Please read.. was I in the wrong here?

[fullofregrets4]

I just be being a bit over sensitive but I’m slightly upset by it all and just thought I would post here to get other opinions on it

I’m only 20 but I have a good full time job. my mum was a single parent and I have been raised by a family of very strong and inspirational women. I was always taught to be respectful and polite to everyone but to never let people walk over you, know your worth and stand up for what you believe in even if it means you are on your own. Ok I’m harping on a bit now, I’m sure you all know what I mean :)

I had an unpleasant situation at work around 2 months ago. my boss behaved incredibly unprofessionally to me over a very minor mistake after some paperwork couldn’t be found but was found again 5 minutes later- which wasn’t even my mistake it was a different staff member with the exact same first name as me, and my boss heard the name and jumped to conclusions that it was me, but before I could get my boss to understand this I had to listen to a tirade of being shouted at and called several names and it was really really nasty. I was firm- I spoke loudly but did not shout or yell or match his volume- and I tried to explain it was not me who was in charge of the lost items and that it was the other colleague with the same (incredibly common!) first name. He yelled, swore, called me names, said some extremely nasty things about my character and I admit I was annoyed at the unfairness and how hurt I felt but I kept my cool. He wouldn’t listen that it wasn’t me so eventually I gave up convincing him and got fed up of being spoken to so badly and I said I was not prepared to be spoken to or treated like this and that I was not continuing the conversation anymore as I didn’t line the tone and it was now a hurtful personal attack/tirade.

honestly, I didn’t shout, yell, swear, say anything nasty- he did all of the above to me- but I bloody well stood up for myself because it wasn’t my error and I was disgusted at how he treated me. I ended up making a formal complaint and received an official apology for it. His excuse was he was stressed about his personal life and saw red when I told him not to speak to me like that and I stood up for myself

other people have heard what happened and have formed their own opinions. But now I’ve got a reputation of being cheeky, aggressive, catty, snappy and sharp. I know I sound biased but I honestly was none of the above- all I wanted to do was sob and it took everything in me not to. He was aggressive and extremely nasty to me, but honestly, I was not back to him. I just tried to be assertive and to remain professional whilst breaking down inside as I despise confrontation.

maybe I’m making this a feminist issue incorrectly but I don’t think a man would have come out of this and have people think he is aggressive or catty. He would have been called assertive and strong etc. or maybe not and I’m wrong about it all, but I received an apology from him and had to stand and be sworn, shouted at and be called extremely nasty things but somehow I’m now seen as being bad for standing up for myself (everyone has been talking and saying I shouldn’t have and that I need to learn to keep my mouth shut, but surely it’s better to stand up for yourself? Yet ironically everyone thinks he is great because he made a mistake and apologised for it- he’s come out of much better than I have.

Should I have just let him say his piece and kept my mouth shut? I’m still finding my feet with workplace problems but I tried to follow my mums advice to be assertive and strong but now everyone thinks badly of me, I know other people’s opinions are none of my business but it’s hurtful to think my reputation is aggressive and catty and hot headed over this incident

any thoughts/ advice would be most welcomed (even if it’s that I was in the wrong!)

Forget the opinions of others- they count for nothing and literally have no relevance. Your boss was absolutely in the wrong, you did the right thing! I also doubt the colleagues think those things of you.. I expect they think you handled it well. What makes you think they have those assumptions of you?? If they saw/heard what he was saying, I doubt v much they do. X

You are 100% in the right. Your coworkers and wretched boss are 100% in the wrong. Your boss is truly an immature, extremely unprofessional, abusive, classless JERK. Coworkers are slimy cowardly dimwits.

Brava to you, we need more people like you in the world. Keep doing what you’re doing, carry on. You have integrity and respect for yourself and others. He needed to know that what he did was very wrong, wielding power abusively, and the formal apology he had to make and higher ups coming down on him, was good for him, hopefully he will improve his character. He’s lucky he didn’t get fired because he should have.

In your shoes I would quietly get on with my work and be 100% efficient. this will all be old news in no time but I'm fucked if I wouldn't be looking for another job and ideally complaining about the manager if there is someone to complaint to.

Be cool, be efficient and smile a lot at work.

It's also in my nature to get revenge but I do this by playing a long game. There are ways and means.

Being assertive and strong doesn't mean raising one's voice or getting loud, though- this is what too many people think 'assertive' means.

Assertiveness can be done very quietly and calmly -ideally where both people feel listened to and points of view are taken on board.

It's not always easy though!

This is great advice. I was bullied out of a job by a manager at a similar age and I can still remember how awful it was now, years later. Good on you for standing up for yourself.

Keep doing what you're doing. I've been there. I will not be spoken to like that, you speak to me professionally or not at all. I have battled that "arsey woman" "aggressive" rubbish for years. I am now in a place where my reputation is that I'm very good at my job but I won't take crap, so I don't get given crap and my opinion is valued. I also work in a very male dominated sector. You're in for a rough few years but if you stand firm and do your job well, you're going to be ok. But you may need to find the right boss as well because some men in authority do not take well to strong women.

I think some of this may depend on situations outside of this one - what the dynamic is normally like with the manager, team and you. Obviously we can't tell from this... but taking this as it reads, you did great. You're right - a man never gets called catty, aggressive, snappy etc.

Also, you are very young. I don't intend to patronise you, but as I reflect back on some of the bullshit I put up with in my 20s... I would never, ever stand for it now. Perhaps that's thrown some of them if - like me - they have had to spend years learning (unlearning?) some of the behaviours that are instilled in us. But that's on them, not you. You sound boundaried and capable. You might decide to put that into finding a new job 😉

Fuck that shit. You did just fine, I wish I’d been like that when I was 20 and it hadn’t taken me another 15-20 years to learn to stick up for myself.

You’re right, the attitudes to you since are misogyny pure and simple. And it feels uncomfortable because a) it’s unjustified and b) women are taught all their lives to be “nice” so being called all those things doesn’t sit well.

My advice? Own it. You’re not going to let anyone speak to you like shit especially when it’s for something you haven’t even done. Catty? Sharp? Bitchy? Whatever, maybe people will think twice about the pulling that sort of crap with you again. You keep doing a good job and the truth will out and in my experience having that reputation can be used to your advantage.

Well done.

You are very impressive OP - congratulations! When I was your age I wouldn't say boo to a goose and got royally taken advantage of, mis-spoken to etc. Other people are probably just jealous that you are assertive, stand up for yourself

You did great @fullofregrets4 . It'll blow over and people will forget about it and 'judge' you based on what they see of your decent behaviour every day. x

You were 100% right to stand up for yourself, and yes if you were a man it would have been viewed differently.
Some men have a lot to lose by women achieving equality. Others are happy to see it and are cheering us along.
This turd sounds like one of the former.

PS there comes a point in life when you no longer care if you are called a bitch, and you discover the power that comes with standing up for yourself. You are there! Well done.

Only women have this problem.
men are called go getters and straight talkers.

@fullofregrets4 keep being awesome. I wish I had your confidence

I'm sorry you had this experience, I'm hoping it's pretty rare and you don't have this nastiness again- I never experienced this in years of office work including temping. I'm guessing it's a fairly small company? I can't believe any big or corporate outfit would be keen to keep this guy long-term, so unprofessional! And workers generally siding with the boss is unusual, but in small companies there can be a lot of odd dynamics that aren't obviously apparent, like you'll find staff that are useless at their jobs then one day you find out that they are the bosses best mates son or maybe they have been there so long that although they don't seem close there is a mutual loyalty thing going on. I'm impressed you stuck up for yourself and got the deserved apology, however in your shoes I would be looking for a new workplace!

It doesn't matter where you go, there is always someone who likes to gossip about you behind your back. You were in the right to object to being treated in such an unprofessional way. It is better for a woman to have the reputation of expecting professional behaviour rather than being the one people can shout at with impunity.

Is it a good place to work, apart from your idiot manager? Is it a place where you would like to make a career? If so I would go to HR and see if there is a good, female, senior manager there who is willing to be a role model and mentor for you. Look into what you need to do for career progression. I'd play a long game and progress and have the gossips and the idiot working for me at some point. If they are going to talk, you might as well give them something good to talk about.

When young I worked with a middle-aged secretary who told me about the time a young manager who very rudely demanded she do something
Secretary: I don't appreciate your tone
Manager: You can't talk to me like that
Secretary: Well somebody should have done, and it should have been your mother.

At least you didn't say that.

Honestly I think you’re an inspiration - I would have cried and I’m nearly twice your age. Well done you ❤️

If others try get you to talk about the incident I would just smile and say 'oh, it wouldn't be kind of me to talk about other people's personal problems' insinuating the whole incident was about your boss' personal issues, which it was.

I agree with @Sparkletastic. We rarely do a good job of mind reading what we think others are thinking of us and the reality is that people may think all sorts of different things about you if they are even thinking about you at all. It’s highly unlikely to be a homogeneous opinion and much of what people express is more about them and their lives than it is about you. Most people are too busy thinking about themselves. As others have said, people may have been very unimpressed by your boss’s behaviour and the picture of what people think of the whole situation will be much more nuanced. I doubt you have a negative reputation based on one incident but it’s easy to feel like the spotlight is focussed on you when it really isn’t.

I agree with others, you are absolutely right to be assertive and defend yourself. It is a feminist issue because it’s about the expectations on women to acquiesce and take this kind of shit and when women don’t absorb the aggression the word “assertive” becomes a criticism instead of the compliment it is for men. It’s also an age thing, as if young people don’t deserve the same level of respect as someone of my age (fifties). If you kept it professional and avoided getting personal like him then you have nothing to doubt about your response.

He sounds like a bully who has no self-control - he shouldn’t have responsibilities for staff if this is his level of conduct regardless of problems in his personal life. He should be asking about the error in a calm way, away from an audience so he can establish the facts. He should be focussing on the error made not attacking the whole person (whether they made a mistake or not). I would be very interested in the words used by him in his verbal attack, because I think he should probably be in much more trouble than he is.

I think you are destined for better things. Perhaps it’s time to focus on finding another job?

You sound far braver and stronger than I was at 20 when I was shouted at by a manager and just froze. You should be incredibly proud of yourself. Fuck the rest of them, keep dated notes on this sort of behaviour, you might need them in the future

You did great! I'd be so proud of you if you were my daughter. Similar things happened to me at around the same age (older men always seem to think it's their right treat young women badly). Unfortunately, I wasn't as strong or calm as you and I'd end up either crying or telling my boss to go fuck himself and lose my job.
Coworkers might be a bit shocked because there is still a work culture of having to take shit from bosses but you are the next generation and what you've written here gives me hope that this can change.
Moving forward, try to put it behind you now. You behaved appropriately. He behaved badly and has apologized.

I have been in the same situation as you. BUT sat there and took it. My thinking ingredients was the person who was actually at fault would admit it and my boss would apologise. Niether happened.

20 years later and it is still one of my regrets in life. Basically I got a reputation for screwing up and was deemed 'not management material.' Ruined my reputation and standing at work.

You absolutely did the right thing - well done. And yes you're right if this was a man no one would even be talking about it. I bet its your manager that is spreading this nasty gossip. If a man had spoke back to him he would have apologised bought him a pint and been fine about the whole situation. Some men still hate being told they are wrong by a women!

Well done you, your mother would be proud.

‘I’m not aggressive or catty, but I have a strong sense of right and wrong and I don’t see why I should take verbal abuse for having the same name as someone else!’
Can you get to know your other colleagues better so that they can see you are a nice person? It’s totally shit though and you shouldn’t even be having to deal with this.

So his excuse is that he is stressed in his personal life & saw red & that seems to have been accepted?

Fuck me what a dreadful place!

Forgot to say if that was truly the case he would surely have apologised without being made to?

What a shitbag!

Just wanted to echo what others have said, you sound brilliant and so smart, keep doing what you're doing. It doesn't matter what people think when you know you're doing the right thing (easier said than done) and it will all blow over. Your mum must be so proud because honestly to be dealing with that crap in the workplace at 20 in such a professional way is perfection, I bet they're all wishing they were like you!