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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

20 year old lazy, dirty son

532 replies

PissedOff2020 · 27/07/2023 14:10

Really at my wits end. Sorry this is a lengthily one.

We have 4 boys, eldest is 20 & dropped out of Uni after the first term - well over 18 months ago now. He didn’t tell us of course, had 5 weeks off over xmas and made no attempt to look for work. When we eventually found out and asked why the hell he hadn’t been looking for work he said he ‘wanted to chill and have the xmas break’. He was 19 then.

Mu husband eventually found him a job 2 months later, as ds’s effort was non existent. Zero hours contract and all good at first. His room was a dirty,dirty hovel with a smell coming out (think plates, food, rubbish etc all over floor). Carpet ruined, walls filthy.. clothes all over floor - can’t even open door there is that much shit. Anyway, that’s been a constant cause of arguments in house - just clean it ffs! He’s just got worse with that, we are quite house proud and I resent the smell upstairs- it’s a joke. He never contributes to household chores, despite countless conversations about it. Just does the bare minimum to get by.
Faat forward to now, his zero hours is currently working out at 8 hours a week. Been like that for 3 months and he’s not bothered to look for a job. We’ve told him he needs full time job, job hunted for him, sent him linked to apply - he does nothing. He sleeps all the time and games all night, sat in his filth.
Took him abroad last month, in the hope to speak to him away from the augments at home and also let him see life outside his bedroom. He slept all day, total waste of money. When I spoke to him about it he couldn’t see any issue with staying in his hotel room all day.
Over the last 2 months he’s got even worse, doesn’t even speak to us. Literally walks in a room and ignores us - we say hello, he has headphones on and so can’t hear anything, but makes no effort to acknowledge us etc. He eats meals if we cook, otherwise lives off sandwiches and cereal.
I have had enough, it’s intolerable. Constant tension and frustration in the house over it. Spoke to him and said I felt like he was treating us like doormats and he has no gratitude for what he has and enough was enough. Told him, the atmosphere in the house with him ignoring us was awful, just made us feel like he doesn’t give a shit about us. Asked why he wasn’t applying for jobs, he shrugged his shoulders. Told him we are not working our arses off, both working full time, for him to work a day a week and sleep all day. Then do not a thing around the house and blank us in the process.
Eventually it finished in a huge row after he snarled he’d apply for jobs but we shouldn’t speak to him at all anymore. Genuinely like he was angry we expected him to work. To add, even before his hours were really slashed he’s only ever worked around 25-30 hours per week at best. He’s had it so easily but he hasn’t a single bit of appreciation. We’ve spoken to him a year ago when he said he was unhappy at work - suggested all sorts, he was going to look into things but he never did.
I just don’t know what to try next. Explained to him over and over before yesterday this is his chance to build his career, we are supporting him whilst he does that. He’s not though, he is quite happy to do nothing and wait until it’s at breaking point - which is where I am at.
Anyone been here? Any advice from any others?

OP posts:
porridgeisbae · 27/07/2023 19:25

YANBU but I would say there's something wrong with him OP (like others, I speak from experience.)

This is some sort of MH and/or neurodiversity issue I think. See if you can get him to go to the doctor to discuss it.

At the very least, maybe get him a multivitamin and mineral supplement as his diet will not be helping him cognitively and his energy levels.

I was like this and there were all sorts of things going on with my mental health, social functioning etc that even I didn't realise the extent of at the time.

I've never been able to work really, due to a severe MH disability (bipolar) which didn't really become clear until I was 24, and some very impairing ND traits. The only time I worked full time was for two weeks- soon after that I had my first hospital admission for six weeks.

I hope that won't be the case for your DS though.

Sierra26 · 27/07/2023 19:26

PissedOff2020 · 27/07/2023 14:18

Forgot to ask the question - am I being unreasonable to force him to work full time?

I’ve not read anything past this but this made me feel sick. Of course you’re not BU.

Give him an ultimatum and in the meantime switch off the internet or change the password so he can’t game. Gaming is so dangerous when influencing people to live their lives like this.

porridgeisbae · 27/07/2023 19:27

I dropped out of education two or three times but got a First in the end as that year I happened to be doing better.

LuluBlakey1 · 27/07/2023 19:29

Chuck him out. Give him a week to find somewhere else to live. Don't budge from it at all. Change the locks, put his stuff in bags outside. He is treating you both like shit and you are letting him.

Ahsoka2001 · 27/07/2023 19:29

So he DOES have a job but you don't like the number of hours?

LuluBlakey1 · 27/07/2023 19:31

porridgeisbae · 27/07/2023 19:25

YANBU but I would say there's something wrong with him OP (like others, I speak from experience.)

This is some sort of MH and/or neurodiversity issue I think. See if you can get him to go to the doctor to discuss it.

At the very least, maybe get him a multivitamin and mineral supplement as his diet will not be helping him cognitively and his energy levels.

I was like this and there were all sorts of things going on with my mental health, social functioning etc that even I didn't realise the extent of at the time.

I've never been able to work really, due to a severe MH disability (bipolar) which didn't really become clear until I was 24, and some very impairing ND traits. The only time I worked full time was for two weeks- soon after that I had my first hospital admission for six weeks.

I hope that won't be the case for your DS though.

Alternatively he is bone idle, couldn't give a shit and unpleasant. A multivitamin is unlikely to help. Chuck him out tomorrow,

WiddlinDiddlin · 27/07/2023 19:32

Hufflemuff · 27/07/2023 17:59

This could have been written about my brother honestly. He's just as foul- however he's now 27 and because my parents didn't do enough to kick him up the arse when he was never going to change. They kept thinking of him as a child but at the same time saying "well he's an adult now... I can't tell him to switch off the xbox at 11pm even though it shakes the whole fucking house and wakes us up all night every night". PLEASE don't be like them. You need to stop thinking of him as an adult and continue to parent him until he acts like an adult. He needs all the restrictions at home you would place on a 13 year old, because that is how he is acting.

Turn off the WiFi/change the passwords and stick to it until he's done his room. Like earning a bit of screen time as a child.

Take away his xbox and drive it to your work if he's being particularly horrible to you. Like punishing a kid. All the punishments except for stopping him going out.

Until he's found a proper job tell him he is not having any allowance from you. Don't subsidise ANYTHING.

Ghost of Christmas future:
My brother literally said to my mum last month - "I don't know why you bothered having children because you don't want to look after them" HE'S TWENTY FUCKING SEVEN. He still thinks he's totally their responsibility.

He works 10 hours a week at the same place as my dad. He works 8pm-11pm but got asked to work till 2am last month because someone couldn't come in. He rang my dad demanding my dad sit in the car from 11pm-2am to wait for him. When he refused and said he needed to get the bus, he came home at 2am and pushed my dads stuff off the side onto the floor and disconnected his phone from being charged. (Why didn't my dad find this scene and storm upstairs and pummel his shitting xbox to dust!?! I don't even think he confronted him)

He's about 30 stone, prediabetic and both his knees are already fucked. He's got a massive food addiction to the point where he gets paid and 80% of his money is spent on takeaway food, despite my mum cooking every night. He ordered £40 worth of KFC last week and ate it all. Then called in sick for 2 days because he had heart burn and the shits.

My parents have to LOCK AWAY all food that isn't healthy stuff hes not interested in. They have hiding places for biscuits, chocolate and crisps even peanut butter (he eats it like winnie the pooh) and ham slices all over the house because my brother will see someone's bought 12 packs of walkers and eat them all in 1 sitting or a pack of ham and scoff it all in 1 sitting. When asked why he would do that he shrugs and says - "I was hungry get over it they're just crisps" AND THEY DO.... Why don't they send him to the shops IMMEDIATELY to replace the item, id be like "get your shoes on and get to coop to purchase me more". I would do that every single time he steals until he's fed up with it. My mums been reduced to keeping their food in a shed which she locks with a literal padlock.

Hes offered extra hours all the time but he has "nothing he wants" he has no ambition in life other than to eat shit, play video games and sleep. He has told my parents he is going to live with them until he dies.

He has zero friends. He's totally rejected a world outside of his bedroom, his only friends are some world of warcraft Virgins he plays online games with at 4am in America.

The WORST part. Hes a total DICK to them. He has not gotten my mum or dad a birthday, Christmas, mother's/father's day card or present for 3 years. Despite them living in the same house. When confronted he just says its "a waste of money and all a scam" yet spending £40 on KFC isn't a waste?? Hes never cleaned.

Its gotten to a point where I've told my parents, if they die before him they need to prepare him because I will literally never see him a day in my life after their funeral because of how disgusted I am with him. He will just go from expecting to be parented by them to getting parented by me and that is not happening. I've told them quite coldly too that they need to give me a bigger chunk of inheritance in order to repay for my time clearing their house, sorting out their affairs and arranging and paying for a funeral because he will do nothing and on principle he doesn't deserve 50% when he will put in no effort at all.

Rant over!! Sorry this post was a bit of therapy but I see your sons red flags here!!

If he is resident in the house when they die, he may well manage to get the whole house/clog up the works massively. If the house is left to you and he, 50/50, but he lives there and he can prove he has been dependent on them all his life, he could potentially challenge a will that sees him homeless too (I mean it would require effort of course, which it sounds like he wouldn't put in) - but even if not, selling a house with a stinky arsehole slob in it won't be at all easy.

I dread to think of the implications if they need to sell the property to pay for care homes and he is still resident.

Why on EARTH do people do this to themselves?!

Ahsoka2001 · 27/07/2023 19:33

25-30 hours per week seems fair enough tbh. My Mum only works about 27 hours a week and she's 51. Should we all "kick her out" (as some on this thread are suggesting) since she's not working the full 40 hours? Don't think so

FuppingEll · 27/07/2023 19:33

My brother was a lost young adult, had difficulties with depression and self worth, dropped out of uni, and floated around for a few years. Then he got CBT and he says it changed his life. He went back to school, got a first, has been working full time in the area of mental health ever since, owns a house, has a fully functioning life etc.

With the right help people can get out of it and thrive, I can guarantee if he was chucked out instead of helped he wouldn't be where he is today. He is a huge advocate for youth mental health services now because he knows what a massive difference it can make in young lives to be given the right support at the right time.

Some people need more time and help, but it doesn't make them 'losers' or 'wasters' or any of the other things that people on this thread and probably he himself are calling him.

Isthisreallyok · 27/07/2023 19:34

Another one asking is he depressed? And doesn’t want to admit/talk about it? I say so as I have a close family member with bi-polar and psychotic episodes and this was exactly what he was like when becoming ill. the refusal to clean his room and himself to the point where he smells, the inertia in terms of studying, general adulting, really resonates with me, this is exactly what he was like.

readbooksdrinktea · 27/07/2023 19:35

Ahsoka2001 · 27/07/2023 19:33

25-30 hours per week seems fair enough tbh. My Mum only works about 27 hours a week and she's 51. Should we all "kick her out" (as some on this thread are suggesting) since she's not working the full 40 hours? Don't think so

From the OP:

His zero hours is currently working out at 8 hours a week.

porridgeisbae · 27/07/2023 19:36

This idea that mental health makes a young adult incapable of launching into the world is bs, I believe

Some people will just have non specific 'failure to launch' I guess, but MH/ND issues will not help for sure, and yes they can stop people being able to do stuff. Not everyone can push through it by force of will or whatever. Professional help is vital if it's due to these issues but it can also take time to get well and sometimes that's all the person has it in them to focus on. Work doesn't help everyone's MH.

BedisBliss · 27/07/2023 19:36

porridgeisbae · 27/07/2023 19:25

YANBU but I would say there's something wrong with him OP (like others, I speak from experience.)

This is some sort of MH and/or neurodiversity issue I think. See if you can get him to go to the doctor to discuss it.

At the very least, maybe get him a multivitamin and mineral supplement as his diet will not be helping him cognitively and his energy levels.

I was like this and there were all sorts of things going on with my mental health, social functioning etc that even I didn't realise the extent of at the time.

I've never been able to work really, due to a severe MH disability (bipolar) which didn't really become clear until I was 24, and some very impairing ND traits. The only time I worked full time was for two weeks- soon after that I had my first hospital admission for six weeks.

I hope that won't be the case for your DS though.

Can we please not all say he's a lazy shit when we have no idea of the nuances and possibly don't have experience of what the OP is going through? Not everyone sails through life without hiccups. Totally agree with the above.

Ahsoka2001 · 27/07/2023 19:37

readbooksdrinktea · 27/07/2023 19:35

From the OP:

His zero hours is currently working out at 8 hours a week.

Show quote history

Well, quite a lot of jobs are zero hour these days and it's always a risk that you won't get as many hours I suppose. Someone's gotta take them. At least he's not completely jobless and will still be earning skills, something for his CV, etc.

YeahIsaidit · 27/07/2023 19:37

PorpoiseWithPurpose · 27/07/2023 19:09

Why are there so many men in their 20s wasting their lives? It’s endemic.

They're always video gaming, work-shy, unmotivated, “depressed” & living off mum and dad.

no previous generation has been so pathetic.

Loads of young adults had their formative years stolen from them through lock down. What should have been a time for teens to develop and enter into the world with more freedoms from childhood was spent interacting with their peers online and not much else. They couldn't meet up to do anything, hanging out, the rebellious sneaky drinking, partying etc etc (that we all did), lessons were online, seeing nobody outside of families face to face. People in Uni such as OPs son had their first true sense of independence taken away, back to home stuck under house rules instead of figuring shit out on their own. It'd be insane to think that didn't fuck with a lot of people.

It does sound like OPs DS is depressed, has ADHD or both. It's not a case of grow up, get your finger out and live in the real world, its having a jumbled up head, seeing the mess around you, likely being pissed off by it and genuinely being unable to sort it, it's like your brain shorts out, you have to teach yourself or learn how to deal or you spiral, it's fucking hard

Ahsoka2001 · 27/07/2023 19:39

PorpoiseWithPurpose · 27/07/2023 19:09

Why are there so many men in their 20s wasting their lives? It’s endemic.

They're always video gaming, work-shy, unmotivated, “depressed” & living off mum and dad.

no previous generation has been so pathetic.

He's "wasting his life" and "work shy" cause his job is a zero hour contract?

I don't understand. It's not like he doesn't have a job at all

Fluffylittlepup · 27/07/2023 19:41

porridgeisbae · 27/07/2023 19:36

This idea that mental health makes a young adult incapable of launching into the world is bs, I believe

Some people will just have non specific 'failure to launch' I guess, but MH/ND issues will not help for sure, and yes they can stop people being able to do stuff. Not everyone can push through it by force of will or whatever. Professional help is vital if it's due to these issues but it can also take time to get well and sometimes that's all the person has it in them to focus on. Work doesn't help everyone's MH.

This is true. Therapeutic Communities are more helpful for people struggling with a variety of mental health problems. Unfortunately we have a government who believe ‘work is the answer to everything and anyone who doesn’t is a lazy scrounged’. You will see this in the media and most people will agree.

Fluffylittlepup · 27/07/2023 19:41

*scrounger

Daisyhillsareblooming · 27/07/2023 19:41

Tough love , he either starts pulling his weight or he gets accommodation of his own . He’s an adult and needs to start realising life isn’t a free ride .

Appleofmyeye2023 · 27/07/2023 19:42

Ahsoka2001 · 27/07/2023 19:33

25-30 hours per week seems fair enough tbh. My Mum only works about 27 hours a week and she's 51. Should we all "kick her out" (as some on this thread are suggesting) since she's not working the full 40 hours? Don't think so

Does your mum sit on her arse all the rest of the time, being waited on hand and foot?

MixedBlessings · 27/07/2023 19:48

Ahsoka2001 · 27/07/2023 19:33

25-30 hours per week seems fair enough tbh. My Mum only works about 27 hours a week and she's 51. Should we all "kick her out" (as some on this thread are suggesting) since she's not working the full 40 hours? Don't think so

He works 8 hours pw.

Maiden2021 · 27/07/2023 19:51

PissedOff2020 · 27/07/2023 17:08

Thanks for the replies.

We have wondered about depression. He is up and down so then I dismiss it. Pay day he used to quite okay, would go out then etc. Thinking he was down was partly the reason for taking him away, try get him in a different environment and have quality time altogether without all the stresses of work, school runs and housework. He didn’t even want to come, I thought it was help us all and we’d maybe come around the corner. Yes, more fool me.

We don’t pay for anything of his, just food and I can’t see him starve but will stop cooking. We do also charge him a small about of board.

Yes wi-fi can go at night.

The ADHD suggestion isn’t something I’d ever considered so will do some reading up on that.

Going to have a good read through all your replies. Cheers

Oh, come on OP. This small info was CRUCIAL but initially left out for effect maybe.

He IS functioning and engaging. This is easier than you made it. 1. Increase what you charge him to firstly cover for a cleaner to me and clean his room DAILY or 3 times week as long as the smell is tolerable to you. Secondly, if you want, enough to include food you cook in his charge.2. Ensure the charge is expensive enough to make him get a job longer than 8 hours.

He will either tidy up, pay up, or if he starts paying up, height realise he can afford to live in a bedsit and move out. You should have increased the board when your H got him that 25-30 hours job.

Maiden2021 · 27/07/2023 19:52

cleaner to *come in

nonumbersinthisname · 27/07/2023 19:52

It’s possible to be struggling adjust to adult life while still trying to be a considerate member of the household. If someone isn’t even acknowledging that being an adult and living in a house with others means you take on a fair share of responsibilities (how ever you decide what they are for you) then it’s definitely straying into cheeky fucker territory.

if he does have some kind of MH issue, again he’s an adult and he needs to start taking responsibility for dealing with it. I suspect any form of neurodivergence would have shown up before now, so either he’s been masking it or whatever coping mechanisms he had are no longer working for him.

Maiden2021 · 27/07/2023 19:52

he might- no height