DS using grandmothers card

[TinyHorns]

DS visits his grandmother (his dad's mum) every day but Saturday. He will visit after work make sure she is ok help he with whatever she needs and on Sunday helps with garden bits etc. he's a good lad to her. He is 23. His grandmother does have the early start of dementia so I would consider her vulnerable even if she is independent and lives alone.

DS has recently used her card to purchase a new hoover, some bits from ikea and to pay for a repair on his car. I asked him if she had said he could use her cards and he just said "I always help her out" it was never a yes, which is obvious she hasn't. Spoke to his dad about it and he just says how it doesn't concern him and she wouldn't mind anyway as he does a lot for her.

I'm feeling really uneasy about this. His dad starts his pointless talk of how I should be prioritising my son and to stay out of being concerned for his mum but that's just him being bitter about our past relationship. AIBU to get involved?

Because he’s entitled to it. She should probably be claiming attendance allowance too.

Two lots of benefits for popping in to see your granny? Some people 🤦‍♀️

He’s doing a lot more than “popping in”. Some people indeed. 🙄

You probably only know the tip of the iceberg here. I bet there’s a shedload of debt for this and that. One day the boy will need a deposit for a flat or uni fees paid and then thousands will vanish….

They sound awful people. Sorry.

This is so sad. She's got no one to advocate for her that isn't trying to take advantage of her. I'd also be reluctant to go to the police at first, talk to your son to begin with about how it's an abuse of trust and taking advantage of a vulnerable person, but that it's illegal and morally unacceptable. If he's as nice of a lad as you say then it will appeal to his conscience and he'll stop.

If he's not then... I don't see any other option but to at least contact social services, and probably the police. I'm so sorry.

Someone needs to talk to grandmother and try and find out what she has said if anything
My elderly DM has dementia - DB and I have power of attorney and my DC help her out with shopping and other stuff
often she says take some money for diesel when we run her around or offers lunch or if shopping adds our shopping to hers - but it’s only occasionally - small amounts and we all talk to each other about it.

financial abuse. theft.

Yeah this is criminal behavior. That said, not sure what I’d do in your position except have a very stern word including what consequences fraud has. Pity ex h is useless here and if he hasn’t got the paperwork in order is breaking the law himself by controlling her finances.

There was a thread on here with a daughter agonising about getting into debt and difficulty paying expenses directly for her mum in hospital

this is absolutely nothing like that. They are not ‘entitled' to any of her money, what the fuck!

Were those things purchased to help look after her? Ie, is the hoover in her house or ds house?

Just to add that if she's lost mental capacity to make financial decisions then it's also too late to appoint a Power Of Attorney. (This has to be done while they still have capacity to make that choice). I'd also be coming down hard on my son, it's ultimately financial abuse of a vulnerable elderly relative.

Same here. I know (professionally) of a number of people who have done this. They all have fraud convictions and most got jail sentences.

The grandmother doesn’t have to call the police. If another family member or professional (doctor, carer, social worker) does, the police / prosecution can use the bank records to charge fraud.

This is theft and she is also potentially a vulnerable adult in which case this is financial abuse. (If she has dementia, she will definitely become a vulnerable adult.)

I would also be questioning if anything else untoward is going on as it sounds like your son's sense of what's right is slipping.

This sounds serious and could be the start of something much worse.

I'm sorry but you need to do something about this. (Run it by your local Age UK, Social Services or the Police.)

I agree - this trend of needing a handout to help family is unpalatable.

this man is taking a vantage of his elderly grandmother - the answer isn’t a to get him more money.

OP in your shoes I would have a conversation about but he the legal and more important moral implications of his actions.

This does speak to his character. He is dishonest, selfish and a thief.

hopefully his grandmother has someone looking out for her. Over a few years he could clean her out.

In order to claim carer's allowance, he'd have to be doing at least 35 hours caring per week, plus earning under £139 per week, @Blossomtoes. You must know that?

Plus if you advise doing this formally, then obviously the bank, police and possibly the Office of the Public Guardian** would need to be informed.

OP, you can find out if there is a POA in place for this lady here:

www.gov.uk/find-someones-attorney-deputy-or-guardian

If there is then you can report your concerns here:

www.gov.uk/report-concern-about-attorney-deputy-guardian

OP you can find out if there is any formal agreement for exH to handle her money here.

You're in a better position if there is because you can report your concerns, that they're not acting in her best interests, to the Office of the Public Guardian.

He would have to be doing 35 hours of caring a week.

this is man visiting his granny and doing a bit of gardening at the weekend while stealing her bank card to get his cram fixed and dear knows what else.

society is completely broken when people start talking about being entitled to benefits for visiting their granny and doing some odd jobs.

Your son is a nasty piece of work and his dad isn’t much better.

When I was younger I used to shop for beauty items for my nana on a regular basis and she gave me the cash, wouldn’t take no for an answer. I’d never have used her bank card though as that’s her personal finances.

I bet your ex is doing similar. Report them both.

My nana always used to say eg re highlights for my hair etc that she’d pay for it and I never let her. Why would I? Same with clothes. I would say occasionally yes there’s this jacket but only because she gave me money for Christmas etc otherwise.

The one time I did accept help was when my tooth was knocked off or a huge chunk in an accident and I had very little money, so she offered to pay for that and said it was a gift. I didn’t ask though, she offered.

People with dementia can get paranoid very quickly. What if she starts accusing him of theft? It's not unknown for a person with dementia to tell someone to take payment then forget they said that a day later.

You need to explain that to your son.
He's not nice and helpful if he's helping himself to payment in an underhanded way.

I'd strongly suggest he gets a hard backed notebook for her house and writes down everything he buys with her card, with the dates and amounts. After that, it's their business.
If there are other siblings besides your Ex then there could be awful fallout from this.

Illegal. Surely?

My aunt and uncle one of there sons did the same with my grandad and luckily they both stood up together and told the police but first they gave my cousin an opportunity to pay the money back into grandma's account but after the set dead line and he hadn't they reported him. Unfortunately this impacted on a lot of things work etc but a thief is a thief. But I still remember the turmoil with my aunt and uncle so hard but they did the right thing and kept there consciousnesses clean.

It sounds as though your son and his father are bleeding that poor woman dry. Honestly, I think you should report this to adult social services.

Would he tell his mates he was taking his granny's bank card and using it to buy stuff he fancied?

Nah, because then they'd know he was a thieving little shit.

Shameful.

Is the dad not that bothered cos it saves him from looking after his mum from time to time. The son is a dodgy fucker helping himself to grans money to fix his car considering he walks there. I wonder how helpful he'd be if there wasn't a financial incentive.