To be raging - school holiday camp

[peoniesandpumpkins]

Booked my DC into the holiday camp at our local tennis club. They’ve just turned the age that you can go from but it’s just 3.5 hrs (they do pre school 2 days 9-3 and 3 days 9-1:30 so used to longer days etc.) It’s not all tennis, lots of games.

They have absolutely loved it. Been twice now. My mum picked up last week (she knows a lot of the coaching team) and they mentioned he’d been great, my mum asked about the toilet and they mentioned ‘oh yes they know where the toilet is’ ‘jokingly’ apparently. We took that to mean they’d been going quite a lot, but at least not peed themselves!! Husband picked up on Mon, great time again. Due to go tomorrow, really excited!

Logged onto work email (not personal) tonight to see an email from organiser sent at 8:43PM saying ‘sorry but don’t think peonies child is really ready for 3.5 hrs of tennis (it’s not 3.5 hrs of tennis) they are more interested in going to the toilet and this impacts on the coaching team’

Honestly, I do know that they can be a little bugger for wanting to go off to loo if they think they can go have a nosey/explore and get away with it. I apologised said as much but, said they love it and that messaging at 8:40 odd at night (to my work email (wouldn’t have seen it ordinarily) the night before was really not great, would they please let me have a chat, let them come tomorrow (really left me in the f’ing lurch) and if more of same then I understand.

They emailed back to say it’s a no as a member of staff has to take them to the toilet each time. I am confused about this as they normally have to be told to go toilet (unless opportunity for boggling - which they wouldn’t get if they have to go with an adult), so I’m like well yes I understand that and that is annoying but I am telling you that I am 98% certain that will stop once I’ve had a word and if it doesn’t then yes I’m in agreement. I just think it’s so shitty not to give them a last chance.

Also I don’t think it’s that they don’t want to have take them to the toilet full stop, as there are 2 children doing it who aren’t quite 5 (one not until the new year) who have been allowed as they have older siblings so surely if it’s an age thing they are having to take them to the loo when they need to go?!? DC quite capable of going on own physically iykwim. Can understand they need to be supervised.

If it was that they weren’t coping/joining in or didn’t have the motor ability then I understand but why not mention that then.

All just seems rather mean not to let us have a chat and give them another chance. Not to mention bloody unprofessional, she could have told me on Monday night or Tuesday night!

I do think I’m general holiday clubs provide less ‘care’ than a nursery setting. They have to be able to crack on and get on with it. And then activity style clubs are even further on the spectrum of needing to just listen and do the activity. You do get a feel of what setting is more appropriate by age once you’ve done a few.

From experience, there are some clubs I’d book my reception age child into next year and others I’d leave until at least y1. The ones that cater best to 4/5 year olds provide lots of down time, higher ratio etc, more childcare v coaching staff etc.

If they want to keep leaving the activity then they're probably not having as much fun as you think.
Whilst I think it was unreasonable for them to email you at such late notice, I also think it was a lot worse than you are imagining for them to turn down your money and not let them have a second chance.

I get that he likes to have a nosy around but it's interfering with the other children and instructors. Maybe it time to stop nosing around

Raging that a young child does not want to be the next Andy Murray? are they as keen as you think?

Also Scotland, kids been on holiday since late June. And those starting school in August will have 5th birthdays between 1.3.23 and 29.2.24 (January and February birthdays sometimes defer a year to be five and a half starting school).

If OP hadn't been checking work email in the evening (stop doing that) would they have turned your child away tomorrow?

This ^

But what else could they do when that was the emergency contact given?

Reading between the lines it sounds like your child has been (unintentionally perhaps) causing disruption through his many toilet visits. I know from experience that if one child in a group wants to go then it often starts a ripple effect where someone is asking every few minutes and nothing gets done! I don’t know how many facilities the club has access to and how close by but if a coach has to spend their time chaperoning back and forth with each child outside of allotted breaks then it’s bound to have an impact on the coaching they can do.
I work in a school during term time and a holiday club during the holidays. At school our facilities are just outside the classroom and I can send children by themselves but at holiday club I need to chaperone as the toilets are in another part of the building. As this takes me away from the main play area, I often ask if anyone else wants to go so I can take a group rather than be a yo-yo up and down the corridor. We cater for ages 4-12 and often have 30 kids with 3 staff so 1 person out of the room/play area can be tricky.

If he has only just started needing the toilet more frequently you might need to investigate the physical cause for this. Are you absolutely sure that it is just out of nosiness?

While your child is there, they are the staff's responsibility, not yours, and they should be able to manage their toilet trips.

Sorry but you should have used proper childcare like a holiday club that operates as childcare-usual hours being 8-6pm for working parents.it seem clear that your child is a wanderer and is going to the toilet and clearly known for wandering to the toilet is an a tip in itself..Which means a member of staff is used up solely on your child.They should have given you onewarning at least but I’m sure they would have actually tried already to deal with it themselves and your child is not behaving

This.
The tennis club sound like a farce.
I’d be insisting they gave proper notice and complaining- if they have children then obviously they’ll be going to the toilet!! YANBU. I’d be furious too!!

I'm more confused that posters aren't aware the UK isn't just England
Scotland has been on school holidays for 3 weeks already

Yes YABU here I think 5 is too young.

There's a Summer holiday club in our local park where they play tennis. Last summer I was coming out of the public toilets (a distance from the courts) and there was a very young girl waiting to use the loo (5 or 6yrs). She wasn't attended by anyone from the club, no adult to chaperone which was not good imo.

I think the club sound responsible as at least the adult is going with the children to the toilet. I'd look for more complete care from a club in the future.

@Mollymalone123 how does one distinguish between a holiday club that isn’t serving as a proper holiday club and one that is 😂😂 There’s only two that are a longer day and then it is only 9-4:30 but only takes from 6 years. The other, oh that’s drop off from 8:45 actually, also offers half days so that wouldn’t be a proper holiday club either then you are saying?

It sounds as if its a behaviour issue not that he needs the toilet a lot. Essentially he is being disruptive by pretending to need the toilet when he doesn't because, in your words, he's nosey. It does sound an odd behaviour, especially if he is supposedly enjoying it as much as you think he is. I suspect the staff are having to dedicate one person just to him and they just can't do that when there are so many other children's needs to look after.

They should have spoken to you about it earlier but it sounds as if he is just being too disruptive. Especially if it's causing other children to misbehave as well. It's mot unusual to ask a child who is being disruptive to leave an activity. He's just not mature enough to be in that setting.

Yes they handled it badly but I think you just need to chalk it up to experience. I would them to discuss it as there may have been other behaviours or circumstances that they didn't mention in the email that contributed to this. They have to think of all the other children they are responsible for, and if one member of staff is essentially out of action because they have to constantly supervise a child 1:1 they can't run the activity at all.

I also agree with other posters that saying "DC" and they" and then suddenly changing to "him" makes your OP very hard to follow.

Sorry @Mollymalone123 one only takes from 6 years, the other is at the other side of town I picked this as close and I know there’s 2 4yo in the class as well (younger siblings).

Presumably they emailed the one email address you gave them? I wouldn't give out my work email for personal stuff.
If only been twice and you haven't picked them up then they haven't had chance to talk to you about it.
Our tennis club arrange these as more of a learning activity- learn tennis, expend energy, its not billed as child care and the team are coaches not nursery nurses. The age limits are there to allow younger but capable kids to attend. It would be unfair to set the limit higher just because some kids aren't ready.

Yes YABU here I think 5 is too young.

If the club accept children aged 5 years and up ,then how can OPs 5 year old be too young?

I appreciate her child may have been causing unexpected disruption, but if the club doesn't feel they can accommodate children as young as 5 then they should raise the starting age.

I think raging is over the top, but YANBU to be annoyed at the cancellation at short notice, especially as there has been no prior messages about the toilet problems.

If you paid last Wednesday for a week they've intentionally waited.
They're probably full up for next week and wanted an excuse for you not to rebook.

@Moonberri yes I don’t doubt this but it would have been nice say last week for them to have to told me this, me to have had a word (which I’m 98% certain after which he would stop, he’s actually very good at listening once told and proper consequences are laid down) and given an opportunity…,or told me he couldn’t have come back on Monday - after he was last there not wait until 8:45 at night the night before he’s due to next attend, which I might not have seen until this morning!

@Whinge it's clearly unmanageable to keep taking a child to the toilet, she's too young. Maybe also not really enjoying the experience of tennis as going to the loo several times an hour indicates boredom. Unless the child is sick its just a distraction.

If the club has 5 years olds who need more care then 8 year olds they need more staff to help out.

They also need staff who are willing to say no to toilet trips…. But then in come the complaints about kids not being allowed!!!

OP you have a contract with this club, did you get any paperwork? They should at least give a weeks notice … not a few hours late at night.

Ring them this morning and speak to them - emails don’t get the real message across.

Sounds like you did drill it too hard tbh
Yes working in the holidays is shit....but not unusual.
Remember at thinks like tennis camp where it a couple of hours a day the "helpers" are probably 16-18yr old tennis players and not qualified teaching staff. It's likely the organiser couldn't catch you at pick up, or they hadn't had chance to discuss it.

It's not child care....when my kids were that age we used full time child care in the holidays, and progressed to full day holiday camps that were ofsted registered. 3.5 hrs of tennis I would see as an extended lesson and wouldn't even have asked or mentioned toilet breaks

If you knew your child was prone to doing this, why didn’t you prepare him? You should have explained to him that it’s like school/pre-school and he can’t go to the toilet all the time, and if he does he won’t be able to go. Frankly, he sounds too young (behaviour-wise).

My DC went to a similar club one Summer but it was obvious it was an activity club rather than childcare. If your son isn’t mature enough to cope with this, he shouldn’t be going anyway. They should have given you more notice but maybe they assumed he’d settle after the first couple of days (ie they gave him a chance) but have just had enough of the constant disruption.