To think she's in big trouble

[skatermom]

My 14 year old daughter went out into town with her friend yesterday afternoon being bank holiday Monday. We live in a small village and she walks everywhere mostly. This time, they decided to get on the train and thought she would buy a ticket on the train. Her friend has a season ticket due to taking a train for school.
Well, the train conductor gave her a penalty notice for £50 and that a letter will be sent to her address as to what to do.

The problem is that she said she was not about to give her name and address to a stranger so she gave them a false name AND address!
So we will never receive said letter!
I've been so worried because I know it's an offence to not have a ticket but a worse one to give false details. I'm sure it's a criminal offence!
I'm so worried that she'll be on a CCTV somewhere or a 'wanted' ad placed out for her. I haven't slept all night thinking about this.

What would you do? Will they come find her?
Am I unreasonable to think she will be in big trouble with this?

Exactly. The thing that's really unacceptable here is being denied the opportunity to buy a ticket on the train or at the end of the journey. That's what stinks.

That seems really unlikely. At best, might have been able to check that the street existed. Certainly couldn't tell you who lived there - especially not a child.

But more likely that's what they said to try and ensure a correct name and address were given than them actually being able to check.

People I know who fare dodged regularly as teenagers:

A CEO
A finance director
An IT consultant
Senior civil servant
A solicitor
A university professor
An artist
A consultant neurologist

It's no predictor of future criminal tendencies or anything really except that teenagers are risk takers.

Your DD is a child. The inspector should have given her an opportunity to purchase the ticket on the train, even if that's not the policy (yes it's possible, happened to my forgetful male friend recently). The inspector was being unnecessarily punitive and perhaps on a bit of a power trip.

I am impressed that DD gave false information actually. Leaving aside whether or not you can trust anyone "official" (the police being a prime example) who knows who else is listening on a train carriage. It puts a child in a potentially vulnerable position. You should praise her for this part.

So she's telling you just as she's told you he wasn't allowed to buy a ticket. Tell her you're going to get to the bottom of it as if a conductor behaved like that then it needs investigation. Of course you'll pay the fine as well. I suspect she won't want you to do that.

Someone did that to my daughter once. Gave her name and address when they jumped the metro. So the fine came to my house.

It was a right fuck on to sort out.

I just would have explained the process to my kid before they went.

I don't think it is mollycoddling to give them useful information!

Ok so it was dishonest and illegal.

my question is..... Would she do it again? Or did it shake her enough to learn from it?

it’s not great obviously but I’d have a good chat about honesty and theft and leave it. She clearly has a trusting relationship with you as she told you. I’d protect that.

My friend did this when we were kids, j thought it was very clever actually.

He was the ticket collector on the train to be fair hardly a person to be concerned about really.

Our local station does as one of the main stations on the line. But quite a few don't some just have a ticket machine and shelter. There's no station building.

He was a police officer... someone we are also not to be concerned about.

...and Wayne Cousens was a serving Metropolitan Police Officer. Totally trustworthy.
Do you not see the problem?

She was a 14 year old girl hoping to pay her fare on the train, but he threatened to have the police on her...

This thread has been eye-opening. I live in Glasgow and the small, local stations have no barriers. There are (rarely) staffed offices and a ticket machine but it's no problem to buy one on the train. In fact, the conductor usually walks up and down with the machine in his hand, asking "does anyone need a ticket?"

They have even set up a counter in Glasgow Queen Street (one of two main city stations) specifically so you can get off the train, buy your ticket and continue on through the barriers. There is a similar counter before the barriers at Edinburgh Waverley, so clearly they don't care where you buy a ticket, as long as you do.

It sounds like other parts of the UK are way more strict!

Have you checked with interpol yet?

😂

Our local station has a ‘promise to pay’ ticket option, for those who only have cash (I think) and then you can purchase on the train or at the next station.

DS has used this on a couple of occasions when he first started using the train.

We now use the National rail app, so easy to set up and WhatsApp the ticket.

For £2.80 the conductor was totally in the wrong for not allowing your DD to buy a bloody ticket! Would have been interesting if he had contacted the police!

Your DD was in the wrong for providing false details but I’m sure she’s learned a valuable lesson. She panicked, as many young teens would, but she did think she would be able to buy a ticket on the train!

This option should be available on every train.

Doubt all you want...

https://www.southernrailway.com/travel-information/on-board/penalty-fares

"They can check these details and will know if the details you give are not correct"

Yes, NE Glasgow here, I've mentioned earlier in the thread about being able to buy your ticket after your journey. So glad they're not so stick up arse as some other rail companies clearly are!

What database do you think exists to look up the exact name and address of every single person in the country? Especially minor children?

They may be able to search and be able to see that "Leaf House, Oak Lane, TreeTown, ABC123 exists", but they won't be able to see who lives there, their age and what they look like in order to prove you're telling the truth

Or, more likely, it's what they tell people to try and guilt them into telling the truth. Like TV licensing vans.

I'm in the east end 👋

I have many complaints about the trains here but I'm now feeling grateful for their attitude to ticket buying!

Yeah. They like to try to scare you by saying they know who hasn't got one. Well no shit Sherlock, you've got a database of which addresses have one so it's pretty simple elimination to work out who hasn't. But you don't know if they've actually got a TV or not. Plus the threatening tone they take with you (I had neither a licence nor a TV when doing my postgraduate study, so I got their crap) is unbelievable. They can fuck off too.

It teaches thinking on your feet and never giving your real name and address to anyone even if in uniform

"What database do you think exists to look up the exact name and address of every single person in the country? Especially minor children?

They may be able to search and be able to see that "Leaf House, Oak Lane, TreeTown, ABC123 exists", but they won't be able to see who lives there, their age and what they look like in order to prove you're telling the truth

Or, more likely, it's what they tell people to try and guilt them into telling the truth. Like TV licensing vans."

Exactly this. Especially for a child as they are not on the electoral roll.

It's a national rail condition of travel that you buy a ticket before travelling, wherever possible - that means if there is a ticket office or vending machine at the start of your journey OR you have a smart phone, you can be fined if you travel without a ticket - that is national and has pretty much always been the case (not the smart phone bit, but as 80% of rail tickets are bought online, they do now expect you to do this before boarding the train).

Lots of people on this thread have said they have bought tickets on the train before/have regularly seen this happen, and it does happen but unfortunately rail operators and the DfT are now starting to crack down on this and issuing fines where they would previously just sell you a ticket. I'm seeing more often that conductors are not even being allowed to take a ticket machine on board with them, they are only able to give out fines, and this is going to keep happening - it is one of (the MANY) reasons that rail staff are still on strike.

Basically the thinking behind it, is that firstly, you will get less fare dodgers/chancers who only pay once in a blue moon, as soon it will be a case of buy a ticket before travelling or get a fine, there will be no way to buy one on the train. Then, once a situation is created where noone is travelling without a ticket, or conductors aren't selling any tickets anymore, it is just another reason why a conductor is no longer needed on a train, and takes us another step closer to the DfT being able to force through plans to remove conductors from trains.

In this situation though OP, it does sound like the conductor was an arse to your DD, I expect that was at least in part because he is sick of being forced to hand out these stupid fucking fines and was more than happy to accept a false name and address because he knows they are bullshit.

All that to say, noone is going to come chasing your DD about this - but I would urge anyone on here who says they regularly buy a ticket on board the train to start buying before you travel, you don't have to wait at long queues if you download one of the many apps that let you buy tickets, because this will be happening all over the UK sooner or later, and you won't get any warning, you'll just be told it is part of the conditions of travel and always has been.

A few of the train companies have recently been doing disability impact surveys around this and closing of ticket offices, so if you do feel strongly about the impact, some of them may still be open and you can voice your concerns.

(sorry OP, this isn't really an answer to your question, but just wanted to spread this info for anyone who doesn't know)