DS wants to live with dad

[justanothermanicm0nday]

Kids dad hasn't really bothered the last few months, didn't see the kids for Father's Day, let down a couple of weekends (contact has dwindled to one overnight a fortnight) avoiding maintenance to the point he now owes £7k in arrears (meant to be just shy of £100 a week for 4 kids) csa finally deducted from his wage and after 2 months of payments quit his job. Ive only now just got payments but I expect this will stop again. He an GF have a very on and off relationship to the point last year she had him arrested - he also told me at this time she didn't want the kids at the house and resented them etc. they are back together. Also health concerns DS is diabetic and does no insulin at all when he is at dads (I'm having problems at home too but I'm on his case watching him and reminding him)

DS despite always actively avoiding staying (other 3 would stay and he would ask to come home or stay at a friends) is now saying he wants to live there full time. I am concerned because of the above reasons - there is also no space for him - he would be sleeping on a sofa full time.

I am upset to say the least and feel like dad is pushing it as a last ditch attempt to be difficult and mess things up financially for me. DS is very easily influenced by him.

Speaking to DS his reasons are that I have been on at him a lot (about tidying up after himself and his diabetes - which I have and have got cross at times also but he just doesn't listen and I do have to nag he is in a difficult thinks he knows best phase, but of trouble at school) also that dad wants to see him more and he implied that dad is blaming me for lack of time with them (which I am not at all I would happily do 50/50 to have a break I am run ragged)

I am happy for him to live at dads if that's what he really wants but ideally I want his dad to speak to me about it first properly, I would like that he at least has a bed (I have said happy he stays weekends no bed but weekdays/school times he needs a proper bed he can't sleep on a sofa full time)

I also really want his dad to step up with the other three kids he has and have them more than once a fortnight for a day (he's now requesting to stop all overnights) as I feel he's favouring eldest (which he always has done) and it's unfair and will cause resentment and how do I explain that eldest can see dad whenever but they can't?

Really in an ideal world he need to just generally have them all more I feel, he's only presenting to son as it's all or nothing no inbetween.

Son is 14 so I don't think I can stop him if I wanted to I am just worried for his welfare and the fairness on the other children.

There are 3 kids already at the ex house which is why space is a problem.

I've been speaking to DS today - he is staying at a friends house for the second day in a row. I asked about seeing him, it will of been a week tomorrow and he is skirting round the question saying he doesn't know, I said do you not want to come and see us and he said he is just having fun and he's going out all day.

Just makes me feel sad like he doesn't care

There'll be all sorts of things he's not ready to admit to OP, so don't be sad and don't push him. Just keep communicating in a relaxed way.

Sounds like he might be on his way back...

Not a chance I’d be paying maintenance for that child when he’s stopped paying for 3 others and owes 7k. Why would you?

He will go through child maintenance so I won't have a choice in regards to paying!

See my earlier response on how to set it up so it’s offsetable

Just a little update, son is back with me for the week and it's going fine however he still is 100% wanting to go back to dads. I've just been trying to have fun and not nag him (his room is so disgusting it's really hard to bite my tounge - I also feel like I'm skirting round him a bit which is annoying but I'm trying to keep the peace atm)

Before coming to stay his dad was trying to get him to sneak his passport out my house. We had a bit of an argument about it (me and son) his dad has fed him so much rubbish it's laughable.

Once dad is back I need to talk to him, I think he will be willing to talk as he tried to talk the day he wanted DS to get the passport (he was messaging son saying ask mum as I want to take you all on holiday) but son had already tried to take it before this and I'd said no and he knew it was for the DLA as I asked why his dad wanted it. I didn't talk that day as I was very angry and also his mum was collecting one of the kids for a sleepover so he went as he's gone no contact with his mum also as she's cottoned onto his lies and had an argument over his of having the kids once.

I am having real anxiety about what to say to dad, he didn't see the other three before he went away. I know I can't force him to see them I just feel so gutted for them but I don't want to get angry. It's frustrating trying to think of how to say stuff so he may actually listen however I think he's proven even if he agrees to my face he'll go behind my back anyway and do what he wants as the case with money.

I don't want to give him the passport. However I will transfer the DLA and child benefit for this month as it comes in into DS account then at the end of this month after my months leeway I will sign it all over. I'm not sure what they will claim as he must get universal credit even though they are both working. I have a horrible feeling his plan is to quit work completely.

I have been super stressed money wise, bf has mentioned he could possibly help me out a little (we were going to move in together in the new year anyway once his lease on his house is up) however I'm a little worried I'll get in trouble. I am wondering if I could perhaps take it as a loan or even just get a credit card to tide me over the next 6 months. I'm not sure what else to do as if their dad doesn't pay the child maintenance I won't be able to even pay all bills let alone any clothes, xmas, bdays etc.

I am not going to mention this to their dad as I just think he would go more out of his way to make it difficult money wise if he knew it would mess me up.

@dcadmamagain

In regards to the maintenance would that be the collect and pay to make it offsetable? So I do the £25% on top?

Send ex a list of all ds needs for school next month.
Please don't sign over your benefits just yet op.

All he needs really is a blazer and stationary. And a backpack. Maybe new training shorts.

I've got his trousers and shoes and ex mum got his shorts so it's not a huge amount still needed. Nowhere close to what I've already spent anyway.

That’s great he’s back with you for the week, a start

you pay a £20
set up fee for the collect by cms and then they take 4% off each month. It’s a pain but is the only way to ensure it’s offset against what he owes you

I wouldn't transfer any money to him at all.

So DS has been back at his dads a week now, ex is now going through sons nurse asking for letters to confirm son is living there. She is asking my permission. I honestly don't know what to do. Sons dad has not spoken to me at all. Son is barely speaking to me now and everytime I ask to see him he makes excuses. He still doesn't have a bed there the bedroom is half finished.

I had a thing from child maintenance saying their dad has now gone onto benefits so from October I will get £6 a week so there will def be no maintenance.

I literally will be £200 under meeting my basic bills and food that's without clothes, any money School ask for and school meal money, birthdays, Xmas, unexpected things. I feel very stressed out and angry at the situation.

I wont be able to provide the basics for my other three children and the other household has various holidays, a horse etc (no wonder son wants to go there) I have no idea how they manage this lifestyle on universal credit.

I could maybe increase my work hours but due to loosing the carers allowance and UC deducting 55% I think even working double what I do basically full time term time only I would be about £50 a month better off and I would need to find childcare after school for the younger two.

I feel totally stuck as I can't better myself and I don't have enough support with the kids to work full time.

I've at times this week thought perhaps just dropping the kids to their dads and just saying to have them all as I won't be able to afford them. I've been putting off signing my new rental contract because my dad is a guarantor and I'm worried I won't be able to meet the rent so may need to give notice.

Oh op how scary for you.
i have no advise for you really. Just sorry to hear the issue you are in. Is it worth going over benefits with someone like citizens advice?

I wouldn’t do anything to help your ex and would insist all payment for son at his house comes from his own money.

I would say that a week is still early days. They’re in a honeymoon period possible and I imagine you might hear more from one or both in a few weeks if disagreements arise.

Sorry you’re having such a stressful time OP. This looks like financial abuse continuing after divorce but I don’t suppose anyone can do anything about that if everything that’s happened is legal and above board. Don’t pay any money at all to/for your eldest son - you can’t afford it. If his dad is RP he can pay all the uniform and school trips and bus passes and phone contracts and dinners.
The thing about increasing your working hours is that it also often increases your earning potential long term, which would be a good thing for your long term financial security. Definitely go and see somewhere like citizen’s advice to make sure you’re claiming everything you’re entitled to and just someone real to bounce your ideas about how to manage your finances off.
If there’s a possibility of deducting the maintenance your ex will ask off the maintenance arrears he owes you then do that, even if it means it has to go through CMS and technically get charged more. He isn’t going to pay anything for as long as he can possibly get away with so offsetting maintenance for you eldest against debt to you he’s probably never going to make good on can only be a good thing.

It is, he hasn't paid anything for the kids for such a long time and now it's the other way round even him just having one he's going for everything knowing full well how much it will effect us. He doesn't see it as the kids money though he sees it as having to give me money and he has some weird anger at me. He refused to pay maintenance when he first left because he didn't want to give me money.

I hardly live a lavish lifestyle, we've had one holiday to the uk since he left 5 years ago and that was because it was a friends house so free, I have free haircuts from a friend, kids don't do clubs, we do do some days out but never eat out always packed lunch etc the only nice thing I have is a nearly 8 year old car that my nan initially financed and has now paid off for me. I could sell this and have considered it but I know she would be really upset, it would also take away all my freedom, reduce my ability to work due to timings and I don't really want to resort to public transport unless really needed. But even giving that up after the initial lump sum I would still just be breaking even perhaps £100 up if you out petrol etc but I'd still need to pay bus and trains etc.

I don't know what to say to the nurse.

I am still hoping son comes back but I don't think he will for a while, other son was saying how he had been brought £200 football trainers, they are throwing money at him which not being horrible but as a teenager he is loving. I can only imagine what his dad is saying about me too. I think that's why son is avoiding me, our last convo was he wasn't angry at me he was just wanting to spend time with his dad. But I think he feels so torn he between us he feels he can't be nice to me around his dad if that makes sense?

I also did end up getting most of his uniform all his dad brought was a bag. Possibly the blazer. I also put dinner money on his card this week for school.

His dad obv has been buying all his food and given him money to go out etc. I did the same when he was back with me.

Don’t put dinner money on his card. Let his dad do it. I know it’s hard and so unfair that you’ve been left in a situation where you can’t afford your current expenses, but you need to tip the balance back into a place where you won’t sink into debt. So school lunches for your eldest are now his dad’s responsibility. You’ve got two other children to budget for.
It feels horribly unfair that he bought 200quid boots for your son but that means you don’t have to pay for a 50pound pair.
You’re right about the car. Hold on to it and keep your options more open for work and time out with the kids.
I think you should look at upping your hours and trying to bring your costs down a little until you’re not spending more than you have coming in. The childcare part is shit though. But that doesn’t last forever. How long until your children would be old enough to be ok at home alone for an hour or two afterschool? Might be a few years off yet but it will role around quicker than you think.

Op you must start refusing to pay for anything for him. Sounds harsh but his dad needs to be forced to pick up ALL the responsibility and if he can’t/won’t then your son needs to see that is the case.

Op as hard as it is you need to tell your son his dad has to be responsible for this all now you

The youngest is only just going into reception now which is the tricky part, I think I could probably juggle after school as my best friends mum is a childminder (term time only) and I have mum friends who would prob do the odd after school it's just the holidays would be really difficult to juggle because I wouldn't have enough time off to cover it and they are long days - camps are expensive. I need to formulate a bit of a plan really.

I think that's why I'm stressing out, normally I can work things out practically but I can't with this at the moment and that's why I'm so stressed.

I am going to speak to my manager and see how many hours she can potentially offer me, then at least I can work out if it would be worth increasing or not. If not then I am just going to have to be really frugal with food and hope the kids don't grow for a while while I can find myself another proper full time job. Ideally a work from home job would be ideal as the kids are so easy I could easily work with them at home in the holidays a little bit and not need full weeks of camps. If not I was thinking perhaps nannying and taking my youngest after school with me getting a sitter for the middle ones. Or doing some cleaning type jobs. I am sure I will figure something out it's just another thing to juggle.

I always knew I needed to increase my earning potential I just thought i had a few more years but I've just got to deal with it now and hope I get a bit lucky.

If money is really tight for you, I'd explain this to your sob. His dad needs to pay for everything now. You need to find a job that pays more money. My friends have got into cleaning, it's really well paid.

I have actually looked at cleaning it's just knowing where to start! I am also an awful housewife/ cleaner I mean my house isn't messy but I don't enjoy it. I think it's something I would really struggle with doing.

I've put an add for childcare hoping I could do some around my current job, I've also applied to a couple of jobs online but not holding much hope as they are in a different sector.

I spoke to the nurse today, I had two missed calls at work from her, ex has been ringing throughout the day to her apparently and I explained the situation and she said she's not going to write the letter. It's actually really embarrassing but a good example of how pushy ex is to get his own way and a show of his character. She also said ex has now changed his doctor surgery? No idea how he has down this she said they should have rang me, I'm guessing his gf pretended to be me.

On a plus I got a reply from son today and had a little chat with him! He is staying at his Nans (dads mum) today which is prob why he replied! Haha! He said dad has brought him a ps5! And has promised him a trip to london clothes shopping for his bday! I asked about seeing him and he said about staying the night before his bday which was nice. Although prob only because he wants a present. He put off coming over this weekend (will be two weeks Sunday I haven't seen him for now) and said perhaps a day next week. We will see.

I just thought I would update the thread,

DS is still living with dad, he seems happy but still doesn't have a bed or anywhere to store his things. I haven't seen him much despite messaging most days. Sometimes he will reply sometimes he won't. He's gone back on plans with my family also so I'm struggling with this a little bit and not seeing him but I'm just trying to give him his space while still letting him know I'm here for him.

Behaviour at school is starting to slip as is attendance, diabetes also hasn't been great either.

Ex backdated all benefits to a few days after son first went there so I expect I will owe some money which so frustrating as son was back with me while he was on holiday and I did end up buying all the uniform etc.

Feel a bit less stressed about money as new partner has moved in and really stepped up, paying for pretty much everything for the kids. I feel a bit rubbish about it considering their dad has quit his job and doesn't pay a penny towards them or still see them. He's only been seeing the other three once a month still. There's always an excuse every other week why he can't do once a fortnite. I've also managed to find another couple of jobs, cleaning and babysitting so managed to increase my income. Juggling three jobs with the kids has been difficult but kind of balances out as feel less stressed financially and feel like I'm stepping up with partner not just expecting it all from him.