Not to want our children to eat red meat?

[Flymeaway4]

I'm vegetarian, have been for 20 years, partner is not. Since before they were born, I've said I'll let them have chicken, fish etc, but not red meat including pork. Once they're old enough to properly understand that meat was once an animal, then they can decide for themselves whether they want to eat red meat too, or be vege if they like, their choice. Partner thinks I'm ridiculous and said "why can't she have a ham sandwich" at a party yesterday, "what harm will it do". There were plenty of other options there anyway: chicken, cheese and egg sandwiches, quiche, fruit etc.

In case you think it's relevant, my reasoning behind no red meat is that I think cows and pigs are too intelligent, they know exactly what is happening when they arrive at the abattoir and I think that's just too cruel (and lambs are babies). Allowing chicken and fish, until they can make their own informed decision, was my compromise. If it were purely up to me, I'd be happy raising them vege!

So, am I being unreasonable?

Unless they're old enough to express a preference they should have access to all food types

What does 'all food types' mean? Meat and 2 veg? Insects? Horse? Dog? We culturally restrict the 'food types' our children eat anyway. All cultures do. 'All food types' is meaningless, unless you're saying that we should all be allowing our children grasshoppers as snacks.

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Have finally managed to catch up on the thread.

@YESSTEVE amen to your posts, finally a non meat eater with some sense! Each to their own, end of! Love that.

@GCalltheway you do realise that there are hundreds of food stuffs out there that is/can be carcinogenic? Have you ever slightly burnt the edge of a pizza crust or toast, over cooked your root vegetables? It's not just the f*cking ham sandwiches that are carcinogenic ffs!
And for the record both myself and DH are from a long line of farming families, neither side has had the dreaded cancer and all but the odd one have lived a very healthy life up until their late 90's!
You are so hell bent that your way is the right way and I'm sick of your preaching posts much like @redboxer321 - so very ignorant, ill informed and basically most of what you spout is frankly utter bollocks!
As per @Theoldgreygoose I'm going to give up because you can't argue with stupid. As per @Emmamoo89 says, I'll continue eating meat for the rest of my life much like the majority of the country that has an ounce of sense.

Exactly. I will continue to feed my kids only eggs, lentils and local vegetables like most other people of my culture do. Just like British people feed their kids food from their culture.

I am confident I am doing the right thing.

Well between a quarter and a third died in infancy and you can't really blame meat eating for that. Life expectancy for those who didn't die in infancy Improvements in life expectancy during the 20th Century will have a lot to do with clean air acts, banning asbestos, discouraging smoking and the planet becoming more peaceful than it used to be. Not to mention better healthcare. Diet is only a tiny element of this.

In terms of bowel cancer - firstly only 5% or so of us will develop it anyway so any increase in risk is against a low base; secondly the risk factor is processed meat rather than red meat. It's stuff that's full of salt like bacon, ham and sausages that are the risk, not lamb chops.

@backbritishfarming I very much do back British farmers! As an environmentalist and a vegetarian. There are issues, we all know that, some are very serious. but it makes me cross that consumers point fingers at farmers when often they’re responding to consumer and supermarket demand and restrictions. It’s much more nuanced than no meat = good and meat = bad. We need to stop attacking farmers and support them to be able to put welfare and environmental issues first.

Nope. Already admitted to being a hypocrite on that one.
I justify it by the fact that she is a rehomed dog so I am not responsible for bringing her into this world

@redboxer321 you didn't bring me into this world either. So I guess it is fine for me to eat meat? And anyone else who is not your child? That doesn't really correspond to the contents of your other posts.

Bonkers to say you want them to understand the concept of ‘animals = meat’ but then let them eat chicken and fish. Utter nonsense.

I'll ignore the insults @backbritishfarming but let's be clear on who is spouting utter bollocks. In your first post (I couldn't reply at the time as was getting an error msg), you boasted about being Red Tractor approved and how that made me environmentally friendly or something along those lines.

I'll just post this for anybody who thinks the Red Tractor label means anything.
Note, The Times had to put in a freedom of information request. Could it be that some farmers don't want you to know what really goes on on their farms?

Red Tractor farms ‘more likely to pollute environment’ (thetimes.co.uk)

Nice quoting @Nepmarthiturn
You completely miss out the parts where I say I feed her what I believe is mainly waste from human production. How I have thought about feeding her vegan but am not sure if it's right. she is after all a dog and it's pretty undeniable that they were meant to eat meat unlike human beings where it is much more questionable. And as for me rehoming her, someone somewhere would be feeding her so it might as well be me.

As for you, eat what you like. I've never tried to tell anyone that they should be vegan (apart from one joke, you can spot by the fact that there is a wink after it).

@redboxer321 oh please don't ignore it, take it and run with it .... I didn't say being Red Tractor approved made you or me environmentally friendly. I said we are Red Tractor approved and maintain their high welfare standards and are inspected as part of that. I also said that we have an AD plant in place to offset our carbon footprint, as you clearly once again are not overly clued up...in a nutshell.... the methane gas is used in a beneficial way ie: made into electricity which is then put back into the grid therefore less impact on climate change. On top of that we are not dairy farmers so the majority of that link is irrelevant to what I posted. So unless you are totally dairy free that's another hypocritical post you've made.
You seem to be tarring every farmer with the same brush, highly unfair and ignorant....I don't assume every single vegan/vegetarian person I meet is an arse until I find out otherwise 🤔

Insult me all you like, it's like water off a duck's back.

Being Red Tractor approved means nothing as far as the welfare of the planet or of the animals or of anything else goes. Plenty of evidence to support that.

Well done on the AD plant. Sounds like a good move.

As for me being a hypocrite. Guilty as charged but I've already admitted that.

I've also said time and again that I have empathy for farmers and I have said it's only some farmers. Still, don't let the facts get in the way of a good vegan (yes, that means dairy free) bashing now, will you?

@redboxer321 you cannot expect to announce the amount of tripe you have on this thread and not get any response that doesn't agree. It's fair game when you say that there will be farmers out there that are doing little to help the environmental impact of farming and also may not meet high welfare standards, surely that's a given but I can't reiterate enough it's the very minority- we gain nothing from rearing ill livestock. Maybe you should spend more time lobbying for stricter, more frequent welfare checks in your spare time rather than coming on here to slate all farmers. Id be all for that myself.

Welfare checks by Red Tractor? Why don't you tell MN who owns RT?

And while you're at it, why don't you point out to me where I've stated that I don't expect responses that don't agree with what I've said?
I think you'll find quite the opposite actually.

Red Tractor, high welfare standards? Lol.

Chickens are pretty smart too, and you've obviously never cared for any because they can be really sweet animals with their own quirks and personalities. I used to own some and they were awesome.

Interesting article on the Guardian website about chickens and antibiotics if anyone is interested.

@redboxer321 I wouldn't be able to find you'd written that precisely - it's just every damn post of yours on here almost, it just simply shows with your bizarre replies!

Welfare checks by Red Tractor? Why don't you tell MN who owns RT?

Why don't you, seeing as you're the one with the problem with them? Come on then bright spark...this should be fun given your knowledge on your other posts....

Yet more insults.
I'm not the only one with a problem with RT (see upthread).

Look, if you and I met in RL, I think we'd decide pretty quickly that we'd be better off giving each other a wide berth. So, suffice to say that I will not engage with you any longer. Well done one the AD plant thing. I really mean that. I drive a petrol car, will fly again in the future, know my diet and lifestyle does not come without cost to others so I am far from perfect and have always acknowledged that.
I also don't think that eating meat = bad, not eating meat = good.

I'm suspect you'll find a way to be nasty whatever I say so I'll just leave it there.

Wow someone really rattled your cage. Red meat causes cancer. All red meat, whether you like it or not, that is a fact.

If you are involved in this monstrous barbaric business, shame on you.

But the NHS recommends red meat, in appropriate portion sizes, @GCalltheway

Where are you getting your absolute scientific evidence from?

www.nhs.uk/live-well/eat-well/food-guidelines-and-food-labels/red-meat-and-the-risk-of-bowel-cancer/

Who does own RT, @redboxer321 ?

If I had my time over I would offer my children as close as I could get to a vegan whole food diet. I started eating this way later in life and the difference to my health is off the scale. There is no way I'd want my children consuming food I don't consider optimum to put in my own body. It would be a difficult call if they were asking to eat animal products, so i think id have to settle for moderation (like with sugar) and avoid meat, dairy, eggs etc 90% of the time. Would something like that work for you OP?

@redboxer321 I didn't intend on being nasty, you can't help defending what you've known all your life especially when you know you do it well. It's a natural reaction to be angered when it's bashed like it is. Other than my passion/defensiveness for farming I am generally the most amiable person ever so you never know! I know what I do isn't for everyone and fair play to you for holding your hands up too. Agree to disagree.

@GCalltheway
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Wow someone really rattled your cage. Red meat causes cancer. All red meat, whether you like it or not, that is a fact.

If you are involved in this monstrous barbaric business, shame on you.*

Mostly you and your constant insane meat causes cancer rants tbf. If the shame is on me is for providing the country with good quality food both meat and non meat then I'll take that ✌🏼