To think teens have too much power?

[Peverellshire]

And teens having too much power is a contributing factor to poor mental health & unhappiness?

Sulky teen refusing to come out of room on family hols & refusing to have dinner with family etc as boring, missing boyfriend, etc..Should we cut them slack? It can sour whole exp with younger sibs etc, as ab atmosphere.

Minor example but obvs more major ones. Mental health dips which coincide with things they don’t want to do & inc calling all shots? Not to minimise genuine mental health issues.

Hard to say tbh. We never had this kind of problem with dd. I would want to hear a bit more from their perspective about why they find family dinners boring etc.

A lot of "mental health" is just someone unhappy at not getting their own way.

I agree with this. I think we have got to the point where every negative feeling is 'poor mental health' when actually alot of the time its just normal life and kids need to deal with some negative issues.

@MrsBennetsPoorNerves conversation boring, apparently, they text.

I am struck at contrast, my gen, parents decided where we went & we had to suck it up.

Power? Are you mistaking this for choice? Refusal to be dictated to?

I think it's absolutely fine for any member of a family to opt out of a dinner tbh. I always gave mine this power you speak of. I'm not a controller though and we are a ND household so probably operate very differently, but choice for mine was normal.

One of them never ate with use. One of them always did. It made no difference to their overall being and as they have grown into independent adults they are both managing the world just fine. I see them both regularly now they have moved out and we had a mainly stress free teenage stage.

If you can see any logical reason why your teen much be present at your dinner then sure, push and argue with them, but if you take a step back you may see it's actually not important

I'd agree. A lack of boundaries can lead to feeling insecure and overwhelmed by the world, which in turn can lead to poor mental health.
I also think that teens can convince themselves that feeling sad, frustrated, nervous etc is poor mental health. I'm not saying that they should be dragged from their room but it should be made clear that there are certain expectations of them and if they aren't met then there will be consequences - internet will be stopped, phone removed, no take away food etc.
It's not about punishing them - if they choose not to engage with family life they don't get the good bits.
Good luck, I hope your sulky teen comes out of their room but if they don't then don't let it spoil your holiday.

A good answer & perspective. Influence & not control is key, but how?

The odd opt out dinner, sure, permanent ‘dark cloud’ surliness, not good.

If you can see any logical reason why your teen much be present at your dinner then sure, push and argue with them, but if you take a step back you may see it's actually not important

I think it is extremely important and has always been non negotiable to me. It is crucial for parents and teens to have daily communication and this happens best meal times, and my teens ate with me every day and still tend to, any time they are at home, and not actively wfh, in their 20s. And we still communicate at these times

On holidays I would just do our own thing and leave them to it, anything else if it is not affecting anyone else let them be

Sure no one has to 'get them' but it can only affect others if you let them

If they don't want to talk at dinner ignore them

If they have genuine issues address them if it is a choice don't engage

I think social media has had a big influence.

Teens can remain in their rooms because they can access the world from there.

They can sit in their rooms looking at SM and convince themselves everyone else has these amazing lives and that makes them feel low because they are shut in a room alone not living that life.

They aren't getting to experience the real world by getting and and having tangible experiences.

I agree that influence rather than control is the key. But I also think it's a very slippery slope when we allow children too young to have too much control because boundaries help children feel safe. And lack of boundaries can lead to problems with mental health and attachment.

Hmm. My sister was exactly like this when she was a teenager. She's in her early 60s, has no mental health issues and a very successful career.

Some teenagers just find it harder than others I think. Luck of the draw

We didn’t have/need boundaries in early years as they were all ‘please may I have 5 mins extra reading time before lights now’…& now that’s problematic.

‘Out’ not now.

If you weren’t great with boundaries early on, you reap what you’ve sown with teens? Any way to effectively set later?

My family wasn't really like that. My parents always treated us with respect and involved us in decisions etc. In return, we respected them back. I guess they were ahead of their time.

We generally tried to talk about stuff at the dinner table that dd found interesting. For a period, that meant talking quite a lot about her friends and what was going on in their lives - I learned an awful lot about why some kids didn't get on with their parents!

I get that that might be harder to focus on stuff that interests her when there are younger siblings around. I don't agree that the problem is too much power though.

It depends on your family. Our communication wasn't lacking because we didn't all sit round a table at 6pm. That seems forced to me (again, ND house) - mine used to come and talk to me when they wanted to, not when I decided. We would never have all been up for a chat at a stressful meal time. I realise people place huge importance on this daily dinner to enable chat but there are other ways too.

There are other ways, of course, but a routine that involves daily time together and communication is important, and meals are a good opportunity for that. If there is another daily opportunity instead, fine. But a regular daily conversation is very important. Its all very well saying they come to you if they want to talk, but that is a completely different type of conversation.

You did have boundaries, you had bedtimes and they had manners- asking for more time.

Maybe it'd be good to think about new boundaries and general expectations. Maybe you could agree on these together and agree what the consequences should be if the expectations aren't met.

Life isn't a free ride and teens like anyone else feel better about themselves if they contribute to family life.

I think sometimes teens do need to be coaxed or bribed out of their moody pit and off their phones for the good of their mental health. Sitting on your own scrolling through social media all day is not good IMO and just enhances the moodiness. It is also not good to use MH as a regular excuse for opting out unless there is actually a genuine reason or it becomes entrenched. Make some things non negotiable such as dinner or some time with siblings on holidays. This is not to be controlling but for their own health and wellbeing.

Have you asked your DC why they don't want to join in? They may have their own very good reasons.

DD has ASD and stopped wanting to eat at the table a while ago, we had a conversation on why, for her it was too much attention being sat so close together, my jaw clicks when I eat and it would put her off and there were a couple of other reasons. So, we sit in the living room with trays instead, we are further apart so there's less attention, my jaw is less annoying etc. She still sits at the table for special occasions or when at restaurants but it makes her day-to-day life easier.

I think social media has had a big influence

Teens can remain in their rooms because they can access the world from there.

Hmm. I was a teenager in the 1980s - didn't even have a TV in my room - and I still spent hours holed up in there, reading and listening to music. I hated going on holiday with my family, too, and spent most of the time moaning about being dragged along.

@orangeleavesinautumn

ts all very well saying they come to you if they want to talk, but that is a completely different type of conversation.

I didn't say they came to me IF they wanted to talk/. I said WHEN. There is a huge difference there. I don't think our conversation was different at all, it was juts done in a non conventional way.

I get you are pro family dinners for daily chat. I think it is a fabulous method for many families. But, when it isn't working, as is the case here, sometimes thinking outside of that box is helpful.

Peverall it's absolutely possible to set the boundaries later. It's harder but possible. It can also leave long term effects not having boundaries earlier but I work with a lot of looked after children and despite them pushing against boundaries at first they do generally accept them because they learn it makes you feel secure.

Yep, fully agree with this. In schools, if kids don't 'feel' like going to lessons , they can sit in a quiet room and do some nice colouring or something while someone panders to them.
If I didn't feel like going to lessons I'd get detention.

To an extent I think you need to show your teen you trust her to do what’s right for her. And tell her so. Make it clear she’d be really appreciated at the table - she’s loved and wanted, tell her explicitly - but that you respect whatever decision she makes.

Not a bad thing to learn you don’t actually have to do social things which you find difficult.

Adulthood is hard enough and when/if a partner enters the scene, you don’t want to have modelled to your young adult that she needs to comply all the time. She needs a degree of autonomy. She’s not actually harming anyone by opting out as long as it’s not because she doesn’t feel wanted.