to break the law, as an adult he accepts the consequences

Quite

And if his OH "doesn't want to break up the family" - probably something she's been coached to argue - why not go to Germany with him?

Thanks OP, seems I was right.... a completely over the top law with a nasty knock-on effect. He didn't breach his visa, the only reason he will be deported is the unecessary prison sentence.

I don't support their protest btw, I think disrupting peoples' lives to the extent they did is entirely unacceptable (and that's from someone who defends anyone's right to protest / use civil disobedience). I was as annoyed as anyone the police weren't dealing with these people more quickly*. But being arrested - or even found guilty - is not the same as being sent down. Prison for protest is nothing but tyranny.

*with hindsight I think they were deliberately left in order for Government to make these legal changes. I recall anti-lockdown protesters weren't left to their own devices, they had cops lining up and charging at them swinging batons around like some scene from a medieval battle. Funny Dishy Rishi and his mob of morons weren't too worried about the legal side then....

Prison for protest is nothing but tyranny.

I disagree because this was more than protesting.
In addition shoplifting can get you landed in prison even if you are stealing essential items like food or nappies and formula for a hungry baby.

I think prison for a minor nonviolent crime done out of desperation because you or your children are starving to death is tyranny.

No one needs to protest in the manner he did. It’s not a necessity for life. He could have protested without endangering the lives of innocent bystanders.

“He didn't breach his visa, the only reason he will be deported is the unecessary prison sentence.”

He breached the requirements of his pre-settled status which is a type of 5yr visa for EU nationals that arrived before Brexit day.

To the above replies:

Totally agree about the shoplifting point but it's not a battle between protesters and poor people.

No-one 'needs' to protest at all, it is their right.

He hasn't breached his visa. Edit: to clarify that, why wasn't he deported already?

I know I'm in the minority here but I hate the idea of punishing people twice , no matter what the crime is. It seems disproportionate . It's like fining someone after sending them to prison - how would they ever be able to pay?
Massive prison sentence OR massive fine OR deportation - pick one.

The real issue then is that the sentences for rape are far too short.

He has breached the terms of his pre-settled status which is a type of visa for those on the path to settled status. It’s roughly similar to a partner visa which are also on 5 or 10yr paths to settled status.

As to why he wasn’t deported already, it’s because he has been charged with a crime in the U.K. International law means that criminals get tried and convicted in the country in which they did their crime(s) and that includes foreign national criminals. That’s why we have extradition treaties- to bring back criminals who have done a crime here and then fled the country- so that we can prosecute and try them here, where they did their crime(s).

So that has to be done first. And as I posted up thread. A criminal conviction with prison sentence of “any duration”, (even a few weeks for shoplifting was the example given) means a break in the continuous residence requirement of pre-settled status, thus making the person ineligible to continue on to settled status or get ay other visa. Which then means you are here illegally and leave the country voluntarily for losing your presettled status if a very minor crime and short sentence or if a serious crime it then triggers a deportation order as well.

“No-one 'needs' to protest at all, it is their right.”

Its not anyone’s right to protest in a manner that recklessly endangers lives.
Our rights to protest end where other human beings right to life begins.

Why are you minimising his offence and calling him a silly boy? People might well have died, ambulances not able to get through, he blocked a major traffic route that pedestrians cannot go on. This is not lawful protest or civil disobedience it is a crime, a serious crime that gets prison time. It is not standing in front of Parliament with a placard getting in the way of the news reporters, he doesn't care about the environment at all if he thinks diverting all traffic onto London Bridge through lez is a good option.
Also why he is not at work? Does he have enough money? If he is claiming benefits that is very very wrong, a rich white middle class German who has overwhelming privilege. It is right that his right to settled status should be removed given the severity of the crime.

His 'crime' was a protest. If he's not here legally as you claim, just send the fucker home with a slapped wrist. It's not rocket science.

I hardly think hanging in a hammock high in the sky is endangering other peoples' lives. The cops didn't deal with any of these morons when they were blocking roads, they brought them tea and support.

If he fell he would make someone a killer, that is not peaceful protest and why the police had to close the road amd divert traffic. You might as well say waving a gun around is protest.

Two women were killed because of their hammock in the sky stunt.
https://www.energylivenews.com/2022/10/21/two-people-die-during-just-stop-oil-protest/

A mother in her 50s and a GP in her 40s have been reported as the two victims, who were hit by a BMW X5 crossing three lanes on Monday morning.
Due to the protest, ambulances and paramedics took 40 minutes to reach the scene in Kent.

If he fell, he'd be dead. Your analogy makes no sense.

Besides, what's so difficult to understand about thinking the police should have the power - which they always had - to deal with disruption but it not resulting in a custodial sentence?

Nothing to do with the BMW crossing three lanes then.

They did a phone in, and I was quite surprised that even the angry radio essex listeners they put on, who were massively against his actions, disagreed with deportation as additional punishment. Some wanted community service to make up for the loss they suffered, others name called, but they thought splitting a family was too much

It’s not an additional punishment. It’s a direct consequence of him doing something that changed his immigration status. Also, it’s not splitting up a family. He doesn’t have a family here. He’s got a girlfriend. They don’t live together. That isn’t a family unit. And even if it were, the girlfriend says she agreed to him doing something that would cause him to be imprisoned for several months. Where was their concern for their family unit then?

If nobody died because Emergency services couldn’t reach them in time, it is more by luck than judgement. I agree that sentences for violent crimes are way too low but it was pretty obvious that the Courts would look to make an example of him to try and put off anyone looking to do something similar. Any idiot could see that.

I don't even understand why he was jailed for climbing a bridge and protesting.

I would imagine because he caused massive disruption, resulting in people missing medical appointments, funerals and God knows what else.