To feel sorry for the teacher who was secretly recorded?

[Forster2018]

Link to article here:

If you believe you are a cat, and the teacher believes you are a cat and the school believes you are a cat and must be respected as a cat

WHY THE HELL ARE YOU SAT IN A CLASSROOM BEING TAUGHT GCSEs LIKE A HUMAN?

"The girls say that identifying as a different gender to your sex is weird. This needs challenging. Gender reassignment is a protected characteristic under the Equality Act."

This is not about gender reassignment though.

Gender identity.
Gender reassignment.

Very different things.

Only on mumsnet could 2 intelligent, confident 13 year old girls be seen as threatened and bullied when they are clearly controlling the narrative.

On both this and on other threads on the subject there are other teachers being critical of this teacher.

It’s also true that many teachers are very uncomfortable with some of the material they are obliged to deliver, but know they risk their careers if they object.

I’m starting to be of the opinion that there should be more recording in schools, done properly and in order to protect both pupils and teachers.

At this point some schools just sound like a feral mess.

Interesting that it was girls speaking up. Most teens I know are sick to the back teeth of gender crap. But it’s the girls starting to lose their spaces, sports, safety and dignity who are being put in an impossible position.

That would be great. We’d see a perfect example of the Streisand effect. The more publicity this gets, the better. Of course, this debacle is not only down to this individual teacher, but every teacher who unquestioningly parrots this stuff is a part of the problem and any teacher who resorts to bullying when she can’t control the conversation shouldn’t be a teacher.

Who do you think has the protected characteristic of gender reassignment?

What do you mean? Can you rephrase the question @noblegiraffe ?

Spot on.

I feel for the teacher.

And we wonder why we have a recruitment crisis!

the business about 'three sexes' was MAYBE acceptable from a PSHE teacher, maybe, though it was worrying. if it came from a science teacher then heads really need to roll

But @puffyisgood why should young pre teen children be expected to sit in one lesson (PSHE) and accept what they are told (there are 3 sexes, male, female and both) and then move along the corridor to their science lesson and sit a test on mammalian reproduction and not mention the 3 sexes.

Why should children, in their educational establishments, have to navigate this? On pain of being told to leave if they raise queries or let on that they're a bit uncertain as to what to believe.

We do this with NO other subject. Indeed, cross-curricular learning is a very popular thing - ie a forest school session where you collect different leaves, divide them according to their characteristics, count their groupings etc, lay them out in a mandala shape can cover science, maths, mental well-being, art & design.... A cookery session can cover science, fair trade, business skills, motor skills, maths etc

We don't constantly tell children to leave what they think they know at the door for each separate learning. Any educational professional will have heard more about scaffolding learning, sorial and helical structured curriculum etc than they've had hot dinners.

If adults do introduce controversial, unfounded or unevidenced materials/subjects or discuss matters of faith and belief, then EVERYTHING should be couched in terms of "some people believe...."

The only reason they controlled the narrative is because we heard the conversation.

Otherwise it was get out of the school and get more training from person supposedly in authority

Good on them

They got the proof and now people can see what they were up against

However I do agree they were intelligent, but they do not have recourse against a teacher who is promoting gender ideology and non truths. The teacher reacted in the way they did due to this authority not because she was right

"Spot on.

I feel for the teacher.

And we wonder why we have a recruitment crisis!"

So the answer to that crisis is to have any old person as a teacher?

The answer is to say that its ok for teachers to act like this in class?

And for cats to go to school?

I remember one very long winded roundabout conversation with a colleague when I worked in a school, where we were both trying to identify ourselves as gender critical without just coming out and saying it, in case other people were listening. I feel like to work in education (I’m at a uni now and if anything it’s worse!) you either have to be brainwashed or suppressed at the moment and it’s terrifying.

no, I absolutely agree with that. third sex needs to be taught, if at all, as a crackpot, objectively wrong very niche theory.

You have a recruitment crisis because teachers like this bring the profession into disrepute. It eats away at respect people have for teachers because she isn't behaving either professionally or respectfully. Add to that the obvious disrespect and refusal to fund properly from the government then you can't recruit decent teachers because parents with an ounce of intelligence tend to advise their dc to go into different professions. My background is education but I made as sure as hell that mine aimed higher.

Instead of looking at the girls recording being the issue look at the teacher

I feel for the children being forced to believe the unbelievable. Meanwhile there is a child out there that believes they’re a cat and no one seems concerned

Does a 13 yr old student who identifies as a cat have the protected characteristic of gender reassignment? What kind of affirmation would that require? Surgery and changing the species on your birth certificate?🙄

If people cannot identify as a different gender to their sex, then how can there be a legally protected characteristic of gender reassignment? That’s pretty much the starting point, isn’t it?

The teacher was correct, you can identify as a different gender to your sex.

Calling people who do this “weird” should be challenged, particularly if it applies to other people in the room.

@noblegiraffe

Absolutely this!

I am a science teacher and I can find trans ideology difficult to understand but I also find creationism difficult to understand.

I have a couple of Christian students and a Muslim student, I would absolutely not allow someone calling someone else a bible basher or mentally unwell just because they believe in creationism over evolution and I would absolutely call them out over it.

We can discuss it in PSHE but we do not use offensive or derogatory language like this girl did.

And the fact that she decided to film it and post it online says it all.

Gender reassignment as a protected characteristic just means they can't be treated any differently to someone who doesn't have that characteristic as far as I'm aware. A transwoman can't be treated any differently than a man etc.

It doesn't mean you affirm someone that says they're at cat and punish someone that doesn't go along with it.

Does a 13 yr old student who identifies as a cat have the protected characteristic of gender reassignment?

The teacher didn’t say that they did. The teacher told them off for upsetting the other pupil.

I would hope that any teacher would intervene if someone was calling another pupil crazy.

Crap like this obscures the obvious questions and makes them seem arcane.
Were the kids doing their best in class to learn?
Was the teacher going about the business of giving them learning opportunities?
This is yet another enormous bloody diversion from actual stuff.

First of all, cat is not a gender.

Second of all, the whole concept of gender reassignment in law is nonsense. The effect of getting a gender recognition certificate is that you are legally considered to be the opposite sex.

Why sex and not gender?

Because gender isn't actually real.

What @MargotBamborough says above