This isn't our heat wave, but the next one could be

[orangeleavesinautumn]

Or if we mess up the jet stream, arctic winters.

We have really messed up horrifically, haven't we.

I am scared its too late to put right

Me either

We're a teeny tiny island compared with Asia, Europe, the Americas & Australia. Places like China & Japan are utterly horrendous for pollution and the USA isn't too far behind. What sort of difference can we really make? Even if EVERY SINGLE ADULT in the UK & ROI made drastic, gigantic changes, what difference would that make realistically? Genuine question for people more knowledgeable than I!

To be fair people in flats are probably using much less energy than people heating detached houses, so for all their smugness over their big garden they’re probably a lot less environmentally friendly than their tower block neighbours!

What is Government doing to encourage us?

Are they placing a major prohibitive tax/tariffs on goods from China? No, because international Trade agreements work both ways.

Are they placing a major prohibitive tax on 4x4s and similar being purchased for use in urban areas? Don't think so.

Are they subsidising Public Transport to make it far more economical to use it rather than drive? Not that I know of.

Are they placing a levy on general waste bins, and say giving a refund of Council tax for the number of Green and other recycling bins used/collected? Don't think so.

Are they placing a major prohibitive tax on air and cruise travel? Not that I know of.

I am sure you can add to the list. I understand that some will say we don't need direction/incentives we should just voluntarily do it. That doesn't work in my view. Those who want to will, those who can afford to or can't be bothered will ignore it.

I do a lot of this voluntarily. No car, no kids, very little food waste, sensible use of heating, washing only when necessary and not out of habit after every wear/use apart from underwear, minimal plastic use when I can, grow salad stuff and have a small veg patch (not always a success but I try!), and so on. I am not religious about it, but I try to be mindful.

It’s unpalatable but if we really cared about our kids, and really wanted to change things, we wouldn’t drive up the population yet again and perpetuate the issue just so the elderly have people to look after them. We would let it fall and suck up the consequences, prioritising the young.

NewNovember
perhaps the older population will have to look after themselves, isn’t that better than the planet becoming inhabitable?
it’s a bit of a whirlwind more people need more people to look after them, where does it end ? UK population 50’s, 50 million projected to be 75 Million 2050, how do we keep looking after and feeding that number?

Why should they encourage us? It’s all our problem. They’re there to serve us and give us what we want, which is apparently cheap imported goods and more food than is good for us. Besides if they did the above then COL would go up - up and up and up - and do you really think the public will thank them for that? Vote them back in?

Wow 😮

But it’s not about that.
The aging population you so fondly speak of is you.
No one is going to just ‘let’ millions of people age 70+ die. (That will be us by the way) and that includes younger people who’s parents will be the aging population (our kids)
There will not be enough workers to support the population- young and old.
When there are not enough medical services (properly not enough not just waiting 10 hours for an ambulance) no skilled doctors to operate on your grandchild, not enough nurses, no hospital space so your child has to be looked after at home by you when critically sick or injured, not enough food being made, not enough people to mend the pipes and keep the water running to our homes, not enough bin men etc then it affects everybody.
Your kids might not be able to work because they are caring 24/7 for YOU at 80 due to there literally being a 4 year wait for any care home place to be available for example.
These sorts of things cause unrest. Riots, collapse of society when people get desperate.
Not enough younger workers is going to be a huge problem unless the majority of parents have 3 kids. Which isn’t happening!

No one is going to just ‘let’ millions of people age 70+ die.

There was a film made recently about this "idea": voluntary euthanasia of the elderly. "Plan 75".

The young (under 70) should support themselves and be prioritised. What’s the alternative, sacrifice the future for one generation of older people (yes I know that means me)?

Who is being smug about having a big garden?

You posted that families should grow their own veg. As if they all have big gardens, and it didn’t even enter your mind that most of us don’t. I can’t imagine how many have 1 acre plus, perhaps 5% or less? Even then that would barely feed 1 person.

Yup that is truly a wow we're just a Blue Dot in the Universe - time for Carl Sagan !

But it can happen, as people do make it happen, as you have mentioned yourself. Or even better support local produce.

Make what happen? You need to be more specific. We’re talking about making a noticeable impact on food production here.

This is depressing reading, about what we've done to wildlife since 1950

The state of nature: 41 percent of UK species have declined since 1970s | Natural History Museum (nhm.ac.uk)

I think we're currently in a mass extinction event

And there in lays the problem.. No one wants to actually do the things that will help

How was I smug and where did I say I have a large garden, you’re making stuff up now, it was a suggestion, I don’t have a large garden but would use an allotment or community land if I had the opportunity. If you Google, there are people who grow their own food to feed their families, you even said yours did yourself, if you don’t have a garden, then other options could be explored.

🤦🏻‍♀️

I think we're currently in a mass extinction event

Yes, Attenborough's film made that crystal clear, too. 😔

Where did I say you said you have a large garden?

And why don’t you have the opportunity out of interest?

I've spent all day on and off reading this thread. I just don't know what to write that hasn't been written already. I've worried myself stupid about the climate crisis since the 1980's, my first environmental book was called The Greenhouse Effect by Fred Pearce. It feels like it's all playing out in real time now and I just feel bereft. I dunno, what will happen. There is a book called The Sixth Extinction which is very interesting, it's hard knowing we are nothing special . I can't separate the coldness of evolutionary aspect with the warmth and amazement that I feel for humankind. It's both simultaneously wonderful and terrifying.

Thank you for being out there today fellow earthlings.

I agree about the sixth extinction event.

I'm currently studying for a degree in Environmental Science. It's absolutely fascinating but also tragic and frightening.