White woman In a headscarf, would you stare?

[Tooshyshyhushhushidoi]

And conservative/ ‘modest’ clothing. Would you stare? Would you look twice?

context to follow :)

Lol. I am an atheist now, but retain some aspects of my culture, when I feel like it, and I am not going to explain them to anybody. They can Google if they are so pressed to know why my mum is wearing a dot on her forehead in rural Britain.

I'm not attacking anyone! You perceive it as an attack because I see the situation in a slightly different way to you. In that instance you are the bigot. I don't see hijabs on a daily basis where I live, or even on a weekly one. You do not live where I do and yet you seek to negate my daily lived experience because it doesn't align with yours!
If I visit a large city I, of course, see them and therefore I would "notice" more if I saw them here than I would there. But I wouldn't stare. I have multiple friends, relatives and acquaintances who are Muslim, none of them wear a hijab, it is not a requirement, it is a choice and I utterly uphold the right of those who make that choice. Just wonder why they do if it bothers them so much when people are curious. And also wonder why people view genuine curiosity as "intrusive" rather than a wish to understand more?

...and you can bet your life that if they were on a bus in a foreign country, they'd be jabbering away in English.

You've reduced a key part of an ancient world religion to "attention seeking" and "advertising" and described it as "unconventional" and "exciting curiosity" (how pompous) when it's a completely normal part of modern Britain, where a lot of Muslim people happen to live.

Don't know what's so "curious" about something so ordinary, but OK. You're genuinely curious. So stop insulting and patronising the women who wear it, stop babbling about projection and how pretty your area is and whatever else it was, and listen to OP and the other Muslim women on the thread, or go online to find out more. That's what genuine curiosity would do.

But you won't, will you?

The UK is one of the best places on earth for personal freedom and ability to wear what you like including religious clothing and to allow discussions like this one on the thread.

I am not so happy about this ( https://www.standard.co.uk/news/uk/tfl-intrusive-staring-tube-london-crime-women-underground-b987537.html ) as I believe "A Cat can Look at a Queen" - the old saying although of course it is rude to stare and most people don't. Probably most of us go out of our way not to stare at someone in m ost cases eg if you saw conjoined twins or someone who was very very short or extremely large we would probably deliberately try not to stare at them as we know they probably get far too much attention as it is.

Religion is a personal thing to many people. They do not owe you an explanation. How would you feel if you were told to talk about personal and private things and see it as 'an opportunity to talk about and extol the virtues' of it? How much is your house? How much do you earn? When did you first have sex? What bra size are you? You wouldn't like it, but you expect Muslims to be answerable to you.

I suppose it depends… if you mean gawk then yes it’s weird but the woman in a headscarf is not odd

my nan is white, not religious but if the generation where you wear a headscarf (think in the style of the late queen) when going outside

it’s common in a lot of east European countries (and probs loads more I haven’t traveled to) when you are doing housework/gardening/hard work & don’t want to mess your hair up/might have rollers in for later - I’d love to do this but worry it might be seen as appropriation even when it’s just reviving an old trend

there is also a misconception of where ‘Muslims’ typically live… obviously people of all religions live everywhere but people often forget that there are many “white” groups say in Caucuses, Middle East and Central Asia who may be Muslim

there are also Roma groups who dress differently depending on their heritage and local traditions

and then there are the many many people who choose to dress modestly for cultural/personal reasons rather than religion

basically… there are so many reasons that might lead a woman to wear a particular item of clothing to bother reading into it too much 🤣🤣

@Coolhwip
I absolutely don't expect Muslims or anyone else to be answerable to me! I have no idea why, from what I've said, you would conclude that I do. I find this projection of assumptions on folks who don't absolutely align with your own way of thinking down to the last dotted "i"and crossed "t" very thought provoking and I'm glad that my Muslim relatives and friends are much more relaxed about living in a multi cultural society and don't mind asking questions made out of genuine curiosity. When I have asked the question why do you dress in western fashion and not wear hijab etc. I have been told, amongst other reasons, "it's not a requirement and I prefer to keep my religion personal" so I have already done what @DarrellRiversCriminalBehaviourOrder has had the temerity to suggest I won't do. 🤷

I absolutely don't expect Muslims or anyone else to be answerable to me! I have no idea why, from what I've said, you would conclude that I do.

Because you've accused them of attention seeking and advertising and, when pulled up on it, started on about how they should use it as an opportunity to extol the virtues of their faith and appreciate your genuine curiosity.

That's literally what it means to expect people to be answerable to you.

Stop embarrassing yourself and stop digging. Stop. Stop. You want to know more about the hijab? Here.

@Darr

@DarrellRiversCriminalBehaviourOrder I've said it before and I'll say it again, I'm not in the least embarrassed, however much you think I should be, and have already made the enquiries of relatives and personal friends who are Muslim so why you keep feeling the need to push your own take on things and your own suggested readings down my throat in an attempt to be, "right" I don't know.
There is no right and wrong, only individuals with their own take on things. The only bigots are those who can't accept that and have a civilised dialogue and accept that other opinions are as valid. I have not sought to deliberately insult anybody unlike you, and if anyone has taken offence it has not been my intention to cause that, as I have already said.
I have read OP's explanation for the thread and I take my hat off to her for powering through her personal demons to become comfortable with being able to express her identity in a way that aligns with her own personal wishes. People shouldn't stare, it's rude. However, human curiosity will sometimes cause people to do a quick double take before composing their features and we all need to stop assuming that this is always caused by sheer hostility. That is what I mean about projecting. 😊

Eh?!!! Clearly I am missing something here. The late Queen wore a headscarf when she went out riding - I’m pretty sure the headscarf wasn’t the reason people stared!!

Islam teaches you should dress modestly. There is nothing to suggest you need to cover your head or wear the hijab. This has come more from cultural practices in largely Islamic countries than the religion.

OP, and other Muslim women, I am so sorry that you have to deal with this.

It cuts both ways - a ‘delightful’ cousin was having a right bitch about women who don’t cover at a family do (it was a dig at me apparently). Which is funny considering the carefree playboy life her husband had before they got married. 🙄

Thankfully, I wasn’t there but my BiL called her out and asked why the thought that a scrap of cloth made her a better person in the eyes of god/anyone?

As I used to tell DS when he was little ‘some people are just jerks’.

You've nothing to apologise for you, so great to people like you as allies.

As for ifeelsuchafool, good to know she has 'made enquiries' amongst the Muslim populace, as if they are under an inquisition.

She's accused women wearing hijab of being attention seekers and yet we're the bigots.

I'm not sure why people keep mentioning the Queen as I have an idea that what the Queen wore as a headscarf & what Op wears & the way of wearing are not the same.

Quite happy for Op to correct me!

@Coolhwip please point out where I have said "women who wear hijabs are just attention seeking"? I've simply said that it's a clear signal that they are Muslim and whilst there isn't anything remarkable about that for most, some people, who maybe don't have Muslim acquaintances/friends/family or don't see that many women dressed as such (and I simply pointed out that there are many places on this island where there really is no noticeable Muslim presence) and especially are ignorant of the fact that some countries where the indigenous skin colour is quite pale are Muslim, might be curious in a non hostile way and that there is nothing inherently wrong in that.
You also try to make it sound as though I have interrogated Muslim women when I have simply had conversations with Muslim women I know! (I do have other conversations with them about other subjects and there's nothing hostile about any of these conversations on either side) It seems to me that you are deliberately trying to make me out to be a particular stereotype for your own satisfaction and yes, that does make you bigoted. I'm simply different from you and @DarrellRiversCriminalBehaviourOrder and, to be honest, I'm jolly glad I am!

Some of her best friends are Muslim, we/you are the bigots, she only wants to educate herself in genuine curiosity, blah blah projection blah blah, and she never said it anyway. I think that's full house on the bingo card?

Like I said...sorry you have to put up with this.

If you can't wear any gold, does that mean you don't wear wedding rings? Or are they made of silver or brass or copper?

No, there a lot of white or light skinned women in modest clothing & headscarves in the local (university) town.

This is not adhered to in the Middle East at all.

@Coolhwip I can see from some of your posts that English is maybe not your first language and so am feeling disposed to overlook your misrepresentation of what has been circled in @DarrellRiversCriminalBehaviourOrder
post where I said that wearing a hijab is a statement and to an extent, could be argued to be inviting attention. Nowhere have I stated categorically that women wearing hijabs are just attention seeking! Of course that's not true! They do it adhere to their faith and because they don't mind people knowing that they're Muslim and nowhere have I even intimated that that is a bad thing! I simply said that in a country where only 6.5% of the population are Muslim and therefore only about 3.25% will be female and chose to wear hijab it's unusual to see that in rural areas, and some people may not realise that some Muslim countries are really quite fair skinned.
I have also said that it's rude to stare but sometimes some people can't seem to help themselves and one doesn't necessarily know why and one shouldn't automatically presume it's a hostile reaction! I've also said that anything that promotes discussion around diversity is, in my opinion, (no more or less valid than anyone else's) fundamentally a good thing and yet I've been directly accused of living under a rock, misquoted, and generally been told how I should feel about myself and you guys don't think that's bigoted?
It's a good job I don't value your opinions particularly. I know that I do have friends and family who are Muslims and who interact with me on a perfectly normal level and with whom I chat on many subjects. I never said my best friends are Muslim. Misrepresenting again to fit your own agenda but, again, you don't think that's bigoted?

Is there an off switch?

Muslim men can’t wear gold, not women. They can wear other gold coloured metals