Have we shrunk our lives too small?

[CeciliaMars]

DH and I both used to work full time, he in office jobs and me in education. He hated his job, so over time, we started a business which he now runs but he's self employed and doesn't have any employees or colleagues. I have had 3 kids in the last 8 years and have also gone self-employed, so we both work on our own, mostly from home. I'm going to be honest - I feel lonely. I spend a lot of time on my own at home, either working or doing the shopping/housework/life admin. We also see a lot (too much!) of each other as we both work from home most of the time. Most days, the only time I see other people is on the school run. Pathetically, I dress up for the school run and really cherish the little chats I have with other mums in the playground! Then it's back to my house and no adult company again.
I know WFH is a dream for some people and we are both really lucky to work for ourselves, but I am feeling lonely and dissatisfied. Have we, in both becoming self-employed, shrunk our lives too small? Thanks for reading :)

However, when do people have time for all these hobbies? I go to a running club once a week and go running once a week but thats the most I have time for. Dh also runs once a week. We have small kids so I feel like I should be there most nights don't others

You go out twice a week for things relating to your outside of work and children interest. No one is suggesting that they, or the OP, do more than that.

I'm out once or twice a week for my hobby and sometimes once more for something social. However, if I have a week where I'm out more, I don't feel bad as the children are with their other parent.

Choir or ukulele 😂

You just need to make opportunities outside your home which many others have relayed. Be very careful as this happened to my friend she was also a SAHM she became really sort of cut off from people, I saw her occasionally but had a horrendous commute and my job was long hours and she had moved away not a huge distance but enough to make it a bit of a journey. My lovely friend is now suffering with depression.

We are the same, it is retirement for us. Neither of us meet others, so we have nothing new to tell each other about over dinner.
To those delivering the lectures By our age everyone has their groupings many just do not invite newcomers in.

I agree with others- if you need interaction then you need to seek it out.
I have never found workplaces great for meeting like minded souls on the whole. Fine for chit chat, but I have met a lot of disagreeabe people in the workplace.
I work from home alone, my time is flexible, allowing me to attend morning yoga classes 5/6 times a week. Several close friendships have grown from this, we have a little chat before class, sometimes a coffee or walk afterwards.
I don't feel isolated or alone,

Don't you have friends OP? Organise a night out a week with them if you do. I'd go absolutely bat shit crazy if I was in the company of one person the majority of the time.

That’s about as much as we do on a week, but we don’t do the same stuff every week and also running isn’t very chatty or social I’d imagine?

@IamnotSethRogan but going out twice a week doesn't replace regular human interaction. People are mentioning 5 or 6 times a week which seems a lot harder with little kids

We live in a bit of a weird "middle class but not massively earning high responsibility jobs" bubble where many of our friends are in partnerships that both work from home. Things that help us and them:

Getting out for a walk at lunchtime, sometimes meeting up for a coffee / walk together with friends
Catching up in the evenings and every 6 weeks or so a bigger group meet up with kids and partners - usually day time
Meeting up at Asda for a coffee in the McDonalds once kids are in bed
Active relationships with our own families
Monthly standing engagements eg first Friday of every month we meet at the pub etc
Volunteering
Helping out at kids' groups / schools events
Offering to be the one who drops and doesn't run at kids' parties - often the host appreciates an extra pair of hands even if it's at the trampoline park
Lunch with respective partners - even just half an hour - ourxstanding engagement for this is a cheese toastie on a Saturday
Getting jobs done at home in lunch break and freeing up time for going somewhere nice at the weekend

And obviously, hybrid working- even just monthly visits to the office - is still required for some of us for our own sanity.

Cheese toastie day is Tuesday not Saturday 😂

I am also mostly wfh and it can get isolating even with lots of online meetings. Human interaction is really important. I would recommend you take up a hobby or volunteering or join some kind of group where you will be interacting with others. I took up two different hobbies from scratch after covid and I spend two week nights and a morning at the weekend on them. The people are so welcoming and friendly and we don't take ourselves too seriously. I am someone who is quite happy being alone for longish periods but my hobbies are the highlight of my week! I also have a dog and that is a sure way to get those daily 'light touch' interactions. The school run probably does that job for you at the moment. BTW I don't think you are daft for dressing up for it. I met nice people when my kids were in juniors but none have really stuck as friends, so don't beat yourself up if friendships aren't happening there.

Can’t advise specifically but I get the tedium of working from home! There just isn’t the interaction you might have in an office setting, work related or not! I hate it! The odd day is fine. We can WFH if we want to but I’ve noticed that the colleagues who do find calls/Teams like an interruption, even though they are meant to be available. There’s very little team spirit anymore and people work in silos.

WFH can feel very isolating.
I have joined a charity group and a couple of hobby groups.

We are incomers in the village we live in and had to start from scratch to make friends. We are friends with some of the neighbours and one of DD's old school friends.

Ignore @1offnamechange's unhelpful comment. There is always going to be someone worse off than you but it doesn't change the way you feel.

Hobbies - you both need a hobby that gets you out at least one evening (or afternoon) per week. Agree now though how many evenings/weekends you're each allowed and how the other will cover family duties.

Business networking - there are lots of business groups that meet-up to network and socialise. What do you both do as your self-employed businesses?

But you seem to be suggesting that your only human interaction is work, and now that you work from home solo, the school run? What about friendships? Doing things in the evenings and at weekends?

I absolutely get the loneliness! I've been WFH for 10+ years now as a marketeer and I've never been lonelier. Before the pandemic I could do extended stints working within teams at their offices, but now everyone's hybrid working it no longer happens. I'm tired of interacting on a screen all the time. I've also found it's got a lot worse since my DD started secondary - now I'm no longer doing the school run, I can go days without speaking to anyone other than my family. I'm now applying for jobs with on-site working to get me out of my rut and to expand my world as well, because right now it's ant-sized.

It's interesting because on the face of it your life sounds idyllic. But you are right that your social circle is quite small and I do think that can really easily lead to codependency and real loneliness.

There's a phenomenon you see a lot on Mumsnet (and elsewhere) where people post about how they can't be bothered socialising any more and have no desire to see anyone other than their "little family" (it's always a little family for some reason). It rings alarm bells for me because it's a fairly short step from this to middle age loneliness and isolation and, in the event of separation, being completely adrift. I always imagine these posters are the ones who, five or ten years on, are saying: "my DH is miserable and refuses to leave the house, I'm so lonely and I want to leave but I have no money etc". You and your DH seem quite self aware to your credit but I think you're right to try to tackle it.

I do think it's really important to make sure you have social touchpoints outside the relationship and the family and people you can talk seriously to other than your spouse. Partly as insurance in case something awful goes wrong with the marriage but also just because perspective is really emotionally healthy.

As PPs have said I don't think working from home is necessarily the problem. I don't think you should ever rely only on work for socialisation. But if you WFH you do have to work that little bit harder to build a network.

Friendships and networks are an investment but they are as important for your mental health as exercise is for your physical health. I really recommend finding something to do that doesn't involve your husband. Whether its a hobby, volunteering or a PT job that involves physical interaction.

Get some hobbies. I’ve joined a ladies walking group that someone set up by posting in local Facebook group and have met lots of local ladies for drinks / walks / meal

Lots of people on this thread not understanding that some people just don't have a network of friends 🙄

I hated working from home full time; now I have a job in a large company which is flexible, some days in the office and some days at home, lots of opportunities to socialise: drinks, sharing lunch with your colleagues, team meetings, parties, etc. I wouldn’t like to go to the office everyday either so this arrangement is perfect.

I'm in a similar situation - although I am a lone parent on top! It does complicate things. Maybe try to make a habit of reaching out to one person for a coffee or walk once a week - even someone you've not seen in ages or don't usually love hanging out with. Although small these little things can really help.

Those blithely saying 'get some hobbies' – it's not that simple when you've got three children under eight and when running your own business can mean long hours and stretched finances.

I agree.
I think a lot of mumsnetters never moved away from where they grew up and still have their childhood friends.

I don't find/male friends in the office and I don't go into the office to socialise or chat

But it's good idea to have friends
And hobbies/ common interests seems like the way forward

Having 3 young children does limit things and is a hard time for many families as time for yourself disappears

That's true.

I only have 2 myself, but I expect 3 under 8 and two fairly demanding jobs by the sound of it doesn't leave much of anything left over. Time, money, energy.