To record someone in my home without their consent?

[RunningInChaoticCircles]

This is DS’s social worker who came to my home for a meeting. I had an idea that the meeting was be used for nefarious purposes and I was right.

Got it all on video and put in a complaint as have evidence of what was said and was able to go it for exact words. Told them I recorded it.

Council have said I must delete the recording immediately as social worker did not consent.

I checked and from what I read it is not illegal to record someone in YOUR home without their consent (I certainly wouldn’t do it to anyone else apart from council employees!) and keep it for your own use.

Who’s right and WIBU?

Because,as I said,recordings can be manipulated. Those that take place under PACE rules have 2 recordings made at the same time, one is for the client , one kept by the organisation. It would be easy to tell if either had been edited.

Damn right I’d be recording any social services or such person in my own home and like hell would I delete it.

Maybe stick a sign in your front door window.

Video and audio recording in process on premises.

Then when they enter they are fully aware 😉

Would others be happy to be recorded in their daily job without their consent?

I believe the answer - in fact the de fact stock answer on Mumsnet - is "nothing to hide, nothing to fear".

I have recorded meeting with social workers in the past, after one lied about what I had told her. Now, I would ask if it was okay at the start of the meeting and offer a copy. If consent was refused, I would end the meeting.

I don't think it's outrageous of you to have made the recording, OP, but going forward it might be better to be more open. I also had an independent witness at all meetings, and (eventually) the SW who told some fairly outrageous lies was made to apologise.

So this wasn't made under PACE conditions. Doesn't necessarily invalidate it.

It may well be, I’m just saying that I think there needs to be more transparency.

If a recording can be doctored, and how does the social worker trust it hasn’t been doctored is clearly the mistrust the OP feels about the social worker’s recollection, or she wouldn’t have felt the need to record in the first place, surely?

There is clearly a lack of trust amongst the public with social services.

I’ve never had any involvement with them, but in my mind they’re the same as the police (who I’ve also never had any involvement with).

i.e. That they close ranks and are pretty corrupt.

Just my opinion, but don’t think I’m alone 🤷‍♀️

I once recorded the social worker that saw my daughter on their own. They talked about the recent snow, which out of school clubs she attended, what her friends were called and what she had for lunch today.

The social worker then went to court and told everyone that she had interviewed my daughter at length and my daughter said she was missing her (physically abusive) dad and desperately wanted to spend regular time with him.

Oh and the recording was not allowed in court, despite my daughter trying to challenge that she had never said any of those words.

What did you say? What happened? That is just outrageous and is no doubt why the OP was doing the exact same thing.

I was called a liar and daughter was forced to visit her dad.

I would question your overall judgement OP, and not only with regard to the recording.
Why everyone is automatically jumping to your defence is anyone's guess.

Social work senior manager here - I actually think it is acceptable to record. My view always is that we take notes that are used as evidence at times and it is acceptable for parents to do the same. I tend to encourage social workers to be transparent about it though, ask the parent if they want to record the interaction etc. Better we are all up front about things. The challenge in is they can be doctored/edited & have to be mindful of this.

There is clearly a lack of trust amongst the public with social services

That is an outrageous singling out of one institution. Pretty sure if we were to canvass general opinion, we'd find all organisations have very low trust levels with the public.

Like pp I am surprised that social workers don't wear body cams as I imagine a lot of aroguing in that line of work and body cam footage can be used to prosecute assault or settle disagreements about what was said at meetings. Video evidence about what was said by the parents or the state of their home would surely be much more accurate than notes taken after a visit.

OP I don't think that you were wrong to record the meeting. It should be mandatory so that people under their supervision have a record of what was said and what actions they should take. I can imagine that it may be hard to digest all of the info given at this sort of meeting and that video would help weed out the corrupt minority who shouldn't be working with vulnerable people.

Contact the ICO, give them all the information and they’ll advise you correctly.

Bloody hell. Did you call out the sw? That's appalling

All retail workers are recorded every shift with multiple cctv cameras as are pub staff behind the counter. I have never been asked for my consent, either as a worker or customer.

Why would you be upset at being recorded when interviewing a vulnerable person? Surely you would want to be protected...

It’s not really outrageous though, is it?

Not when we’re specifically talking about social work.

I would want body cam style recordings of all my interactions off site if i was a SW.

Practically each and every adult now has a recording device which can discretely recording a conversation, and which can be easily used to edit the recording. ie: mobile phone.

I would feel happier if i had my own recording of all interactions and i'm amazed ss doesn't embrace this already.

Apart from that it would also be useful for accuracy to back up handwritten notes.

No, I wouldn't be happy, but would you be happy not to have any evidence of malpractice, which could result in the removal of your child?

I'm sure you would also do what you could to prevent this, gathering proof seems reasonable to me.

Personal data processed in the course of a purely personal or household activity, with no connection to a professional or commercial activity, is outside the scope of the GDPR. So you can do what you like in terms of recording people who come to your home and engage with you about your own personal matters. But covertly recording people in your house does mean they're not likely to want to engage with you in a "normal" way, it's quite an aggressive act. If you feel justified because you already don't trust them and don't have a good relationship, carry on!

daffodilandtulip · Today 13:33

I once recorded the social worker that saw my daughter on their own. They talked about the recent snow, which out of school clubs she attended, what her friends were called and what she had for lunch today.

The social worker then went to court and told everyone that she had interviewed my daughter at length and my daughter said she was missing her (physically abusive) dad and desperately wanted to spend regular time with him.

Horrific! And perfectly illustrates why recordings should be done and kept. For both parties sake!

I am recorded in my job regularly. Most of the meetings I attend and lead are recorded and the recordings are made available after the call for those who couldn't attend or to check back later on what was agreed. I'd object to being recorded in the loo but no issue having my meetings recorded. My sister is a cop and wears a bodycam and has no issue with it. If I had to meet a social worker I'd insist on recording the meetings to cover both me and the social worker going forwards - seems common sense to me!

Maybe the answer would be for both parties to immediately receive a copy?

If it was formalised in some sort of way could potentially remove this sort of risk, as would be easy to tell if it had been doctored in any way, by either party.

Just look at the stories on this thread, there must be a better way where both sides feel accurately represented

It isn't realistic to imagine that social workers have the spare time to sit and make notes after viewing footage of recordings. This would be a time heavy commitment.
There is no money for equipment or storage of data, which would be a fairly big expense and time commitment.
There are significant privacy issues with recording children and young people.

The practical logistics are fairly difficult and would be expensive. There is neither the time or the money for this currently it would require substantial investment.