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AIBU?

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Original poster

AIBU to think Rishi Sunak is actively trying to piss off the entire country?

261 replies

Locutus2000 · 25/06/2023 15:06

Or does he genuinely not get it?

Every time he speaks he seems further detached from reality. His interview today was insanely out of touch.

Got a mortgage? Stuffed

Work in the public sector? Stuffed.

Rent your home? Stuffed

Live in a small town? Stuffed

Supported Brexit? Disaster

Not to mention the Johnson honours scandal and Liz Truss.

AIBU to think the only people happy are his fellow super rich?

Couple looking at bills

Rishi Sunak urges people to hold their nerve on interest rates

The prime minister continues to back the Bank of England as mortgage pressure rises for homeowners.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-66012301

OP posts:
Nepmarthiturn · 26/06/2023 01:00

1dayatatime · 25/06/2023 17:04

@Locutus2000

So I thought I would play devils advocate on this one. So going through your points whilst I don't disagree with your conclusions, you do question whether Sunak is entirely to blame:

Inflation (and therefore interest rates) has gone up due to a combination of three main reasons:

  1. Brexit - this makes it more difficult to import goods from the EU, particularly food which then makes food more expensive.
    It should therefore be noted that the majority who voted for Leave are in part responsible (or actively wanted) this higher inflation.

  2. Covid spending- the Government borrowed/ created £500 billion of debt that was then injected into the economy through bounce back loans, furlough, PPE contracts, eat out to help out etc.
    The majority of the public supported the lockdowns understandably in order to protect the elderly and vulnerable. You may disagree with how the money was spent or how wisely it was spent but once the approach was decided upon lockdowns rather than doing nothing then money had to be spent which inevitably would lead to higher inflation (eg Germany early 1920s).

  3. War in Ukraine - this led to a sharp increase in energy bills due to a reduction in supply of Russian gas to Western Europe.
    Now there was a choice to either stand up against Russia and support Ukraine which leads to higher energy prices or selfishly throw Ukraine under a bus and do nothing in order to keep getting cheap energy from Russia. I personally think it was the right thing to stand up Russia as otherwise Europe would for ever be blackmailed by Russia on other issues through cheap energy supplies. But I recognise and accept that the price for this was higher energy bills.

So depending on where you sit on the above three points then we are all partly responsible for higher inflation, higher interest rates and higher Government debt.

  1. Terrible idea, supported by Rishi Sunak, that he doesn't have the decency even now to admit this is a major contributory factor to the UK's current problems and acknowledge that there IS a way to reduce inflation before resorting to hammering people's pay and mortgages and make many lose their homes and livelihoods: rejoin the single market.

  2. Terrible idea, supported by Rishi Sunak and also executed so shambolically by him as Chancellor that it increased inflation far more than it needed to, alongside much other unnecessary damage.

  3. Had the party he represents - which has been in power for 13 years now - implemented anything vaguely representing a coherent industrial strategy, energy security strategy or food security strategy then such external events would have had a far lower impact on the UK economy.

All in all, a moron, like the rest of his party. Unfortunately, so are most other members of the HOC, none of whom seem capable of grasping basic economic principles of what should be done to improve productivity and living standards.

Emotionalstorm · 26/06/2023 01:53

I disagree with the OP. What do you expect him to do? Inflation is caused by external factors outside of his control. All other countries have the same problem. If he says he doesn't understand the poor he gets hated. If he says he does, he still gets hated. Poor man cannot win.

Purplesilkpyjamas · 26/06/2023 03:56

usernother · 25/06/2023 17:16

usernother
How are you stuffed if you work in the public sector? Because we’ve had below inflation pay rises for over a decade and the government is doing their best to keep it that way whilst also cutting funding to the services that we offer?

I work in the public sector and I don't feel stuffed at all. I'm very well paid for what I do, we get flexi time, lieu time, 30 days holiday, 6 months full pay if off sick. Things people don't usually get in the private sector. We were all happy with our pay award this year.

Get me a bucket. This is one of the most unaware posts I have ever seen. You obviously don't spend your working day looking after the sick/saving lives. Read the room.

Swrigh1234 · 26/06/2023 06:29

Emotionalstorm · 26/06/2023 01:53

I disagree with the OP. What do you expect him to do? Inflation is caused by external factors outside of his control. All other countries have the same problem. If he says he doesn't understand the poor he gets hated. If he says he does, he still gets hated. Poor man cannot win.

Nice try at satire.

SunnyEgg · 26/06/2023 06:35

1dayatatime · 25/06/2023 23:29

"Why does no one even ask the question that tax rises for the very wealthy could be one measure to help bring inflation down?"

++++

Because making the "very wealthy" less well off may well indeed reduce demand for and bring down the price of say luxury cars, yachts, holidays or large houses. But sadly it will make bugger all impact on the price of say food or affordable houses etc.

Only by making everyone less well off can you reduce demand nationally and reduce inflation nationally.

That said you do raise an interesting point that rather than trying to reduce inflation by raising interest rates and making most people less well off, how about reducing inflation by raising income taxes on everyone and making them less well off that way.

It would potentially have the added benefit of reducing government debt as well.

Is it used like this often? Maybe because interest rates are more flexible and you can put them up and down are few times over a period of time

I’m not sure I’ve heard an answer on dealing with inflation (apart from interest rates which are difficult for supply side) from anyone so far, from any side

RosaGallica · 26/06/2023 06:45

Swrigh1234 · 25/06/2023 20:10

MN re inforces the notion that not everyone should be allowed to vote. The sheer stupidity of this comment. Apparently this person thinks a crushing recession with millions of job losses is way to make housing more affordable. The mind boggles.

Show quote history

And what solution do you propose to the fact that this country is unaffordable for most? That we have returned to the Victorian ages, to the world of Dickens and Hugo? To the world where wealth has power, law means nothing, and we are all slowly being turned into slaves? Where lawlessness and squalor is rife, despite the refusal of all the middle class Dr Barnardo’s out there to believe it until they see it for themselves.

Ive been watching this situation develop over 20 - 40 years. It has not been an act of god at any stage, it was a series of deliberate choices that could have been stopped. New Labour accelerated the trend massively. But “communism”… And now there are no choices left.

RosaGallica · 26/06/2023 06:51

Or at least, the only other choice, to undo inequality via taxes and provision for public sector services and housing, are simply options the super-rich will not accept. And you middle classes have given them that power over all of us.

Swrigh1234 · 26/06/2023 06:51

RosaGallica · 26/06/2023 06:45

And what solution do you propose to the fact that this country is unaffordable for most? That we have returned to the Victorian ages, to the world of Dickens and Hugo? To the world where wealth has power, law means nothing, and we are all slowly being turned into slaves? Where lawlessness and squalor is rife, despite the refusal of all the middle class Dr Barnardo’s out there to believe it until they see it for themselves.

Ive been watching this situation develop over 20 - 40 years. It has not been an act of god at any stage, it was a series of deliberate choices that could have been stopped. New Labour accelerated the trend massively. But “communism”… And now there are no choices left.

Show quote history

Build more housing, in the form of whole new towns, funded by the private sector.

Lapland123 · 26/06/2023 06:51

MyGrandmaLizzie · 26/06/2023 00:42

You must be being sarcastic?!!!
Or are the Tory bots out tonight?

Show quote history

Serendipity has written a hilarious response and I really laughed.

In reply to the ‘happy public sector worker’, she rightly named that the only happy pubic sector workers are MPs.
they’ve kindly awarded themselves fantastic pay rises over the years while the rest of us languish or quit.

MPs are the only content public sector workers in this country.

Very funny

MollyNameChange · 26/06/2023 06:55

@Fightyouforthatpie you say, "The other parties are advocating a fairer deal for ordinary people".
They are using slogans that repeat what you say, but not telling us how they want to do it. Until they tell us HOW, they remain dreams and wishes.

groupery · 26/06/2023 07:11

Build more housing, in the form of whole new towns, funded by the private sector.

your forgetting the nimbys

MollyNameChange · 26/06/2023 07:27

@groupery More new housing, more new towns. More Milton Keynes.
Roads, water supply, sewage, electric and gas all funded by developers, not by taxpayers.

Good idea.

itsgettingweird · 26/06/2023 07:28

Blossomtoes · 25/06/2023 22:52

I'm not a tory, and don't especially care for anybody in politics. There's very little difference between one party and the next.

I'm old enough to have seen that 13 years of labour rule were far from utopia too. So am I and it was utopia compared with now.

People were poor Not half as many or as poor as they are now

people waited for health intervention

No they didn’t
https://www.kingsfund.org.uk/sites/default/files/summary-high-performing-nhs-progress-review-1997-2010-ruth-thorlby-jo-maybin-kings-fund-april-2010_0.pdf

we suffered a huge recession So did the rest of the planet, it was global.

people at the core, who actually make the decisions and direct policy, do not change.

They do. I remember Major’s government, they were bloody angels compared with this lot. Sensible grown ups who actually gave a shit about people other than themselves.

Agree with this 100%.

I wasn't in the country for a good proportion of labours rule but even I know it was better than we have got now!

itsgettingweird · 26/06/2023 07:29

I want Starmer to actually talk more about what he can do better rather than just slag off the tories.

Yet one of the reasons I like Starmer is he does actually give ideas.

2 of which the Tory's took up over energy prices so clearly they agree he has good ideas too!

MollyNameChange · 26/06/2023 07:35

The Times today, compares the repayment costs of mortgages in UK and other countries. France is much cheaper, Germany and Belgium, a smaller difference.
Who can change this for us?

TheGuv1982 · 26/06/2023 07:45

While you can’t blame external factors on Sunak, or indeed Boris, the impact of these factors has been more acute because of their party’s decisions over the proceeding decade.

The Liz Truss fever dream somehow made things worse, which was a fantastic achievement if the goal was to display a level of incompetence previously thought impossible in the real world.

The chickens have well and truly come home to roost for the Tories and I have no sympathy.

itsgettingweird · 26/06/2023 07:51

TheGuv1982 · 26/06/2023 07:45

While you can’t blame external factors on Sunak, or indeed Boris, the impact of these factors has been more acute because of their party’s decisions over the proceeding decade.

The Liz Truss fever dream somehow made things worse, which was a fantastic achievement if the goal was to display a level of incompetence previously thought impossible in the real world.

The chickens have well and truly come home to roost for the Tories and I have no sympathy.

Your first paragraph is exactly the point I think many are missing in my RL who are staunch Tory's.

It's not always a governments doing that times get tough - but the decisions they make at those times do impact the outcome.

Currently those decisions have benefitted the Uber rich and now the middle classes are feeling the pinch they've woken up to what's been happening for over a decade.

Even then my staunch Tory friends (I'm a swing voter) refuse to vote elsewhere - they just refuse to vote or spoil their ballot.

1dayatatime · 26/06/2023 08:03

MollyNameChange · 26/06/2023 07:35

The Times today, compares the repayment costs of mortgages in UK and other countries. France is much cheaper, Germany and Belgium, a smaller difference.
Who can change this for us?

Interest rates will only come down when inflation comes down, unless you accept the Turkish economic model of accepting much higher inflation rates.

Inflation will come down by people accepting being poorer and buying less / cheaper stuff.

It would also come down if the war in Ukraine ended and if the UK was still in the EU but both of those are sadly not easily achievable.

Swrigh1234 · 26/06/2023 08:23

groupery · 26/06/2023 07:11

Build more housing, in the form of whole new towns, funded by the private sector.

your forgetting the nimbys

How can we forget them.

These morons protest against power plants, new housing, new industry, new everything. And then complain about the lack of housing and a stagnant economy.

We need a new town built every 5 years given that net migration is running at 600k a year, soon to hit a million.

Swrigh1234 · 26/06/2023 08:25

itsgettingweird · 26/06/2023 07:29

I want Starmer to actually talk more about what he can do better rather than just slag off the tories.

Yet one of the reasons I like Starmer is he does actually give ideas.

2 of which the Tory's took up over energy prices so clearly they agree he has good ideas too!

If this is what passes for ‘ideas’ nowadays, this country has truly become a basket case. Raise your bar.

What a decline for a country that once led the world.

Emotionalstorm · 26/06/2023 08:35

Swrigh1234 · 26/06/2023 08:25

If this is what passes for ‘ideas’ nowadays, this country has truly become a basket case. Raise your bar.

What a decline for a country that once led the world.

Show quote history

This is why I would never vote labour. The Tories have always had better ideas. They're flawed and not perfect but that's not an excuse to vote labour. The Tories also have more charismatic leaders and that's important for a country that is on the decline.

Mischance · 26/06/2023 09:13

Emotionalstorm · 26/06/2023 08:35

This is why I would never vote labour. The Tories have always had better ideas. They're flawed and not perfect but that's not an excuse to vote labour. The Tories also have more charismatic leaders and that's important for a country that is on the decline.

Show quote history

Do the Tories have better ideas? Better for whom?

They base their policies on flawed and immoral philosophies: that the market is paramount and profit and competition should rule.

The inevitable result of these is that public services and infrastructure dwindle - as indeed they have done under Tory rule. When you get tied to a political dogma, ordinary people suffer - and that is true of both far right and far left ideologies.

Their privatisation and outsourcing policies have fragmented and wrecked our public services.

And sadly they have bit by bit destroyed the public's faith in our parliamentary system by voting in leaders with nil integrity; and continuing to support them in the face of mounting dishonesty.

Emotionalstorm · 26/06/2023 09:29

Mischance · 26/06/2023 09:13

Do the Tories have better ideas? Better for whom?

They base their policies on flawed and immoral philosophies: that the market is paramount and profit and competition should rule.

The inevitable result of these is that public services and infrastructure dwindle - as indeed they have done under Tory rule. When you get tied to a political dogma, ordinary people suffer - and that is true of both far right and far left ideologies.

Their privatisation and outsourcing policies have fragmented and wrecked our public services.

And sadly they have bit by bit destroyed the public's faith in our parliamentary system by voting in leaders with nil integrity; and continuing to support them in the face of mounting dishonesty.

Show quote history

I am a fan of the free market, less bureaucracy and prudent spending. The Tory policies align better with my values. Neither party has any integrity so I don't factor that into my decisions while voting.

BunnyBettChetwynnd · 26/06/2023 09:43

MollyNameChange · 26/06/2023 06:55

@Fightyouforthatpie you say, "The other parties are advocating a fairer deal for ordinary people".
They are using slogans that repeat what you say, but not telling us how they want to do it. Until they tell us HOW, they remain dreams and wishes.

On this thread I've given a straightforward example of how Labour would improve the NHS and how they would fund it. This kind of information is freely available, it's on their website. Just because you don't read the details doesn't mean they're not there.

BunnyBettChetwynnd · 26/06/2023 09:47

The Tories also have more charismatic leaders and that's important for a country that is on the decline.

Charismatic leaders - William Hague? John Major? Theresa May? Liz Truss? Rishi Sunak?

A country that is on the decline - The Tories have had 13 years to reverse any decline and by every measure things have got worse.