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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

Worried my Sons will be left with nothing

574 replies

JaffaCake70 · 14/08/2023 09:10

My Husband and I are both early 50s and have been married just over a year (together 3 years in October).

Before we met I had been renting private accommodation. When we married I moved into my Husband's house which he had been paying the mortgage on for around 5 years, he had also paid a large deposit when he moved into the property as he had sold a previous property. We now both contribute to the mortgage and all other household expenses. We re-mortgaged to the tune of £10,000 to pay for our wedding and honeymoon.

We haven't really had any serious conversations about finances apart from the agreement of how much I would pay into the home but now I'm starting to worry. I know I need to speak to my Husband about the things I'm about to discuss with you, but I just wanted to see if anyone can advise me where I stand legally before I have the conversation.

My Husband has an adult Son and Daughter, his Daughter lives with us, I have 2 adult Sons, neither of whom live with us.

We both have decent pensions, if anything should happen to him before he cashes his, I would receive it and vice versa (he would receive mine). This has all been put into place.

He has told me that if he should die before me, the proceeds of the house are being split 3 ways between me, his Son and his Daughter.

My worry is: What is being left to my Sons should I die first?

This is really playing on my mind because the way it looks to me on paper is that they wouldn't get anything.

Is there anything I can do to change this? Can I split my pension 3 ways so that my Sons get a 3rd each?

What will happen to my 3rd of the house if I were to die first? I am now paying into the house, surely my Sons should be entitled to something in the event of my death? How does it work though? For example, if I were to die in 10 years time (God forbid) but my Husband then went on to live for another 20 years, maybe even marries again, what happens to my 3rd of the property?

I'm really worried that I've put my Sons in the position of not receiving anything at all if I were to die before my Husband. I don't have any savings to bequeath to them, the only money I have of my own is my pension.

Do I have any legal standing in stating that I want my 3rd of the property to be divided between my Sons in the event of my death. I still feel it's a little unfair that my Sons would be receiving less than my Husband's children (as in his children would still receive a 3rd each, my Sons would have to share my 3rd).

I'm stressing myself out with all of this, I know I need to speak to my Husband but don't want to come across as money grabbing as I'm really not. I just want to know that my Sons will be provided for financially in the event of my death.

YABU - Your Sons should not be entitled to anything from the house

YANBU - You work just as hard as your Husband and are now paying an equal amount into the home therefore your Sons definitely are entitled to a percentage of the house.

But more than YA/YANBU opinions, please can anyone advise as to what I should do/say in this situation?

OP posts:
Thread gallery
6
Cosyblankets · 14/08/2023 16:31

DozensOfRoses · 14/08/2023 16:20

From what I can gather, I think OP might be totally confused about the difference between the loan they got to pay for the wedding (10k, in their names, secured against his house so technically also a mortgage although most would probably think of it more like a personal loan) and the actual mortgage (being paid monthly to the bank, taken out at the time of the house purchase).

If this is the error the OP has made then the whole thing (kind of...) makes sense. So she would be on a mortgage, but it would not have any impact on their ownership of the house. It could have been quite a straightforward loan application without the same amount of paperwork.

I think this is the most likely scenario, and explains why OP thinks she has made some major contribution to the house while he does not. Because she also at another point thought that paying off this loan added equity to the house, whereas it is actually the opposite.

Show quote history

I can see how you've come to that conclusion.
Whichever way you look at it it's quite scary that she's not actually sure what's going on. If she's on the mortgage she'd have paperwork. If it was the loan and she thinks she's on the mortgage she definitely needs things explaining.

SouthernLassies · 14/08/2023 16:48

anonymousxoxo · 14/08/2023 16:16

So he had 2 houses and 2 mortgages he worked hard for. Further proves his point.

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No. what it proves is that he had one house, sold it and made a profit and put that towards his current house. He has never had 2 houses at the same time.

I'm not being rude, but you don't seem to understand how house selling and buying works.

NewNovember · 14/08/2023 17:05

Jaemoon · 14/08/2023 14:37

Wtf? A court of law doesn’t see a wife as renting her marital home.

She is contributing to the mortgage and probably also doing the housework and cooking, she is entitled to her share of the property.

Yes, he should ringfence his deposit but he can’t keep the whole house.

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It's not the martial hole though it's her dh house thet he paid the deposit for and then the majority of the capital.

anonymousxoxo · 14/08/2023 17:06

SouthernLassies · 14/08/2023 16:48

No. what it proves is that he had one house, sold it and made a profit and put that towards his current house. He has never had 2 houses at the same time.

I'm not being rude, but you don't seem to understand how house selling and buying works.

Show quote history

I'm not being rude, but you don't seem to understand how he worked hard and maintained a home but OP didn't.

poetryandwine · 14/08/2023 17:33

anonymousxoxo · 14/08/2023 15:35

People take out mortgages in 20's/30's, all well being in 50's/60's - it's paid off and mortgage free e.g. asset to pass down onto children.

He's presumably paid for 30+ years, yet you want to benefit from it when you haven't contributed.

You living to 80+ is unrealistic at best.

If I remarried and a man wanted me to share my asset when I've been with him for 3 years, yet saved 30+ years. I'd choose my children every time.

@anonymousxoxo A simple search shows that the life expectancy of a 50 yr old woman is over 33 years. Unless she has undisclosed health problems, the OP certainly can expect to live into her 80s.

We have no idea how long the husband has been paying on the house or how much he is paying now. All assumptions on this point are meaningless.

The issue is not the husband’s understandable wish to provide for his children. It is the fact that as things currently stand, the OP’s contributions will provide them with equity in the house at the expense of her own children if she dies first.

anonymousxoxo · 14/08/2023 17:39

poetryandwine · 14/08/2023 17:33

@anonymousxoxo A simple search shows that the life expectancy of a 50 yr old woman is over 33 years. Unless she has undisclosed health problems, the OP certainly can expect to live into her 80s.

We have no idea how long the husband has been paying on the house or how much he is paying now. All assumptions on this point are meaningless.

The issue is not the husband’s understandable wish to provide for his children. It is the fact that as things currently stand, the OP’s contributions will provide them with equity in the house at the expense of her own children if she dies first.

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It's not meaningless because it's his property and asset. OP should have worked for her own and had her own.

GabriellaMontez · 14/08/2023 17:41

I can understand why the husband may want to ring-fence his deposit.

Are people like @anonymousxoxo really saying the op should have no claim, at all to any percentage of the house? Even though she is contributing to the mortgage and will, until the end of its term?

anonymousxoxo · 14/08/2023 17:45

GabriellaMontez · 14/08/2023 17:41

I can understand why the husband may want to ring-fence his deposit.

Are people like @anonymousxoxo really saying the op should have no claim, at all to any percentage of the house? Even though she is contributing to the mortgage and will, until the end of its term?

Until the end of term is very unlikely. He’s entitled to do what he likes it’s his property, without the deposit they wouldn’t have the house. She can get her own house and pay for that.

poetryandwine · 14/08/2023 17:57

@anonymousxoxo you cannot make a meaningful assumption about how many years the husband has been paying mortgages. Probably not 30 or the mortgage should be paid off. Whether 5, 13 or 22 years, we have no clue. That is what I was referring to.

Most women marry men their own age or older. So the husband as well as the OP
did not have a spare £10K for the wedding and honeymoon. It is a reasonable guess that he was 50 or older at that point. Money was tight. It is quite possible that the OP‘s husband would be in financial trouble without her payments.

How you can suppose that ‘Until the end of term is very unlikely’ with no knowledge again beggars belief.

We do possibly agree that the OP should be doing something else with her money.

Daffodilsandtuplips · 14/08/2023 18:04

Even with a life time interest in the house you’re at the mercy of your stepchildren, they could charge you rent on their combined share of the property which is what happened to my neighbour. Your scenario is almost the same as his except it was his wife who’d was the homeowner. Second marriages for both of them, she had adult daughters, he didn’t have children. She died first and left the house in equal shares to the three of them. The stepdaughters charged him rent on the two thirds that they owned. At the reading of the Eill he learned that He had a lifetime interest in it so couldn’t be evicted but they could charge him rent if they so wished.
He was blindsided, she’d told him she was leaving the house to him, with the rest of her estate going to the girls.
He eventually bought them out by cashing in pensions, shares etc.
So you need to have that talk with your DH to see where you stand in the future op, for your own peace of mind for your own future.

GasPanic · 14/08/2023 18:11

poetryandwine · 14/08/2023 17:57

@anonymousxoxo you cannot make a meaningful assumption about how many years the husband has been paying mortgages. Probably not 30 or the mortgage should be paid off. Whether 5, 13 or 22 years, we have no clue. That is what I was referring to.

Most women marry men their own age or older. So the husband as well as the OP
did not have a spare £10K for the wedding and honeymoon. It is a reasonable guess that he was 50 or older at that point. Money was tight. It is quite possible that the OP‘s husband would be in financial trouble without her payments.

How you can suppose that ‘Until the end of term is very unlikely’ with no knowledge again beggars belief.

We do possibly agree that the OP should be doing something else with her money.

It literally says how long he has been paying the mortgage in the second paragraph of the first post.

Ibizafun · 14/08/2023 18:16

Sorry haven't finished reading thread but what if from now on the only thing you contributed was rent to stay in the house? Surely you then wouldn't want to claim any equity in it? You could then use whatever money you had left over for life insurance for your boys.

Problem solved?

poetryandwine · 14/08/2023 18:21

Sorry, @GasPanic I mis-wrote. I meant that we don’t know how long the husband has been a homeowner overall. It sounds like his deposit on this house came from the sale of the first house, but amounts and timings are not given.

SpamFrittersYouSay · 14/08/2023 18:22

OP, unless you've had correspondence from the bank etc... you're not on the mortgage or title deeds.

Understandably you want to protect your own children but , right now, your children have no rights.

You really need to find out, legally, where you and your children stand.

Moving into a man's own house, with no money of your own, later in life , is a bit precarious. Paying for sofas and wallpaper won't secure equal rights .

poetryandwine · 14/08/2023 18:24

@Ibizafun it seems a very weird idea to pay rent to your spouse. That’s one marital partner enriching the other. Ultimately it is a lesser version of the OP contributing to her stepchildren’s equity in the property at the expense of her own children, if she dies first

anonymousxoxo · 14/08/2023 18:53

poetryandwine · 14/08/2023 17:57

@anonymousxoxo you cannot make a meaningful assumption about how many years the husband has been paying mortgages. Probably not 30 or the mortgage should be paid off. Whether 5, 13 or 22 years, we have no clue. That is what I was referring to.

Most women marry men their own age or older. So the husband as well as the OP
did not have a spare £10K for the wedding and honeymoon. It is a reasonable guess that he was 50 or older at that point. Money was tight. It is quite possible that the OP‘s husband would be in financial trouble without her payments.

How you can suppose that ‘Until the end of term is very unlikely’ with no knowledge again beggars belief.

We do possibly agree that the OP should be doing something else with her money.

My house my rules. I decide who gets what.

Puzzledandpissedoff · 14/08/2023 19:03

She can get her own house and pay for that

Considering £10k had to be added to the mortgage to pay for the wedding, I wouldn't want to assume OP had the disposable cash needed to pay even a deposit for her own house

Interestingly, this drive to "leave the DCs something" seems to be driven by having married a man who could enable this if he chose ... only it's possible he may not choose it, and I can't say I'd blame him

As ever on MN, if this was a man hoping his kids would get to share something which was originally meant for hers, I suspect the replies would be totally different

GoingGoingUp · 14/08/2023 19:41

Puzzledandpissedoff · 14/08/2023 19:03

She can get her own house and pay for that

Considering £10k had to be added to the mortgage to pay for the wedding, I wouldn't want to assume OP had the disposable cash needed to pay even a deposit for her own house

Interestingly, this drive to "leave the DCs something" seems to be driven by having married a man who could enable this if he chose ... only it's possible he may not choose it, and I can't say I'd blame him

As ever on MN, if this was a man hoping his kids would get to share something which was originally meant for hers, I suspect the replies would be totally different

It’s exactly that. It’s one for OP to protect herself, and rightly so, but when she never had anything to give to her children as inheritance, she has clearly seen her husband think of his own children and gone “what about mine?!”

Its really very grabby.

SouthernLassies · 14/08/2023 20:32

anonymousxoxo · 14/08/2023 17:06

I'm not being rude, but you don't seem to understand how he worked hard and maintained a home but OP didn't.

Show quote history

@anonymousxoxo You seem unable to read the posts from the OP. Your comprehension is really poor.

On top of which you are inventing things.

You have no idea how hard he worked. For all you or I know he may have inherited money along the way.

You do realise that the OP was widowed young (or maybe you missed that as you don't appear to read their posts) but you expect that as a single parent she would be able to buy a house.

I assume that you, if you were a single parent to 2 sons could 'work hard' and buy on your own?

anonymousxoxo · 14/08/2023 20:40

SouthernLassies · 14/08/2023 20:32

@anonymousxoxo You seem unable to read the posts from the OP. Your comprehension is really poor.

On top of which you are inventing things.

You have no idea how hard he worked. For all you or I know he may have inherited money along the way.

You do realise that the OP was widowed young (or maybe you missed that as you don't appear to read their posts) but you expect that as a single parent she would be able to buy a house.

I assume that you, if you were a single parent to 2 sons could 'work hard' and buy on your own?

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So, her being a single parent means she's entitled to his assets that he's worked hard over the years to accumulate? How grabby!

Shinyandnew1 · 14/08/2023 20:44

You do realise that the OP was widowed young (or maybe you missed that as you don't appear to read their posts)

I thought the OP said she had never been married and this was a first wedding for both of them?

Shinyandnew1 · 14/08/2023 20:47

But the fact that I didn't have anything before doesn't take away from the fact that I am now paying a substantial monthly amount into the house

How much more/less are you paying now than you were paying in rent, @JaffaCake70 ?

anonymousxoxo · 14/08/2023 20:48

SouthernLassies · 14/08/2023 20:32

@anonymousxoxo You seem unable to read the posts from the OP. Your comprehension is really poor.

On top of which you are inventing things.

You have no idea how hard he worked. For all you or I know he may have inherited money along the way.

You do realise that the OP was widowed young (or maybe you missed that as you don't appear to read their posts) but you expect that as a single parent she would be able to buy a house.

I assume that you, if you were a single parent to 2 sons could 'work hard' and buy on your own?

Show quote history

What if she never met him then what? She would have no assets to pass on. The only way the house exists is he paid the deposit.

Willyoujustbequiet · 14/08/2023 20:58

Anyotherdude · 14/08/2023 09:24

YABU - now…(only because you haven’t discussed it!
Are you “on” the mortgage (named as a mortgagee?) If not, ask your husband to add you as either a joint owner, or a tenant in common. I think that if it’s the latter, a percentage of ownership can be established.
And if you want your DC to inherit “your” percentage, you’ll have to establish that in a will with your DH (but not so that if you pre-decease him, your DC immediately hound him for money)
Start with a talk about finances, your concerns about how your DC will fare if you die, and explain that you obviously don’t want to be in a situation where his DC are disadvantaged, either - just want it to be fair for all of them.

The mortgage and deeds are two different things. The mortgage is the liability for the debt owed. The deeds show legal ownership of the property.

You can't be on either OP as you would have had to sign various legal documents. Property ownership is public record and for a few pounds you can download the title document for your property from the Land Registry.

Cosyblankets · 14/08/2023 21:00

SouthernLassies · 14/08/2023 20:32

@anonymousxoxo You seem unable to read the posts from the OP. Your comprehension is really poor.

On top of which you are inventing things.

You have no idea how hard he worked. For all you or I know he may have inherited money along the way.

You do realise that the OP was widowed young (or maybe you missed that as you don't appear to read their posts) but you expect that as a single parent she would be able to buy a house.

I assume that you, if you were a single parent to 2 sons could 'work hard' and buy on your own?

Show quote history

It really doesn't matter how he's paid for it. Work or inheritance.
All that matters is that he has and she hasn't. It wasn't her work. It wasn't her inheritance.
If she's paying in now then they need to sort out the legalities but I'd be wants to leave his kids an inheritance then he should

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