To get annoyed when parents slag off PTAs

[KittyAlfred]

I see this so much on MN. Parents saying that the PTA is cliquey, that the Mums only join so they can suck up to the teachers and gain advantages for their kids. Many people on here seem to make a virtue of doing fuck all, just because they don’t like the PTA women.

Like many parents, when DS1 started at primary I didn’t really know anyone at school. It was an alien world to me. As a working single parent with a baby/toddler as well, I didn’t help the PTA at all for the first couple of years. Then I started to get involved on the periphery. Yes sure, lots of the mums knew each other well and socialised together, but that’s not to say they didn’t still need extra people to run stalls and sell raffle tickets etc. The first few times I felt a bit nervous and uncomfortable, but I got to know people, and by the time DS2 left primary I was running the PTA myself. I have no idea if people thought I was cliquey, but I really couldn’t help it if I’d known some of the mums for 10 years by then and was therefore friendly with them! We always needed help, and happily welcomed anyone who chose to muck in.

All you anti PTA snobs seem to have no idea how essential PTAs are, and how much hard work they do. I spent hours and hours and hours raising loads of money which went directly to stuff for the kids. School funding is so poor now that our PTA money subsidised all the trips, paid for books, classroom renovation, playground equipment, visiting activities, Christmas party/gifts - you name it, we paid for it.

And yes, I probably got to know the teachers slightly better, because if you’re running a school fair then inevitably you talk to the teachers. If you’re still cleaning up the village hall with the teachers an hour after the lazy mums have fucked off home , then you’ll talk to them!

If you’re too busy to help the PTA then fair enough. But don’t slag them off, because they work bloody hard and make your child’s school experience a lot better than it would otherwise be.

@Quinoawoman not necessarily. Staff at the school could (and did) use their discretion when needed.
Being a FSM child made no difference. The PTA funds that went towards things like this were raised to help anyone who needed help.
The PTA is a registered charity and nothing to do with which children have FSM or not.
But every school is different and every PTA is different.
Sorry your daughter didn't get a hoody 💐

@ImAvingOops

no one owes the PTA their time. But the PTA seem to think that parents do!

No they don't... they just know full well that if they don't push really hard they won't get anywhere. It's like anything else in life. People are busy, pushed for time, pushed for money and often lazy too. If they don't have to do things and don't get paid, by and large, they won't. So you can hardly blame people who are giving up their free time to influence others to engage.

If you genuinely don't have time then no PTA member in the world will hold that against you. Plenty of people genuinely can't help. No one will resent or judge people who genuinely can't help. But a lot of people can and can't be arsed and I can't bestir myself to care too much about their hurt feelings if the PTA occasionally nudge them to get involved.

The way you choose to react to that pressure is on you. But you can't both say you are too busy to be involved and slag other people who do motivate themselves.

"but every parent owes their children the best opportunities they can give".

For many parents, what happens at primary school is a very small part of their children's lives. Their kids are busy and fulfilled and have hobbies and trips outside of school. So they don't necessarily feel that PTA activities are essential to giving their dc the best opportunities. And if they don't want to get involved/ don't enjoy the social aspects, they deserve to be left alone and not judged as lazy/lacking dynamism/some other insult of choice!

Now I completely accept that the children whose parents aren't providing these things do benefit from the niceties that extra funds provide and that's the biggest argument in support of all the PTA stuff. I couldn't say whether the PTA or motivated by a desire to help those kids or if it's a nice side effect. I guess that depends on the individuals involved.

just because you’re part of the PTA doesn’t mean you’re immune from any form of criticism, life isn’t fair just deal with it. If you can’t handle the negatives that come with it, then simply don’t do it.

If you hadn’t mentioned you lived in a village I’d have thought you were talking about our non stop complaining PTA.

We live in an area with a mix of well off and relatively deprived residents. A few PTA members complained online that the school is “only” organising a couple of school trips a year (this is because the trips typically cost £25 - £30 and not all parents can afford this multiple times) as their children are now missing out. These are affluent parents who can afford to take their children out in their own time. They are not missing out. The trips are also poor value for money. The price is always inflated as we have to pay for a coach (we are in London but the school will not use the tube..)

Unfortunately the PTA parents cannot understand why £25 is a lot of money to some. They appear to have no empathy whatsoever.

Constructive criticism is one thing, but criticism from people too lazy to get involved but with too much time on their hands spent moaning is another entirely.

@Eastie77Returns this is the issue that I have with some of the people involved in organising fundraisers. They have no empathy towards people on lower incomes, or those who have two, three or even more children in the same school.

Taking WBD as an example "well if you can't be bothered to try and make a costume, they are only £15 in Sainburys...." - well if you have two kids, thats £30, three kids thats £45 - all of a sudden that racks up to quite a lot of money!

For many parents, what happens at primary school is a very small part of their children's lives. Their kids are busy and fulfilled and have hobbies and trips outside of school.

fair enough, but school is still very much an important part.

Nativity, sports day, Y6 leaver shows, they are still children's lives. In an ideal world, maybe the PTA should have nothing to do with any of these, but budgets being as they are, the money still needs to be found.

Making school life more interesting with trips, resources, PTA funding the seed money of kids charity actions, is also important. Even children with busy hobbies and sports seem to enjoy the various events put together (it can be circus, colour run, mud run, dance competition, plays..).

@Needmorelego they do one in March and they have to bring a chocolate Easter treat in for a hunt/raffle instead of money. They do another one in autumn. Are you saying that I’m lying? Of course they do it with the school, but it is to raise money for PTA and emails etc come from them.

They have ignored any feedback I’ve offered about any of their events and including SEND and ND children.

I've done a lot of parent-volunteering at playgroup, scouts, guides, and was part of my kids PTA for 5 years (whilst single parenting and working almost full time). We tried our best to vary meeting times and locations, with and without the kids, events on in the afternoons/evenings/weekends etc.

The only times I've ever heard folk moan about parents who dont/can't/won't help out is when they've made complaints about stuff.

Including
-father's day gifts paint still wet (try getting 250 kids to each make and paint a gift over the course of a day)
-cinema night had to be cancelled due to not enough volunteers, not a single parent (out of 25 families) stepped up
-complaint that kids not allowed to walk home in the dark without a parent collecting them after Xmas disco. No, we've been in school since 2pm and I'm not going to let your 8yo walk home at 7pm, and yes I'm going to occupy them by passing them a sweeping brush until you can finally get of your arse and get to school!! Gah!!

"So you can hardly blame people who are giving up their free time to influence others to engage."

The thing is, what's important to the PTA volunteers isn't necessarily important to others. This comes back to the PTA thinking they are owed other parents time and they really aren't. Now I'd agree that the parent who doesn't take part, shouldn't complain about the school fete. But equally the people who choose to do the fete shouldn't describe people as lazy because their priorities are different.

If the PTA can't get support, there's a reason parents aren't engaging. These reasons will vary depending on the school. I know that at my dc primary, there was a lot of engagement for year 6 leavers parties amongst those parents - there was a direct link between the specific fundraising and the pay off.
Maybe general fundraising seems too vague. Or the money is for something the majority see no value in, like raising money for a minibus to transport sports teams when the vast majority of kids aren't going to use it.

people too lazy to get involved

I keep reading this. How do you judge anyones reasons for not getting involved? What is that based on?

Op certainly seems to be assuming laziness is the reason she can’t interest more parents in joining the PTA.

An extension of that line of thought would be declaring that no one can criticise any organisation they’re “too lazy” to get involved with. Politics? Environmental issues? Public services? Local charities?

I think that goes to show the difference between schools. Aty children’s school there were massive income disparities between families. The money raised by the PTA went towards discretely funding trips/ yearbooks/ costumes/hoodies etc for those families that needed an extra bit of help. That was one of the points of raising the extra money to give all the children equal opportunities. No one expected them to buy expensive costumes. My kids more often than not had very DIY costumes on WBD and other vents even though technically I could have bought them ones. I got quite adept at cutting up old pillow cases!

@Needmorelego that does rely on parents going to the school and telling them that they are in financial difficulties. Many won't do that as they are ashamed.

That wasn't even my situation - I was just being tight because we needed they money to pay off our holiday. I don't want to feel forced into spending £20 on a jumper my daughter doesn't need because she already has a million handed down from her big sister. I hate te 'everyone else has one so why can't I?' Nature of these things. Plus it's year 2! Since when have year 2 wanted or needed a leavers hoodie? Oh yeah - since PTAs started pushing them.

Good for you. I can’t be arsed with all that though.

@TorviShieldMaiden I never said you were lying - just it seemed an odd set up.

Although, I might withdraw my ‘good for you’ as your insinuation that mums (not dads, of course) are lazy for not giving every minute to the PTA or worse, not giving a single minute, can get in the bin.

While I admittedly don’t have the inclination to get involved with the PTA, I also don’t have the time.

@TorviShieldMaiden surely the PTA has to co ordinate with the school about when the non uniform days will be? Could you talk to the school about it - rather than the PTA?

😂

Now THAT is the best attitude.😂

It's basically what "i am too busy-me" are thinking, but they need to come up with a mountain of bad excuse.

Plus it's year 2! Since when have year 2 wanted or needed a leavers hoodie?

I am genuinely curious, WTF is a Y2 leaver hoodie all about? What are they supposed to be "leaving"? KS1?

@strawberriesandkreme I am guessing leaving Infant School to move to Junior School.
In some places they are completely different schools.

@ImAvingOops

The thing is, what's important to the PTA volunteers isn't necessarily important to others. This comes back to the PTA thinking they are owed other parents time and they really aren't. Now I'd agree that the parent who doesn't take part, shouldn't complain about the school fete. But equally the people who choose to do the fete shouldn't describe people as lazy because their priorities are different.

But again if people have strong feelings about the school or the PTA they need to put their money where their mouths are and get involved. If the PTA's priorities are perceived to be at odds with those of the rest of the parents, the rest of the parents need to use their voices, rather than just bitching behind their back that they don't get listened to. It's no good whingeing about how they different priorities if you don't state what your own priorities are. They're not mind-readers.

@SmileyClare

I keep reading this. How do you judge anyones reasons for not getting involved? What is that based on?

I don't think anyone's judging people's reasons for not getting involved. There are multiple reasons why people don't get involved. But I would judge anyone who both didn't get involved and then bitched about the PTA on an anonymous forum.

YANBU. Despite working full time and having 3 dcs, my dd does a lot for the PTA and is the least cliquey type imaginable.
IMO nobody who does nothing to help has any right to complain.

@Cheesetouch, the pricing is probably the result of experience. It’s no good setting prices at a level where things aren’t going to sell - esp. very short shelf-life things like home made cakes. They’re all donated, presumably willingly - so what the ingredients cost is in the circs pretty much irrelevant.

@strawberriesandkreme yes, leaving infant school for junior school - the junior school on the same site where literally all the children go on leaving infants. Hardly a major milestone. I'll fork out for Y6, but not for Y2.

Perhaps this is where PTAs fall down. No thought is given as to why more parents aren’t interested in joining?

Numerous valid reasons have been offered on this thread why parents can’t/ don’t want to volunteer, or are put off by PTA members. There are some that have tried and then left the PTA due to in house politics.

Its simply assumed all parents are lazy and guilt tripping them into volunteering will work; wandering around the playground pressuring parents and sending begging emails clearly isn’t working that well.

Very successful fundraising organisations don’t follow that model.