Not to send my children to private school even though I can afford it

[AdamRyan]

I believe in comprehensive education and think children should all be educated together, to improve social mobility and prevent a "brain drain" where less privileged children go to some schools, and more privileged go to others.
Am I in the minority and being naive?

YANBU - comprehensive schools are the way to go
YABU - I'd send my children private if I could

I would not go private - or only if the state schools near us would be failing - they aren't.

In my view being able to mix with people from a wide variety of backgrounds is part of the education I think will stand my kids in good stead for the future.

The government needs to provide better school funding and pay for teachers though. Still not a reason to go private for me.

Totally up to you.

You've said what your beliefs so stand by them. You are not being unreasonable.

Just because we CAN afford something doesn't mean that we HAVE to do it.

YABU
I can't afford it for my kids but if I could I'd give mine the best chance.
I went to both.
The state schools I went to were overcrowded, underfunded and run as institutions. By the book learning, not delving properly into anything, time in class spent managing disruptive students. Boring pointless worksheets, not being told WHY we were learning what we were learning, huge classes.
My private school by contrast had smaller classes. We were treated as equals and the teachers had specialised in their subjects so it was a completely different learning experience. At state school I was either invisible or treated like an idiot for not being able to do things, but at private school my strengths were identified and developed. Started at a C-grade level, ended with A*'s.
(Also went to one bad private school that was just a snobby country club atmosphere - so it matters where you go. I wouldn't want to send my kids anywhere snobby or removed from the real world. But I would choose a good private school over state)

We sent out kids to Comps for similar reasons - time again? I’d do private,

State schools near us are not failing, they are all supposed to be outstanding, you’d be surprised by how not outstanding the schools are on a day to day basis.

I'm quite i retested to know what the median wage, career and house price is for those espousing public education as just as good.....because the high school near me, with only 14 kids taking highest because the area is so deprived most quite school as soon as they can, I doubt you'd all be so pleased to attend!!! When your public access schools sue to wealth in the area are comparable to private- it's easy to say you'd only use public. If your only option was a deprived, failing high school- I can guarantee that would be 'diversity' for most.

I work at a private school but my children go to state schools. The only advantage of private is smaller class sizes but we suffer the same recruitment and retention issues as the rest of the country so even those are getting larger. Teachers are trained the same, textbooks are the same and exams are the same. School trips to Bali and a fancy sports centre may be something people are willing to pay for.

The reality is most people with these views live in an area with good or excellent state schools.

Try living in a rural area where good state provision is a rarity. Where I grew up in Devon there are two state / grammar schools on par with private schools - Colyton and Uffculme. There are plenty of below average and sink schools in the county with poor academic results and behavioural issues.

I now live in Somerset, and our local secondary has just been put into special measures.

I think most people would agree it is stupid to spend £££££ on education if the equivalent could be had for free. But that isn’t the reality in many areas of the country

Privately educated children don’t have worse outcomes at university though. Private school pupils struggling at uni is one of those things people say because they want it to be true.

As others have said surely it depends on your local state? We can just about afford private and are seriously considering it as our local state high school is average at best. If it was a great state school it wouldn't even be a consideration. So this isn't as black and white as you're making out. And as a PP says, if you're in the catchment of a sink school yet choose that over private when you can easily afford private then you deserved to be judged a bit.

Just to play devils advocado...do you think you are one of the middle classes who has the luxury of thinking this way because you live in a nice area where the state schools are also decent? When we lived in London the state schools around us were rough...one of the reasons we had to move out of London was because we couldn't afford to live in an area with decent state schools and we couldn't afford to send our kids to private schools. We now live in an area where the state schools are great so there is no real need to send them to independent schools unless you want to. Makes it easy for people like me (us?) to say we are choosing state schools for moral reasons.

I agree, would never use private school. They perpetuate inequality. And everyone I’ve met who went to private school is just awful and entitled

I never intended my daughter to go to private school.

She was diagnosed with ADHD and ASD at 10.

The local secondary is appalling for SEN kids.

She is thriving at her small all girls private school. 10 in a class and brilliant support for SEN kids.

You do realise that treating everyone the same is sometimes the most unfair thing to do right? It doesn't create equity.

How old are your dcs? What is their personality like? Are they high achieving?

My dd moved from state to private in year 9. Is now in year 10. She has completely changed in a way in which she wouldn’t have done so in state school. She was in middle set for maths and English. She was friends with the massive popular crowd and stuck in the mentality that she couldn’t shine in any way, messed around in PE and was placed in set 3 ie bottom set. Now she’s shining in PE (and been singled out for an award as well as doing the GCSE), getting on really well in French, maths and physics.

Perhaps your dcs will be fine. Maybe not. But no way would I leave them somewhere, where they’re languishing when I could afford to get them out. This happened to me. I went to a terrible school with the level even in top set way below the local grammar. I will likely have had the richest parents in the school. It set me up for a lifetime of poor self esteem.

I hope your dcs do well. I hope your socialist views do not allow your dcs to be failed in a way that I was.

Send your children where you want OP. They’re your children. My dad pulled me out of private school after about 6 months because he met the other parents and thought they were awful. Stuck up and out of touch with the rest of society. I personally am sending my children to private school as I think it’s what’s best for them. Every parent can choose what they want for their child, nobody is unreasonable.

The fact that you think that private education is all about the education tells me you know nothing about private education at all. My 2 oldest go to a prep (the youngest at a local primary), and it’s the extra curricular and pastoral care that make it worth every penny.

the small class sizes, genuine care to assist each child to reach their full potential, the enrichment in classes is the cherry on top.

and as it’s a boarding prep (my daughters are day), they are friends with children from Russia, Ghana, Japan snd Ukraine, so pretty diverse. And all sorts go there….. children of the teachers, dentists, estate agents,

I don’t think that people who think that private schools are all about meeting the right people have ever set foot in a private school. My oldest 2 girl, are private and that aspect didn’t even occur to me. The state of art swimming pool, beatiful cricket greens, hockey astros, indoor/outdoor netball courts, the thriving music department with regular concerts , art department open all lunchtime with kilns, 3d printers etc to be used at will, the speakers, debating and genuine care for children sold me.

against the comparison of the local state who has to lock the toilets as kids were vaping and overdosing and the head who is long term sick after being put in a headlock.

Two other points to throw into the mix.

1. Subject offering. Where I am, the private schools (not just the one where I work) have far more subjects available at GCSE and A-level. Which means that academically-inclined students are more likely to find a 'fit.' I am part of perpetuating this in that I teach a subject which simply isn't offered in local state schools (I know it's different elsewhere).
2. Cultural/ethnic diversity. The state schools in my region of the country are overwhelmingly white (we're not in a diverse area). Which I don't think is healthy for students. Obviously socioeconomic diversity is another matter.

In theory I'd probably support all schools being taken under the State's wing. How we get there from here is something which I'm not clever enough to suggest.

If the local state didn’t good results and was rife with bullying and high turnover of teachers, gaping in the toilets, what would you do then? Private or state?

Agreed. My dd learned more in 1 year in art in year 9 than she had her entire life at state school. She hasn’t chosen art for GCSE but it does make me wonder whether she would have done had she had a few more years training. Not that it matters as her choices suit her.

We lived in London. Not one state school in our Borough offered: three separate sciences, a classic language or a choice of MFL. Further, none could guarantee that any of the sciences would be taught by a subject specialist. None had playing fields, none offered cricket or rugby ad a sport.

Private was a no brainer, particularly as DH was working 12-14 hour days when the DC were at school and moving out of London wasn't an option. I'm not sure it would have been such an easy choice if we hadn't been in London and the DC hadn't had the ability to get into what are regarded as "holy grail" London day schools. Such schools being relatively good vfm when their results are taken I to account.

Well it depends. I know many who felt the same but when their kids were miserable and failing they changed their minds. You could be lucky! Good for you. A choice is wonderful.

Theres a few on mn that do this I reckon. all that SM Labour stuff but just posturing

The comp we use has its own selection going on by house price, nothing to gloat about in terms of moral superiority

My family moved from London to Cheshire just before my older brother started at secondary. My parents could absolutely have afforded private education for us, but were opposed ideologically, like OP.

I asked them both once, what they would have done had we stayed where the comprehensives had a terrible reputation? All of our friends from there ended up in private schools.

Mum said: 'we would have sent you to the local comprehensive, of course. You would have been fine.'

Dad said 'We'd have sent you private, because whatever happens, you back your children'

... interesting.

If all your private school has to offer over a state school is smaller classes, you must teach at a not so great private school. Or your local state schools are in the top 2%!