AIBU to expect some level of household contribution from my 12/13 year olds?

[Guiltridden12345]

I’m being driven nuts. I work part time, at home, 3-4 days. The extra day I spend doing all the usual household shit, mental load stuff of meal planning, shopping, cooking, washing, organising etc. partner works massive hours for good pay which allows me to work part time. I accept the drudge responsibility as a quid pro quo but am starting to expect more from my family as they grow up.

I expect the kids to make their beds, empty their laundry into laundry basket, and clear up after themselves - ie don’t leave shoes/socks/bags/dirty plates etc around. I occasionally get them to wash up etc after a family meal, empty dishwasher, sweep up but it’s not daily or even weekly if I think about it. But they leave a trail of mess like Hansel and gretel breadcrumbs. I am like a broken record. Jam pots left with no lid in height of fly season. Shoes thrown off wherever. Socks removed and dropped wherever they fall. Dirty plates left on side etc. glasses/plates/wrappers left around/ wet towels on floor. Lights left blazing on when nowhere to be seen. And so on.

had a gentle word with both kids last night, saying pls clear up after yourselves, explaining that their hidden message is ‘mum will do it’ when they leave their shit around. Which is insulting to me. This morning - socks still over floor from last night that I’d ask to be cleared, lid left off jam with a fly in it and I finally lost my shit when my 13 year old left her breakfast things next to me as I loaded the dishwasher I had just emptied. She said ‘alright mum, it’s just a plate’ but it’s not just a fucking plate, it’s all the plates and my constant job of clearing up after two people who think they have a maid. They are busy with activities and socials (which I rank as v important for teens esp post covid) and I often find myself doing stuff like picking up socks while they are out so they don’t delay bedtime when they are back. Realise this isn’t helping but I don’t want one issue (mess) impacting another (the constant nag to pack bag, have a shower, get ready for bed at a decent time or leaving for school on time which is another constant bloody nag.

Don’t even get me started on having to micro manage homework, they don’t get a lot but if I didn’t chase them - and say no socials at weekends til it’s done- I’m pretty sure it would be overlooked.

I do phone bans as a sanction for bad behaviour. But I’m fed up with sanctions and nagging and negativity - I just want my children to stop being so bloody entitled and at least look after themselves/stop creating a personal mess?

i am fed up to the back teeth of nagging. I’m absolutely emotionally exhausted by it. I wonder if my expectations are unreasonable with their naturally selfish developing frontal lobes?

AIBU? If not, please tell me how to get them on board in a more positive, conciliatory way which doesn’t just get ignored after a day or create resentment?

My 10 and 8 year old have some responsibilities as I am their Mother not their bloody slave!

They make their own beds, take it in turns each morning so one feeds the Guinea Pig and one packs the lunch boxes (I make their sandwiches but don't see the point being stood their asking what flavour crisps/fruit they want when they are quite capable). They bring their empty plates/dishes to the dishwasher after meals, help set the table and clear away. They might grumble sometimes but generally they just get on with it. I feel it's really important to teach kids early that they are responsible for themselves (obviously while being age appropriate) and they shouldn't rely on someone else coming in to pick up and clean up after them.

It's how man-child's are made when they don't have to lift a finger, ever, and the world has enough of those!!!!!!

That sounds more like Operation Blow Up to Create Resentment

This is awfully tempting. Maybe with a final warning first? See, I’m shit at this. I do so want them to be both happy and not lazy little shits, such a bloody conundrum.

Completely agree but it’s not men-children - mine are both girls and I don’t want being lazy flat mates/friends/partners either!

Some things you will just have to do - like the jam lid.

Why? Why is it too much to expect a 12/13 yo to put the lid on a jamjar?

Unless op is following them round the house, by the time she finds the jar with the lid off it's too late anyway and the food is wasted. Waste is waste, regardless of whether op 's family can afford to throw away jars of jam.

I agree with pp, no more jam, or op buys it only for herself and dh.

Meh. I remind mine a couple times during the week they have to bring down dirty dishes (and wash them since they've been there days) and rubbish, put laundry in the bin. Natural consequences if they don't. No clean school clothes or glasses for juice (I have my own they're not allowed to use!) . It doesn't affect me if they get a telling off at school. Don't care if they leave beds unmade, it's not me getting into it at bedtime, they do have to strip and change covers once a week. If still not done at end of week I just go in and tell them in my special tone to get it done now. Usually works. I'm not up for constant nagging, it's exhausting and doesn't work anyway.

I am going to show them this - message through humour is surely stronger?

To me there's two linked issues and one is harder to fix. The first is whether the DC do chores. The second is an attitude they have been taught, probably unintentionally, for life: that they can display ridiculous levels of laziness and someone else (probably mum) will clean up after them.

In the short term it's easier to get them doing specific tasks each week. That's easier because it's a simple yes/no answer to 'has this job been done'.

The difficult one is going to be how to change their mindset from begrudgingly doing chores (probably whilst leaving their stuff around still) to accepting they have a responsibility as part of the household to not leave trails of crap behind them

Well the latter is linked to the former, so baby steps I suppose?

Well the latter is linked to the former, so baby steps I suppose?
Yes, they're linked.
You'll be able to achieve compliance on specific chores long before a meaningful or genuine attitude change happens.

It means there's probably going to be an annoying phase where they'll do the bare minimum that you put on a chore list, probably to the bare minimum standard, but then still leave their cups around the place/socks on the floor etc. In that phase they're doing what you ask them to as their contributions, but either through stubbornness, immaturity or because they've not made the link yet they don't see how their other stuff is still an issue.

What utter nonsense. So op just needs to wait it out, and allow them to be lazy people while she skivvies around them. No wonder!
Op Yabu to have gentle words with them. Be firm and have consequences. My dc are much younger and even my 6yo will take his plates to the kitchen and scrape off after eating. He can unpack the dishwasher except cutlery. Excusing them because they are teens and have activities is just pathetic, They are 12 and 13!!

If he's old enough to play on the XBox he's bloody old enough to fold up the entire laundry. What a joke, no wonder some adults are so useless !!

im clearly not alone in pandering to my kids! It’s not deliberate pandering though, it’s the frustrated ‘I’d rather do it myself’ approach which at the time seems easier than the ‘spend double the time arguing and get the job done badly’ approach simply because I’m time poor and don’t want to fill that time with conflict. But I can see that this route has the potential to create monsters so I’m keen to change approach and will incorporate many of these very helpful ideas.

Judgemental much🙄

If you take the knives out of the dishwasher your kid should be able to empty the whole thing. He is 6 after all.

What worked for me was giving them jobs that got worse if they weren’t done. So one child has to unload the dishwasher every day, and if it’s not empty when I come to load it they have to reload it as well. The other has to unload the airers, fold the laundry and distribute. If the airer isn’t empty when I want to hang my wash out they have to hang the wash out too. To me those are natural consequences.

I must admit they were never bad at leaving their stuff lying round and they have always been pretty good at tidying their rooms and doing their own laundry from mid teens. Can’t claim much credit for that.

I’ve never linked chores to pocket money as they’re not optional, we all have to do them as we all live here.

Go back to natural consequences. Don't buy jam. Tell them all their stuff that's left all over the house will be collected into a bin bag and left in their room. Close their bedroom door on it and don't think about the mess. Don't wash their clothes if not in the laundry basket. When they flip out that the have no clean underwear, their room stinks and they're embarrassed to invite a friend round, gentle parent the fuck out of them! "I understand that you're feeling angry because you don't have clean pants for school, it's a shame you didn't put them in the washing basket, what do you think you could do better next time?"

So an update. DD13 had a group of friends over tonight. I made them all dinner. Left their stuff by dishwasher and some on table. Told her to clear it and she did it only partly before she had to go to an activity. She hadn’t done another standing chore (animal care) either.

She has a day out tomorrow planned and a sleepover. I said she could go if she’d done her homework. I reminded her during the week. She’s only just got back and is going to bed now. She still hasn’t done any of her homework. She can’t do it Sunday as she’ll be knackered so it’s pointless and will be done badly. this is all part of the same thing isn’t it - not taking responsibility - and I need to woman up?

I’ve said she can go to the sleepover but has to stay home in day to do homework. She’s in bits and I’m the worst mum ever. I can’t bear the crying and I hate the aggression that follows. But I’m right arent I? You have to do your jobs before you get your playtime? And this is all
connected isn’t it, the entitlement and, date i say it, brattishness, and needs knocking on the head?

You are right, hold your nerve.

Or let her suffer the consequences of home work not done, as that is also a natural consequence

just don’t bail her out

We find ‘The Saturday box’ useful. Anything left lying around get’s unceremoniously flung into a big storage box, the leaver loses it until Saturday. On Saturday the box is upended and anything not returned to its rightful place goes in the bin. This applies to shared areas of the house - they can do what they like in their own room. I only wash clothes that are put in the washing basket and if they have no clean clothes that’s tough. I nag about the dishwasher - it drives me mad that they eat breakfast and leave the dishes on the counter. They have to stop whatever they are doing to come and put them away. It is aggravating but I am not there to be their skivvy. Work in progress but the worst thing is just to pick up after them. If you say you can’t do x until y is done then you need to follow through, every time.

Yes she stays home to do the homework. That is what you said, stand by it, don't be swayed by the crying. I am sure if you had work to complete in work time and pissed around then cried when you were asked to do that work, your boss wouldn't say of course you can just do a half arsed job of it, you go and have fun.

Basically your children just ignore what you say, you ask them to do things, they don't, you then pick it up anyway or yell at them and still do it. Stop doing it. I told mine to stop balling their socks when they took them off, they didn't so I made them stop mid game (deliberate) and unball a week's worth of school socks each. That was in primary school.

Have a family meeting and tell them you are tired of being disrespected, that they need to clear up after themselves, you will no longer be doing it and if that means they miss an activity or meeting up with friends then that is the consequence of their actions. Ask them to think what a consequence will be for leaving the lid off the jam jar? It might mean coming back to another family meeting a day later when everyone has had time to digest the information.

I stood over mine when they were little re putting dirty clothes into the laundry, tidying their rooms etc and now have children who have tidy rooms. I shared a room as a child so we were tidy as the space was really small and my Mum was a stickler for tidying.

Not always easy but if you all eat together, then everyone is involved in meal prep or table setting, at the end of the meal everyone clears everything off the table, it goes into the dishwasher or gets hand washed. Everything gets dried and put away, units wiped down, table wiped down. No one sits down or leaves the kitchen until it is all complete. That is how young children learn and appreciate all the usually unseen tasks parents do.

kids can be hugely irritating and they vary so much in how well they manage different tasks. My youngest is great at doing her bedroom and keeping it mainly tidy. My eldest is great at volunteering to help with jobs round the house. Both of them are slower and do it less well than us so I have to hold myself back from just doing it for them.

I think for us we want to hit her where it hurts - in the socials. It is making me feel incredibly anxious and upset. But I will stand firm.

she’d gone to bed in a rage (we were both in a rage, her at my decision, me at her utter inability to accept any part in this happening) and she got up again, apologised, said she didn’t want to go to bed on a bad note, cried, tried to get around me, and then stomped off again when I said thank you for the apology, I love her too but we are standing firm. I have clearly caved too many times previously and she thinks she can get around me. I am now realising that I am doing her no favours being so flip-floppy.

This is incredibly good advice. I am going to do this. Why should they go off while we clear up? No more! Crikey we’ve been really shit.

My children are too old for a jobs list at 14 and 12, they live in our family home where we are all responsible for keeping it nice. They look after their rooms.

They know how to do all the housework and will do what needs doing like the rest of us.

They can cook a family meal, which includes cleaning up as they go.

My eldest will go do a food shop.

They aren't doing me favours and don't see it as such. I promised myself when I had two sons that I wouldn't be responsible for sending useless men out into the world!