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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

AIBU to think I should have been able to get help with behaviour of DS(6) before getting to crisis point?

128 replies

Sink23 · 09/07/2023 20:00

My DS is 6 and is currently in year 2.

I’ll preface the below (which sounds terrible on re-reading but is all true) by saying or DS is sometimes a very loving and kind boy, usually when he’s getting 100% of our attention immediately and also getting to do exactly what he wants when he wants. We absolutely adore DS and sometimes think we’ve caused this by spoiling him too much when he was younger (he’s an only child and only attended nursery at age 3 for a few months before Covid hit) - with both physical things and our full attention.

His behaviour can be absolutely atrocious at home. He still has frequent temper tantrums and not a single “technique” we’ve tried to deal with these has helped at all, he will scream for hours if we leave him to it and likely become a danger to himself, us or really damage our house/things so we sometimes have no choice but to restrain him (he’ll then try to but us, but usually calms down in 10 minutes or so if we stay silent and effectively hold his arms and legs). He’s a very petit 6 year old but he is getting bigger so I’m worried he’s not learning his owns ways of dealing with these emotions because all of our friends’ kids outgrew tantrums years ago.

He refuses point blank to follow our instructions whether this is related to either “doing” or “stopping” something and if he’s cross he regularly shout in our face (just noise, not words) and also frequently tells us how much he hates us. He seems to have learnt that this gets a reaction from me/DH but we do our best to not show it.

Whilst we’re not perfect, our family is totally normal and I think DS has a “nice” life. DH isn’t DS’ dad but has been in his life since he was 1, bio-dad has never been part of DS’ life and there’s no siblings. DS has plenty of clubs, attention from us and does not have a high amount of tech time (he sometimes plays some games on the computer, usually Minecraft or the games from school, but we decided against allowing him the mindless play on a tablet because it had an immediately negative effect on his behaviour during Covid and he’s never really asked for it since). We have tried so many different ways of dealing with this but nothing has worked and we’re at our wits end.

In school, he’s an absolute middle of the pack child. In reception he was able to attend through lockdown as we were key workers. In reception/year 1 it was always brought up that he struggled to pay attention/follow instructions but the school weren’t particularly concerned by this. However, now he’s in year 2 a few of the more challenging behaviours are also showing in school - as well as not paying attention, he’s answering teachers back and starting to say no to them. Obviously now this is a massive issue to the school and I’m constantly being dragged in to discuss this with various people.

We asked for help via our Council’s families service a few years ago but were told that we weren’t disadvantaged so didn’t qualify, but when we asked for help we could pay for none was offered. We also asked for help from the school last year (hoping they’d be able to signpost, rather than necessarily help) but they pretty much said there can’t be any issue at home because DS is fine at school, and DS was probably just in his “safe space”.

AIBU to think that had there been any help available when I asked for it, it would have been possible to “nip this is the bud” rather than the resultant situation where it’s now a huge problem?

Any genuine suggestions/help/experiences are absolutely appreciated here. Please no bashing me and assuming that we’re bad parents. We’ve definitely done things wrong on occasions, but we’re not awful people or trying to excuse the behaviour. We asked for help when it became obvious what we were doing was t working and hit brick walls - we really have tried and it’s a constant worry that our DS is the “naughty child”.

Thank you.

OP posts:
onlylovecanhurtlikethis · 09/07/2023 20:05

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grumpydwarf · 09/07/2023 20:11

I'm going to be that poster. I have a child with ODD and one with autism. I would definitely be pushing for an assessment for ODD with the symptoms described.

Also restraining a child that is hurting you can actually work with some children but if a poster has never experienced that then I guess it's easier to judge....

The earlier a diagnosis can be reached the better for the child involved. Pushing for an assessment does not mean pushing for a diagnosis but your experiencing behaviour that is worrying and upsetting and this means you need help. Don't be afraid to push back on the school or to Go to the gp and explain what is going on and ask for professional help.

3luckystars · 09/07/2023 20:13

Can you pay privately to have an assessment done ?

pjani · 09/07/2023 20:14

I would suggest paying for private therapy for him or family therapy for all of you. It sounds tough, good luck. It’s obvious how caring and loving you are.

Sink23 · 09/07/2023 20:20

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We definitely have put the “fear of God” into him. There has genuinely been times he has looked absolutely petrified of us, but do stop short of actually physical hitting (it’s a line we don’t want to cross because honestly I think if we did we’d find it hard to hold back at all because of the pent up frustration). We’ve tried the opposite of just ignoring the behaviour.

We have tried removing anything that could be seen as a privilege and also the opposite (starting with bare minimum and introducing things for good behaviour), using various charts etc.

We are not being soft on him, we are following through and we are maintaining a given technique consistently for a long enough time period.

Restraining him might not solve the problem with behaviour, but that’s not meant to be the punishment - it’s simply the way to try to avoid an A+E trip for us or him….

OP posts:
Crystals35 · 09/07/2023 20:25

This reply has been deleted

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This.

cansu · 09/07/2023 20:25

Have you tried reaching out to the school nursing service? A friend of mie who was struggling with her dd's tantrums found them helpful. The thousand pound question is whether his behaviour is due to lack of boundaries or whether he has some kind of special need. You say he was spoilt. What do you mean?

cansu · 09/07/2023 20:28

I wouldn't be restraining him, but I would be walking away and putting yourself out of harm's way. Look up ABC behaviour charts. They can help with working out what leads up to these situations and what your ds is getting from his behaviour. If you do want to pay, look up positive behaviour support.

Bluevelvetsofa · 09/07/2023 20:28

What response does the school have to these behaviours, other than calling you in to discuss them? Are there any strategies they use that you can employ at home to show DS consistency of approach?

It sounds as though he has a need of some description and it may be that he needs extra support in school, but the school would need to show what they’ve already tried. Have you asked for advice from your GP, who could signpost further, more specialist advice?

Is the behaviour preventing DS from making progress at school?

Blackbyrd · 09/07/2023 20:31

If you have the financial ability to pay for appropriate therapies and management strategies then it would be wise to do so, this situation will only get worse. He trying to physically hurt you must be very upsetting. You're obviously more than capable of doing some research rather than hoping for children's services,which are in absolute crisis, to step in

Bobbybobbins · 09/07/2023 20:34

I do possibly think there is some SEN here. Both my DS have ASD and while my eldest is very even tempered, our DS7 gets into a state where 'leaving him to cry' is simply not going to work- he struggles to understand and regulate his emotions. One option could be to see your GP or ask the school about assessment for ASD.

Yellowlegobrick · 09/07/2023 20:37

When you impose consequences and discipline, are you calm and controlled, avoiding:

  • pleading with him
  • negotiating
  • getting upset yourself

Are you:

  • sticking to a clearly communicated boundary, no changing your mind etc
  • banning all screens
  • having a very consistent routine at home, regular meal times
  • sticking to an age appropriate bedtime eg. 7.30pm that's been stuck to for at least a few weeks
  • cutting back on busy stimulating scheduled activities/clubs and providing enough free choice play time

Its very hard with kids this age to see what is a real additional need and how much is a mix of parenting, effects of covid lockdowns, perhaps underlying health issues impacting sleep.

If you didn't do the discipline/boundaries stuff when he was younger and are trying to do it now, be prepared that its standard for it to get worse before it gets better as there may be a lot of bad habits/overtiredness & learning new behaviours to overcome.

Spendonsend · 09/07/2023 20:41

Yes its annoying that prople ask for help when problems are small and solveable but services arent available until crisis, when problems are big and harder to solve.

I was going to suggest school nursing team and seeing if there are any courses like 'parenting puzzle' going on that you can access.

There are lots of books 1,2,3 magic, how to talk so kids will listen and the explosive child spring to mind.

If the restraint is calming him in 10 mins you could borrow some ideas from the sen world. So a weighted blanket might give that same ppressure as a hold.

mathanxiety · 09/07/2023 20:44

You need to get him to a child psychologist and have his behaviour analysed.

Find one, make the phone call, get the appointment, and pay out of pocket. Do not wait. You have until he turns 9/10 to turn this around.

I have seen children behaving like this who have been diagnosed with ODD. The behaviour isn't just a child letting off steam in his safe place.

Sink23 · 09/07/2023 20:44

grumpydwarf · 09/07/2023 20:11

I'm going to be that poster. I have a child with ODD and one with autism. I would definitely be pushing for an assessment for ODD with the symptoms described.

Also restraining a child that is hurting you can actually work with some children but if a poster has never experienced that then I guess it's easier to judge....

The earlier a diagnosis can be reached the better for the child involved. Pushing for an assessment does not mean pushing for a diagnosis but your experiencing behaviour that is worrying and upsetting and this means you need help. Don't be afraid to push back on the school or to Go to the gp and explain what is going on and ask for professional help.

Thank you.

I think part of the problem historically was the lack of “belief” by anyone - DS was often referred to as cute/adorable and I think because he’s so petite certain behaviour was overlooked by them as he could be absolutely angelic.

Now the school are onside that there is a problem I suspect it’ll be easier to get some balls rolling. We’re happy to pay for any testing/counselling/therapy etc but being constantly told “it’s normal, kids act up at home” definitely made us doubt ourselves and think it’s our fault and there was no help offered for “bad parenting” which we’d have gladly accepted….

OP posts:
Coffeelotsofcoffee · 09/07/2023 20:45

Sounds identical to my son who has adhd

Schools need to buck up and get him an ECHP or IDP if your in Wales like me

Get your GP to get him on the neuropathway so he can be referred to a peadiatrician. Sooner rather than later waiting list is years

Join the Facebook group Therapeutic Parenting UK. Therapeutic Parenting works for my son. It's about focusing on the feelings not the behaviour .

Get a copy of Ross Grene the explosive child.

Great book

This is not about your Parenting. Your child is struggling ,things get so much better with the right help and support

Cloudburstings · 09/07/2023 20:54

@Sink23 a close friend is going through similar with her slightly older daughter.

has never ever shown at school so proper help has never been differed and been refused several times. Been to CAHMS, got a few online sessions then discharged.

but at home… violent meltdowns, harms her parents. Harms herself. My friend has told me she wonders if they will maybe have to end up in A&E to get proper help.

they are now down the path of private assessment and it’s looking like autism with pathological demand avoidance.

the pandemic definitely escalated things for them.

you’re not bad parents. You need to get him properly assessed. Good that the school is onside.

but telling you off about his behaviour is hardly supporting you. Push them to support you in getting him
assessed asap.

it’s not a quick fix but it is the start of understanding him and then finding the long road out of where you are.

good luck

Sink23 · 09/07/2023 21:08

cansu · 09/07/2023 20:25

Have you tried reaching out to the school nursing service? A friend of mie who was struggling with her dd's tantrums found them helpful. The thousand pound question is whether his behaviour is due to lack of boundaries or whether he has some kind of special need. You say he was spoilt. What do you mean?

By spoilt I think I mean he was never wanting for anything as a toddler. He had lots of material things (we could afford them) and was always given a huge amount of attention.

This was probably me trying to prove to myself as much as anything that it didn’t matter that our traditional family had broken down. At this point it was me, not him saying he wanted things and me saying yes to keep him happy.

In terms of “things” we definitely do stick to our guns and don’t just buy him everything he asks for, but he doesn’t ask for much physically. One thing that we’ve stuck religiously to (as it seems to have a little bit more positive reaction) is the idea that he can buy anything with his pocket money, but that we do not buy him things for no reason. It might be that he has built up a significant buffer of cash that he knows he could spend on almost anything in Smyths so he feels in control, but who knows.

I also think he’s been spoilt in the attention front - when he was 0-3 he was either with me/DH or his Grandma and we doted on him. Some would say child led but if he wanted to do an activity we did it, if he didn’t we didn’t force it. He’s an only child and was possibly given too much power in the situations to not learn that sometimes he HAD to play with bricks even though he’d rather do a jigsaw. We possibly didn’t let him get bored enough, if he wanted us there we were there and interacting.

OP posts:
Sink23 · 09/07/2023 21:22

cansu · 09/07/2023 20:28

I wouldn't be restraining him, but I would be walking away and putting yourself out of harm's way. Look up ABC behaviour charts. They can help with working out what leads up to these situations and what your ds is getting from his behaviour. If you do want to pay, look up positive behaviour support.

There is nowhere in our house safe to leave him. He would need to be in a totally bare room, and even then he will be finding a way to take his frustration out on the walls, and we can’t really just leave him smashing his head off the walls and screaming. He will just continue doing it.

OP posts:
Namechangenoo · 09/07/2023 21:26

Violent behaviour aside, struggling to pay attention/ follow instructions are signs of ADHD. I would ask if the school senco would get involved with him, he can be referred for an assessment through the school and it will make him eligible for more support.

Gunpowder · 09/07/2023 21:26

I’m so sorry OP this all sounds very difficult. I’ve been struggling with DS (5) recently. He had blood tests for something unrelated and it turns out he has iron deficient anaemia. This can make children grumpy, withdrawn, defiant and low energy and can mimic ADHD symptoms. It might be worth checking out. DS is on an incredibly high dose of iron now and we are starting to see a change in less than a week of supplements.

Other ideas, can you self refer to a parenting course? Before I found out about the anaemia I asked our borough children’s centre for help. We didn’t qualify for individual help either but there was no requirement for this apart from being a resident - possibly your LA offers something similar. It’s not a magic bullet and you probably have most of the techniques but it helped me a little bit.

Also would be worth reiterating the issues you are having to school on email and directly asking them to refer you to an educational psychologist or the community paediatrician? Just in case there’s an ND element. They may be more responsive if your DS is more challenging than he used to be. IME once you get in front of a paediatrician they are thorough and cover all bases. If school are unhelpful I would try to get a referral via your GP, but it’s easier via school if you can persuade them.

It must be utterly draining. You sound like a great parent and I hope you get some support.

Gunpowder · 09/07/2023 21:28

Ugh I don’t know why my post is in aggro bold type 🤔Sorry everyone. It wasn’t a attempt to sound extra emphatic!

3luckystars · 09/07/2023 21:36

I’d like to be able to do that with the font, nobody listens to me around here.

AcidTest · 09/07/2023 21:37

I think he needs to be seen by a child psychologist or community paediatrician, because that sort of behaviour is beyond the realms of normal for a 6 year old.

In the meantime it might be worth keeping track of his triggers. You say he refuses point blank to follow instructions whether this is related to either “doing” or “stopping” something - he may have difficulty switching attention from one task to another, which is really common in neurodiverse children, but there are strategies you can use that help.

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