Worried my Sons will be left with nothing

[JaffaCake70]

My Husband and I are both early 50s and have been married just over a year (together 3 years in October).

Before we met I had been renting private accommodation. When we married I moved into my Husband's house which he had been paying the mortgage on for around 5 years, he had also paid a large deposit when he moved into the property as he had sold a previous property. We now both contribute to the mortgage and all other household expenses. We re-mortgaged to the tune of £10,000 to pay for our wedding and honeymoon.

We haven't really had any serious conversations about finances apart from the agreement of how much I would pay into the home but now I'm starting to worry. I know I need to speak to my Husband about the things I'm about to discuss with you, but I just wanted to see if anyone can advise me where I stand legally before I have the conversation.

My Husband has an adult Son and Daughter, his Daughter lives with us, I have 2 adult Sons, neither of whom live with us.

We both have decent pensions, if anything should happen to him before he cashes his, I would receive it and vice versa (he would receive mine). This has all been put into place.

He has told me that if he should die before me, the proceeds of the house are being split 3 ways between me, his Son and his Daughter.

My worry is: What is being left to my Sons should I die first?

This is really playing on my mind because the way it looks to me on paper is that they wouldn't get anything.

Is there anything I can do to change this? Can I split my pension 3 ways so that my Sons get a 3rd each?

What will happen to my 3rd of the house if I were to die first? I am now paying into the house, surely my Sons should be entitled to something in the event of my death? How does it work though? For example, if I were to die in 10 years time (God forbid) but my Husband then went on to live for another 20 years, maybe even marries again, what happens to my 3rd of the property?

I'm really worried that I've put my Sons in the position of not receiving anything at all if I were to die before my Husband. I don't have any savings to bequeath to them, the only money I have of my own is my pension.

Do I have any legal standing in stating that I want my 3rd of the property to be divided between my Sons in the event of my death. I still feel it's a little unfair that my Sons would be receiving less than my Husband's children (as in his children would still receive a 3rd each, my Sons would have to share my 3rd).

I'm stressing myself out with all of this, I know I need to speak to my Husband but don't want to come across as money grabbing as I'm really not. I just want to know that my Sons will be provided for financially in the event of my death.

YABU - Your Sons should not be entitled to anything from the house

YANBU - You work just as hard as your Husband and are now paying an equal amount into the home therefore your Sons definitely are entitled to a percentage of the house.

But more than YA/YANBU opinions, please can anyone advise as to what I should do/say in this situation?

Surely if you go for legal advice they’ll ask you all the logistics? Should op not be going with her husband to bang this all out? Op while yes you have to keep your wits about you presumably you trust your dh.

And contributing to mortgage repayments instead of rent, feels entitled to her children getting a share of the house.

This is more of a relationship than a legal issue, the latter - despite claims on this thread - is actually very straight forward once you have clarity on what if anything you own. If you want to sort wheat from chaff the legal board is good and we’re quite friendly.

the next question is what should you own and then what is the gap between what you should and what you in fact own. Even that is probably straight forward.

The real question is does your view align with your DHs and why is he lying to you?

My Husband has said that my name is now on the mortgage, I haven't seen it with my own eyes but I do trust him

???? Surely you would know? I have never been on a mortgage where I didn’t have to sign paperwork and go through a kerfuffle with the bank. Either you signed paperwork with the bank or you didn’t?

I don't think you are being grabby wanting to be aware of and plan for your financial future. This should not be about what you can leave your sons, but your pensions, when you might be able to retire, any debt liabilities, your financial independence if you split etc etc.

But you are acting a bit helpless. I am not convinced anyone can honestly believe it when their husband says they are now on the mortgage if they haven't seen paperwork, discussed with the bank or signed anything.

You are an adult, you are in a complex financial situation where your dh invested in a property prior to marriage and you both have children. You and your dh need to get proper financial advice together and make sure you are both fully informed of your now combined finances.

You should have both had complete transparency of each others finances prior to marrying so any incompatibles around approaches to finance/future plans could be ironed out first, it is time to fix that now and if your dh has not been transparent/has lied about you being on the mortgage I have a feeling you might find out some things about your dh that will raise some red flags for you.

If you both have good pensions, I would look again at weather you should be leaving these to each other.

if I live for another 10, 20, 30 years, I will have put a hell of a lot of money into the property

You would be a mug to do this without some sort of legal set up where that money is acknowledged and accounted for. A floating tenancy in common for instance.

OP, what would your husband say if you suggested that instead of paying the mortgage on 'his' house, because that's what it is, you bought a small investment property and rented it out. That would be 'your' property. And while you each contribute to bills of 'his' house for living there, he pays the mortgage and you handled the bills and mortgage of your rental property.

I'm guessing he wouldn't be keen because you're paying a significant chunk of mortgage on 'his' house that 'his' children will inherit. There's no guarantee he'll leave any of it to you, no matter what he says, unless your name is on that deed, too.

@loislovesstewie I'm a widow and I agree. I won't be marrying anyone or sharing my assets for my children with other step-children, they have their own families and own assets, I have mine and my childrens for which we have all worked as a family.

I would prefer a legal set up where pre-marital assets are not shared. I have actually married/had relationships with people with more assets than me but I don't want their money anyway.

OP if I were you I would find out the legal position and then stop thinking about how you can get some of the home unless you are on the mortgage/deeds/able to secure that in the future legally.

I would be looking to stop paying mortgage payments and shovel my spare money into investment vehicles/ISAs for my adult children. I don't think later life assurance policies are good value at all, and normal life insurance on a fixed term only pays out if you die in that term, it's not a savings plan!

It does not sound like you could take out a separate mortgage and have your own house parallel to his, that's what I would have done, and revisited the wills in 5 years time when the marriage is a bit longer.

These things are very complex and morally everyone can't be a winner- your step-children will inherit less due to their father remarrying, in fact, your children have not lost by this marriage as you had no assets anyway. I would use this money to gain assets in your own name and set up provision to leave them to your family (or even just give them money now!)

@JaffaCake70 - Please, please ,please, see a lawyer. Inheritance laws are complex and folks on here, however well-meaning do not know ALL your circumstances, so any advice given can only be partially correct, whatever it is

Yes - you need to see your DH's will and also find out exactly what the situation is with the Mortgage, as others have said - then you need to speak to a solicitor

I was the houseowner when my DH got married and I had been married before, with 2 children. The title deeds say that I own 2/3 of the house and my DH owns 1/3. That was a fair thing to do and which we both agreed on

I didn't mean stop paying the mortgage if you are on the mortgage and the payments are due, I meant if you are not technically on the mortgage (which seems unlikely if you didn't refinance with him) and you are just giving him money, then I would discuss redistributing that money towards your own assets/house separate to his, as well as securing a life interest in the property to secure the roof over your head.

I’m a solicitor (but I’m not offering legal advice - I agree you need your own advice from a family lawyer). But just to clarify:

• you borrow money from a bank to buy a house, this is a bank loan.
• this loan is secured against the hose by a security instrument called a mortgage
• when people talk about “paying off a mortgage” what they are really doing is paying off a bank loan so that the security instrument held by the bank (the mortgage can be discharged)
• the mortgage and bank loan are completely separate from the legal title to the house. The bank’s interest in the house, the security instrument, is noted on the title. Once the bank loan is repaid, the mortgage is discharged and the property is now unencumbered. This is recorded on the land registry deeds.
• some posters are saying you need to be “on the mortgage”. Well actually if you are not named on the bank loan and associated mortgage that’s no bad thing! But I think your DH would quite rightfully what to share that liability. As per pp, you absolutely cannot just be “added” you will have had to execute a formal deed with witnesses - you won’t have forgotten that.
• what you do need to be added to is the title to the property at the land registry. This costs money and again would have to be done in writing and witnessed as a deed. I did this when I lived with my partner before we were married. We instructed a family solicitor to sort this out.

Any further thoughts on the wedding and honeymoon issue OP? I think you were suggesting that your DHs deposit is considered reduced by 10k?

The absolute minimum you need is a life interest in the property til you die so you won't be kicked out in later life or have to sell to obtain money to live if divided several ways.

Agree with the poster, seek legal advice.

Legal things are not always fair though!

Why on earth are you paying the mortgage on a house, where you're not clear if you own any of it? You both need to see a solicitor, asap.

@JaukiVexnoydi makes good points especially
think in this situation it would be fairest for his will to leave the house entirely to his children but giving you a life-interest to live there as long as you live. Meanwhile although you should make a modest contribution to the household costs this should be less than half because you and your sons aren't going to benefit from it as a capital investment as your DH and his children will. Instead you should be putting all the differences between your living costs when you were renting solo vs your contribution now into a savings account in your sole name, with your will leaving those savings to your sons.

however I’d be very concerned that he says he’s put you on the mortgage when he can’t have done without you knowing. More important though is being on the deeds which again you would know about. After that sort out the will.

My worry is: What is being left to my Sons should I die first?

Why should they receive anything from the house? From your pension, yes OK, you've earned that.

But the house ... you're paying the equivalent of rent.

You need to speak to a solicitor. There are various options available to you here whereby you could ring-fence some of the assets in the event you pre-decease your husband. You also need a legal mechanism for if he dies first as you will currently only own 3rd of the house you live in. Obviously you would.need to both agree to anything. The obvious question is where were you living before? Would your sons have inherited anything?
In the meantime, you could perhaps set up a life policy with a guaranteed payout to your sons o death (likely to be expensive), you could also start an investment that you leave to them.
I can't emphasise enough though, you need proper legal advice not opinions from mumsnet.

The two of you need to have some serious conversations about money. Then you need to meet with a solicitor.

I do have to say that this is why I would not remarry. Have a romantic relationship certainly, but marriage is at its foremost a financial contract. Marrying when you have a preexisting child is always going to interfere with inheritance.

Re. Life Insurance - be aware as you get older - so the cost of life insurance increases a lot or can even be refused. So you would possibly have nothing to show from putting money into it, you would need to pay every year until you pass away . I know someone in their 70s was quote £700 a month for Life insurance. (although it depends how much insurance you want)
Re. When you say you are ''putting money into the house'' - is this money you are just giving to DH or is it to the mortgage lender, builders, utilities etc? Do you know what you are actually paying for - it might be the wedding?

My new husband came with a great big house and I want it for my kids after I'm gone.

Life insurance does not increase as you get older. Once you’ve bought it. That’s the price you agree with the insurance company and that is what you pay until the policy ends. The only way you could end up with nothing is if the policy didn’t pay out because you werent truthful on the initial fact find when they the actuaries made the decision on the price or if you do not die before the policy runs out.

conversations that you should have before getting married!

Re. Life Insurance - be aware as you get older - so the cost of life insurance increases a lot or can even be refused. So you would possibly have nothing to show from putting money into it, you would need to pay every year until you pass away . I know someone in their 70s was quote £700 a month for Life insurance. (although it depends how much insurance you want)

You must be talking about a policy with decreasing term life assurance?

this isn’t usual nor is it usual to take out life cover in your 70s.

I think (might be wrong) what the poster was trying to say was that the cost of life insurance starting in your fifties is much higher than if you took a similar length coverage/and payout in your thirties.

Plus lots of people on here seem to think life insurance is kind of like a savings plan which always pays out. This is not true for most of the insurance taken out which, for a fixed price, pays out only in the term (e.g. 20 years, for 100k) if you actually die in that time period, most are only affordable to cover into early seventies or mortgage costs. Once you start looking at whole life term/guaranteed payouts, then what you pay in vs what you get back out is a terrible return most of the time.

I would invest/save the money for starters, there's some great rates around now after years of rubbish ones, although inflation is still outrunning them...but better than not saving at all.