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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

Stranger child takes your toddler to the toilet

128 replies

Sparklybutold · 22/07/2023 23:09

I had a really unsettling experience today and I wanted to gauge opinions.

My husband and I took our 3 year old daughter to soft play today. We were sat on a couch, between my husband and I we were playing/watching our daughter. A father and his 2 daughters sat near us. I struck up conversation with the father. His 2 daughters were 12 and 13. His 12 year old started to interact with our daughter straight away. At first I was a bit surprised as she was very forward and stroked/picked our daughter up which our DD responded to, seeming at ease. The 12 year old then asked if she could play with our daughter and I said yes. I was watching them but the soft play was fairly large. I thought there was only one entrance/exit so wasn't too anxious as I could see if my DD left and continued to chat with the father. After about 5 minutes I got up to look for my DD and I couldn't find her. I came back to my DH to get him to go into the soft play to see if he could find her (I have a mobility/pain disease which limits my movement). He couldn't find her either - I got up straight away and as soon as I got to my DH I saw my DD come out of the toilet with the 12 year old. The 12 year old said she washed her hands. I asked whether my DD asked to use the toilet, the 12 year old seemed a little guarded. DD seemed fine showing me she washed her hands. DD wanted to go back to play with the 12 year old. I restated to the 12 year old that if my DD needed the toilet again to come get me or her dad. My DH and I took it in turn to then watch them both. I then went to the toilet and when I came back I could hear my daughter saying mummy, I came out and saw my DD was looking for me. The 12 year old was trying to encourage her to continue playing but I could see my DD wanted to leave. So I scooped her up, said bye to the father and his 2 daughters and left.

This happened about 8 hours ago and I still feel very uneasy about it all. Effectively for roughly 10 minutes I had no idea where my daughter was.

So AIBU and overthinking it or AINBU?

OP posts:
Original poster
Sparklybutold · 23/07/2023 00:20

I need to put this to rest now. Plus I need to sleep. Thanks to everyone for there insight 💐

OP posts:
blacknredsweeties · 23/07/2023 00:20

You need to look at the definition of hyper vigilant.

Inauthentic · 23/07/2023 00:23

Sorry to hear that @Sparklybutold

It's probably good to be aware how your own experience and trauma can colour your perception of what could have happened.

And how guilty you feel about not watching her all the time.

caringcarer · 23/07/2023 00:23

The most important thing is you have your DD safe with you and you won't allow yourself to get distracted next time. No harm done.

HairMb · 23/07/2023 00:23

EasyPeelersAreNotSatsumas · 23/07/2023 00:17

There is something seriously wrong with your thinking.

Show quote history

Can I ask why?

PenguinLove1 · 23/07/2023 00:25

When my son was a toddler whenever we went on holiday little girls aged 10-12 always wanted to help watch him and play with him - he was very cute and good fun and that age of little girl normally likes playing 'mum' in a way to little ones - its very very common for them to want to play with real life dolls in a way after they have outgrown actual dolls. My 10 year old niece has started loving babies recently when she never cared before - must be hormones i suppose as they start puberty

She probably felt grown up and responsible taking her to the loo then realised when she saw you that it might not have been a great idea

No harm done, chalk it up to a learning experience about how you will watch her in future situations.

Opine · 23/07/2023 00:25

@blacknredsweeties and you need to log off.

OP I get it in a way I wish is didn’t . Must be very nice for those who don’t think it will ever happen. Get some rest and call it a lesson learnt

GrannyAchingsShepherdsHut · 23/07/2023 00:25

I agree it's most likely she was treating your DD like a dolly and playing at being 'mum'. Face to face with real mum she could hardly admit that, I suspect that's why she seemed anxious, she knew she shouldn't have done it, and I'm sure your face was showing you weren't happy, I know mine would have been!

Not quite this situation but I had an incident once with an older child latching on to my younger one and trying to 'baby' her. DD was having none of it thankfully. But I can see she would have absolutely taken her to the toilet given half a chance. She tried to physically carry her off more than once. Her parents were just smiling indulgently and wittering about how she loves children while I tried to politely get her off my child without causing a scene or upsetting anyone. It was a friend's birthday party, so could have become awkward!

I'm not sure how you'd go about teaching her that a child is OK to play with, but is a stranger. Absolutely teach her no going to the toilet with anyone except xyz, of course, but the danger as PP mentioned of an older child leading yours somewhere unsuitable (like a big slide) or just losing interest and abandoning them is quite high.

I get what you're saying about watching the exit and so thinking they must still have been in the play frame and therefore safe - soft play is awful for your child deciding to sit in the one blind spot and give you heart attack while you frantically search for them, only to eventually spot them sorting the ball pool by colour.

blacknredsweeties · 23/07/2023 00:26

Opine · 23/07/2023 00:25

@blacknredsweeties and you need to log off.

OP I get it in a way I wish is didn’t . Must be very nice for those who don’t think it will ever happen. Get some rest and call it a lesson learnt

😂

Atnilpoe · 23/07/2023 00:32

I’m unnerved by the people who don’t think this is a red-flag situation- because it is. Anyone with any safeguarding training will tell you that. That’s not to say anything untoward has happened, but the 12 year has poor boundaries- for reasons unknown.

Dad on his own with two girls, one of whom goes off alone with your toddler? Not good. It is not just hyper vigilance that would cause OP’s shackles to be raised in these circumstances.

ResultsMayVary · 23/07/2023 00:34

Some kids find it easier to play with younger or older kids rather than their peers. It can be because they struggle with social nuance and therefore interacting with their peers can make them very anxious. They can appear very confident and may be quite bossy with the younger child.

HairMb · 23/07/2023 00:38

Atnilpoe · 23/07/2023 00:32

I’m unnerved by the people who don’t think this is a red-flag situation- because it is. Anyone with any safeguarding training will tell you that. That’s not to say anything untoward has happened, but the 12 year has poor boundaries- for reasons unknown.

Dad on his own with two girls, one of whom goes off alone with your toddler? Not good. It is not just hyper vigilance that would cause OP’s shackles to be raised in these circumstances.

Same here as a sexual abuse victim.

Cranberriesandtea · 23/07/2023 00:38

Did you ask your 3 year old if she went to the loo with the 12 year old or just wash her hands? She would be able to tell you at the time but now maybe not

Destinedforfakeness · 23/07/2023 00:42

Honestly you need to watch your kid more carefully. The risk comes from that not that a 12 year old has abused her, perhaps focus on your own errors. It's not particularly normal to jump to these conclusions but I do understand why given your experience which is horrific and I'm so sorry you went through this. But really try to not be too hyper focused on abuse happening. Especially from 12 year old strangers it's very unlikely.

I work with kids of all ages and in my experience lots of older primary school and up live to play with little ones. I think they think if them as like dolls! Also if the girl is used to little ones taking her to the loo is very standard.

So I think you really don't have anything to worry about.

Wenfy · 23/07/2023 00:45
  1. Your 3 year old should be able to tell you what she did in the loo, and should have some awareness of stranger danger.
  2. 12 is not too old to be in soft play. This thread is ridiculous. The only reason why most softplays have this limit is because many kids are so heavy they risk hurting other kids / breaking equipment. An average sized 12 yo can have just have much fun as younger kids.
  3. You made the mistake of not watching your child. Don’t try to minimising that by attributing nefarious intentions on a 12 yo. Next time watch your child more carefully and if it’s not possible then don’t take her to softplays as large as this.
Pebstk · 23/07/2023 00:48

So much panic and scaremongering here.

How many young children in UK in last 30 years killed by another child? I can think of little Jamie Bulger and that’s it. A very small number of children seriously attacked by other. It is not a routine, common, likely or even rglegilsf thing.

Children are not waiting in soft play to abduct and/or abuse other children.

Predatory abductors do not routinely frequent soft play and sit with numerous other people who recognise them, with likely security cameras inside and outside (well if they did they would be very thick).

HairMb · 23/07/2023 00:48

No you lot are ridiculous.

A random 12 year old should not be taking a toddler they don’t know to the toilet.

jennyjones198080 · 23/07/2023 00:49

There was an older girl on my street growing up who was like this. A real mother hen. She is now a nurse:

Bossy, took charge, organised everyone: she would have thought nothing if taking a child to the toilet at that age - or changing a nappy without being asked or seeking permission. I remember a row about her feeding a baby another baby’s bottle. Parents outraged. Maybe the baby was breastfed - I can’t remember!

i suspect this was nothing sinister. But a child that young needs closer watching.

MargaretThursday · 23/07/2023 00:50

When I was that age I was used to looking after my younger cousins, and loved doing so. Often if we went out I'd end up looking after younger children who attached themselves to me.
If one had said they needed the toilet, I'd have asked if they needed help, and If they'd said they didn't I'd have taken them to the toilet and waited outside the cubical then reminded them to wash their hands. If they needed help then I'd have handed them back to the parents.

isn't that far more likely than she struck up a friendship so she could take the child to the toilet so she could abuse her?

Atnilpoe · 23/07/2023 00:52

@Pebstk

vanishingly unlikely for these dreadful things to happen to a child. But the behaviour OP saw today was a red flag. And the point of red flags is that we notice them and not ignore them, and thereby reduce the chance that the unlikely event happens to our child. You plan for the worst, and hope for the best. It isn’t scaremongering.

Fireroselily · 23/07/2023 01:04

For those saying 12 year old girl unlikely to be an abuser, I unfortunately know of 2 around that age that were (both were also being abused) it's a sad cycle and you really just never know. Hoping no lasting damage has occured and you and your family can move forward with some lessons learned OP

AngryGreasedSantaCatcus · 23/07/2023 01:12

I'm a survivor of CSA, several times over by various perpetrators (peers,family members,adult in charge) so I'm very aware of various scenarios and situations. However, facts are facts and if all the girl did was take OP's DD to the toilet (without actually helping her,and even then it depends) that is not an automatic red flag.

The same goes for "lack of boundaries " . A lot of schools encourage and pick y6 children to help with little ones in EYFS during playtimes or lunch. These older children help the younger ones eat, hold their hands, play with them, might give a cuddle or reassurance if they get hurt or are upset, walk them to the toilet, remind them to watch their hands etc. This then becomes habit and their norm, not a "lack of boundaries ".

Safeguarding means looking out for possible red flags, not always jumping to the worst conclusion.

jannier · 23/07/2023 01:18

I'm surprised that kids of this age want to go to soft play and can find a soft play they are not too big for most 10 year olds struggle with the height limits around me.

Honeychickpea · 23/07/2023 01:21

DillyDallyingAllDay · 22/07/2023 23:47

Did you ask your DD what happened? Maybe she could shed some light as to why they went to the toilet?

Yes, the insight is most likely that the child wanted to pee. Mumsnet is certainly not what it used to be.

askmeonemoretime · 23/07/2023 01:27

This could have been me at 12. I was not abused, love kids and went on to work with them. 12 year old me would have been massively anxious at a stranger demanding to know what I was doing with their child.