Not to send my children to private school even though I can afford it

[AdamRyan]

I believe in comprehensive education and think children should all be educated together, to improve social mobility and prevent a "brain drain" where less privileged children go to some schools, and more privileged go to others.
Am I in the minority and being naive?

YANBU - comprehensive schools are the way to go
YABU - I'd send my children private if I could

Very interesting.
My parents chose como for my siblings and I (leafy and privileged) despite being able to afford private.

We got a house deposit.

Tbh I would completely argue that was the wrong decision. My siblings and I have chosen to send our children private as we are under achieving in career.

To me private school has the benefit of wider opportunities in all aspects, academic and cocurricular. But more importantly there is an investment in children as individuals and my children have a more inherent belief in their own abilities and will probably choose to maximise their potential, making the house deposit completely irrelevant!!

And I am a socialist. My ex dh said he would never ever send the dc private but once he looked at the options and what we could offer them he changed his tune!!

Very strange logic.
I think children who go to comprehensive schools mix with a wider variety of backgrounds and also have more incentive to learn to be self motivated to do well, which benefits them at university.
And I think comprehensive schools benefit society as it means people aren't divided as children based on the socioeconomic status of their parents.That enables social mobility and better opportunities for those children too.

None of things you list as "shouldn'ts" are incompatible with my views. Of course I can choose tutoring/sports clubs etc
But you don't believe in paying towards a system that creates educational inequality.
If you've got a decent state school on your doorstep and are willing to choose private tutoring and fund a range of enrichment then you're still paying to create educational inequality.

You seem to have this obsession that private education isn't actually any better than state, private students are spoon fed and struggle at university and that the main reason parents pay private is to develop some sort of elite network.

Pick whatever school you think will offer a good education for your child/ren, but unless you'd be saying you'd be happy with struggling state school with no parental top ups of private tutoring and extensive enrichment, it really doesn't sound like a principle decision based on a deep concern for social inequality.

Can also afford private but went state however it’s a great state out of catchment - if it was a choic of private or the catchment school it would have been a different matter. I went private and loved it, had there been a local mixed private with good academic achievements I’d have probably gone that way.

This is something I agonise over. I do think the OP is partially correct that private schools do entrench privilege and division in society at some level. But I also privately educate my child. Which makes me a massive hypocrite.

I could provide a long of reasons to justify my decision to privately educate my child which I feel are legitimate but I won’t because it’s boring special pleading.

The point @LolaSmiles and others are making is correct, though, and one which means it will be almost impossible for the OP and others to win this argument.

And this is that all parents who are ambitious for their children or care about their education at some level are involved in entrenching this privilege: this isn’t solely the preserve of parents that go private.

It’s the parents who spend an additional £150k to move into catchment for a good comprehensive. It’s the parents who stick with the comprehensive and tutor their kids or who socially engineer in order to make sure their kids have the “right” friendship groups. Or the ones who muscle in on the governors.

None of this is wrong, per se. But it all serves to entrench privilege and widen inequality. And parents who do all this and pat themselves on the back because they stop short of private schools are not being honest with themselves.

I grew up in a town which boasts a comprehensive which has some of the best A level results in the country. People are paying vastly over the odds for houses in catchment. But their consciences are all clean because they don’t (technically) go private (though they do all tutor)

I went to a private school in the same city. Loads of my contemporaries who went to this comprehensive still tease me about having been to private school. And it’s utter hypocrisy because they were all the recipients of vast amounts of privilege but in such a way that their parents social democratic credentials survived.

I don’t think any decision is “wrong” as long as it’s above board and done with the children’s needs in mind. But I do think people who have gamed the system to remain just the right side of the socialist purity line but lavishing a lot of social capital on their kids ought to maintain a dignified silence around other parents attempts to give their children the best chances they can within the private sector.

Not particularly relevant but I’m sick of hearing people smugly bleating about how they pay for private school because they’ve “chosen to prioritise their kids’ education” or that they “scrimp and save” to fund private education because they’re such good parents, as if people who use state education just don’t value education like they do.

The reality is that the vast majority of parents in this country would love to “prioritise their kids education” but simply cannot afford to do so, no matter how much they save. Being able to afford it is a MASSIVE privilege, as however much a stretch it is for you, it is wildly out of reach for the majority of people who simply don’t have the option.

@Embarra55ed

Thats totally fair. It is a huge privilege and it doesn’t mean others don’t want to prioritise their kids education. But it isn’t the only form of parenting privilege available. There are many other ways to game the system without private education.

Your post is excellent Thepeopleversuswork

In years gone by I'd probably have said something similar to the OP, but then I moved into teaching, and I've seen the excellent, the good, the bad and the ugly in the state system and now cannot hand on heart say that it's as simple as state Vs independent.
I've also drastically changed my views on parents who send their children private by actually listening to them instead of half listening for snippets that confirm my political biases.

It makes perfect sense for a parent to say "we have good state options and we decided against private education. In an ideal world we'd be happy to see the end of independent education and anything our children need we can probably top up as parents. If we weren't fortunate to have good options we might make different decisions, and we're lucky not to be in that position."

It makes much less sense to take an argument of "I'm sending my child to state on principle because I won't support anything that promotes inequality, but actually here's all the things I do and would do with my financial resources to ensure that my child at a good state school has better education opportunities than others in the state system, and obviously we wouldn't be sending out children to a failing school because we bought a house in the right area to avoid that" whilst getting annoyed at anyone pointing out that when you're fortunate to have a good state school and the ability/willingness to financially support the top ups then it isn't really coming from a place of principle.

State school education is not always inferior to private education and this is, and always will be, my position. And my opinion stays the same even though my children went to less than desirable comprehensive schools in non-leafy parts of London and I didn't move to a better catchment, or lie on any application form to go to a more desirable state school, although I know many parents who did. Education is mostly to do with what happens at home, not school. I'm sure the vast majority of teachers would agree.

I agree.
We send the DC Private because the State option is awful but I know that we are very lucky that we were able to have a choice

I’m sure there are areas where state school is really good. However, IME it’s not just about education itself, but the environment and other kids that attend.

I was beaten up at state school. I was not beaten up at private school (or at home).

Depends on schools in area , my dd went to normal sch until year 3 then we moved and tbh the school she came from was rubbish didn’t even learn her how to tell the time etc, so she needed a good education so went to a private school year 4-6 and passed 11+ so now a few years into grammar school.
The private school is so good and small now our son goes there he started in reception and still has a few years to go so it’s a cost but it’s best for him and his needs as in a class of 5 not 30 and gets all the support he needs .
i disagree with the replies that says private school turns you into snobs not true at all , our private school is like a family very small like 20 children in the whole school and 100 % pass rate of 11% so it’s worth the money we are not rich at all normal supermarket jobs and most parents there are also normal -
but we have no luxuries to be able to afford this education.
if local schools are good that’s great and save your money but if you can afford it and it offers your child a much better education do it , it’s worth every penny.

The thing that the majority of people don’t seem to ‘get’ about private education is that isn’t NOT purely about exam results @AdamRyan

All of this nonsense ‘the grades were the same at the comp as the 38k a year down the road…’ entirely missing the point.

Private education is smaller classes, more attentive teaching and therefore more enjoyable time for the child, access to more sporting experience and theatres (on the school site), better food at meal times and support pastorally. It’s not just about ensuring the child passes an exam, which, if you’re not a bright child, realistically you still won’t do whether it’s private school, one to one home tutoring or a massive comp.

Ironically, many people who choose to send their children to private schools do so for the range of reasons above, not the snooty ‘exam result’ reason, which means so many seem confident to leave their children at a suitable state school that matches their exam result expectations.

If the posters on this thread who are anti private school actually spent a week observing their child at one, I would be AMAZED if they didn’t then choose to send them there if they were suddenly gifted a free place.

*it is NOT

This is a good post. Also worth noting that private schools do vary in their facilities and entry requirements.

I went to a very tiny private school that did not have any sporting facilities on site, and in fact no kitchen, so lunch wasn’t great. It also wasn’t a selective school, so had a range of abilities and I got an average of Bs af GCSE.

The reason my parents chose to send me there was due to the terrible alternative in my catchment area, and the violent bullying i’d gone through at my state school. I was also given alcohol aged 9 by another kid whose parents packed it in their lunchbox. Not once did any of this kind of thing go on at my time in private school.

I cannot believe what I'm reading on here.

FYI there are private dyslexia specialists school.

But omg, you are willing to hold your virtue high when your DD is going through horrendous bullying. Wow.

Laughing at the idea that the £38k private school needs to achieve the same results as the grammar. With the odd exception almost universally everyone i know that sends their kids to the local public school are either getting fees paid by their employer or has so much money that reuslts don't matter - its about the education experience. They are not the kids trying to get into medicine and law, thats the minor private school and grammar school kids.

I just won’t entertain my children being social experiments, so private for mine .

@secular39 surely @SunshinyDay1’s post was a wind-up?

I think they are joking

Compromise and go to a grammar school

With this whole "send them private" stuff. I just remembered there's entrance tests and stuff right?

The child needs to pass that first. Like can you send a child private if they fail the entrance test.

It depends whether the school is selective or not.
If it is then yes you will need to pass an exam

Some are selective, some aren’t.

Round here (SE) there are many private schools, almost all of them are highly selective as they are all oversubscribed with wait lists, but there are a few nurturing ones.

ok, so far we’ve had:

1. Dh and I are among the top 1% of earners but we send our children to state school because we have morals and are decent people.
2. Our dc went to an underperforming comp and now they are reading physics and maths at Oxford
3. Private school children are spoon fed.
4. All private school children are entitled and rude and all privately educated men behave inappropriately towards women.

I don’t think we’ve yet had:

5.All Etonians are thick.

6.When I went to a top university other students kept asking me where I went to school. What weirdos.

7.If our children went to private school we might meet Tory voting parents and posh people. We couldn’t have our children mixing with them.

8.Teachers at private school are unqualified.

9.Those who send their children private have a vested interest in state schools doing badly so they get their moneys worth

rachellee
Only speaking for myself but I definitely recognise some of my old views in your post.
I was definitely clouded by having friends/family with strong views and lofty idealistic beliefs that able children would do well anywhere, sending children private is just trying to prevent them mixing with poor kids, it's trying to buy exam results etc.
It's embarrassing looking back, but I was poorly informed and let my personal politics beliefs and idealism cloud my thinking.

It's really not as black and white.