Not an AIBU but if someone starts a thread about infertility please…

[PriamFarrl]

….. do not do any of the following:

• Ask if they have considered adoption.
• Tell them to relax.
• Tell them about someone you know who was told they couldn’t have children but then went on holiday/booked a round the world cruise/started a new job and found they were pregnant.

This has been a public service announcement on behalf of the childfree/childless women who are sick of hearing this shit society.

👏🏻 I used to loathe the stories that people would tell me of someone they knew who, against all odds managed to eventually fall pregnant. I know they all probably felt they were giving me hope but it made zero difference to how I felt. That was their story, not mine.

This gets posted fairly often on here and I have absolutely never seen a person who has suffered from infertility disagree.

I think it's interesting that people insist that they are saying these things to be helpful, but despite being told repeatedly that they are not helpful, and in fact quite the opposite, the vast majority of them insist that everyone is wrong. So why do they keep saying it? It's not to be helpful, is it?

Actually the number of children removed at birth is increasing. I have done some adoption work I would say 25% are babies of less than 6 months and are further 25% are between 6 & 18 months.

And they’ll be removed at birth largely due to previous children being removed due to neglect, or drug or alcohol abuse during pregnancy.

So, may well still come with significant health issues, it’s not the same as perfectly healthy babies being given up/removed.

That is very true. Occasionally a child relinquished following a rape or a concealed pregnancy in a very young teenager (13 or 14). But yes the majority of babies removed at births mothers have had previous children removed.

Maternal learning needs can be another reason ( more common than you might think) although this usually follows a " mother and baby" placement to assess parenting capacity. So the babies are usually around 3-6 months.

You’ve said what people shouldn’t say but you’ve not said what people should say.

If someone starts a thread asking for advice or saying how sad they are that they’ve just miscarried then what do you say to that?

There have been multiple suggestions of things on this thread to say instead.

Bumping the thread for people that need to read the OP. To all living with fertility struggles 💐

A number of people on this thread have already provided good suggestions. Another good suggestion is: Don't say anything. And leave it up to people who know and have experienced this problem to help.

You do not have to post on every thread you open.

Please read the full thread, a number of people have made suggestions as to what helpful, kind and constructive comments might look like.

If someone has miscarried are only things you can think to say really:

Ask if they have considered adoption.
Tell them to relax.
Tell them about someone you know who was told they couldn’t have children but then went on holiday/booked a round the world cruise/started a new job and found they were pregnant.

I see some I just hadn’t seen any about those asking for advice.

But apparently those who have been through the same thing aren’t allowed to say their experiences as multiple posters have said that’s insensitive.

I assume it’s not just about MN and PPs also mean what you say in RL.
I upset my sister by saying what’s meant to be will be (which I thought was s nice thing) but she got offended and so I try and always be careful what to say.

I think it's perfectly fine to say, that's totally shit , I'm so sorry. Something else I have learnt through my adoption work is that it's important to acknowledge sadness and loss. You can't always make people " feel better" or " cheer them up" neither should you try.

Saying “what will be will be” is pretty awful. The negative test after a cycle of ivf is nothing like a negative after a month of trying naturally. It’s akin to someone dying. That’s the only way I can describe it as the grief is just unbelievable. You’d never say that to someone openly grieving for a lost relative.

I'm very lucky that our IVF did work on our third attempt after two losses but yes being told to adopt/relax/take whatever supplements/that if it's meant to be then it will happen etc are all really f**king annoying.

Even now I keep getting people telling me about people they know who conceived naturally after having a baby via IVF, yes I know it can happen but I don't ovulate and I'm 42 so it's very unlikely I'll be one if those.

The most annoying comments I’ve seen were along the lines of, “we were able to have children naturally, but if we hadn’t, we’d have adopted rather than trying IVF. It’s wrong to have fertility treatment when there are already children needing homes.”

Not only was this a rather simplistic view of adoption, but the hypocrisy was jaw-dropping. If these people cared so much about the children in the care system, why didn’t they try adoption first, rather than bringing at least two children of their own into the world? Smug, condescending twats.

The problem is that everyone who isn't infertile thinks that everyone who is is going to be super sensitive or devastated which also isn't the case. Also the instances of people getting pregnant after a lifestyle change, stopping trying etc are more common than people think so maybe those stories would/could bring hope to someone ttc.

I'll go and look for figures but I'm pretty sure that a substantial number of adopters only think about adoption after they find out they can't have children of their own. It's just the same as people saying LTB, get a new job, move home when they don't know the full picture. It just something people say when they don't know what else to say.

I used to loathe the stories that people would tell me of someone they knew who, against all odds managed to eventually fall pregnant. I know they all probably felt they were giving me hope but it made zero difference to how I felt. That was their story, not mine.

Yes I understand that but they probably felt exactly the same until it happened to them too. So then they become one of the 'oh don't give up, we were giving up and look at us now' people.

The negative test after a cycle of ivf is nothing like a negative after a month of trying naturally. It’s akin to someone dying. That’s the only way I can describe it as the grief is just unbelievable.

That's only how you feel though, not how everyone going through it feels. The person who has only been trying naturally might feel the same devastation after 3 months, your feelings don't negate theirs.

One of the worst things about infertility is that people make assumptions about how people cope with it based on their own feelings about it. All people are individuals, lumping them together isn't helpful either.

It reminds me when my darling sister had terminal pancreatic cancer. Almost everyone she met would start recommending her some amazing diet/acupuncture/healing/herbal cure/woo shit.

It wasn't to make HER feel better, it was to make them feel better. It was them who couldn't cope with what she was facing.

I think this is the same thing. It doesn't come from a bad place but it isn't helpful. Sometimes people need it spelled out, what would be helpful.

I've had quite a few people suggest I "find a surrogate". I could kind of understand a close friend asking "what are your thoughts on surrogacy?" But not offered up as THE solution to 5 years of secondary infertility and recurrent losses.

The relax, holidays, friends neighbours cousin gave up trying them went on holiday to lanzarote then 9 months later had twins. Erm no, most couples have MEDICAL issues that need treatment. I'm in my second trimester finally as I took/am still taking a shit load of dugs to stop my body attacking embryos.

My SIL when we first said we were going to be starting IVF said something along the lines of "oh so you're paying to speed up the process then. Alright for some!". 4 years later, 6 failed rounds of ivf, 3 surgeries, 4 losses she hasn't said that kind of bollocks again. People are ignorant.

I think people just need to ask themselves if they actually know what they are talking about before they offer advice particularly on sensitive subjects. And also what's the kindest thing to do really? Is it kinder to try to jolly people up with false hope, or is it kinder to let them know you hear them, their grief is valid and if you want to offer encouragement at some stage, maybe encouragement that you know they can continue on to have an amazing life with or without children would be more helpful.

Shockingly, one post or two posts I have read on infertility threads are along the lines of 'if it helps, I have two kids and they're such hard work. You're not missing that much.'

I think that might be the most jaw-dropping thing I've ever read on here tbh

Wow.

A friend made a 'joke' that I could have her kids, a couple of weeks after I'd miscarried. Hilarious.

@WantToBeHappyAndHealthy I remember your thread.
I didn't feel able to post. There were twats then and there are more on here.

I do not want to hear about other people's success stories, there's often an implied 'just do what they did'. I have been on holiday plenty thanks. It's not the same being an auntie, I don't think travelling and lie ins are a better alternative to family life (for me).
I actually got shitty comments from a therapist about how maybe my subconscious wasn't really on board with having a baby. And before we had sex we should tell the eggs and sperm that we were ready for them to do their thing.

I have gay friends who did adopt and so many people actually asked them if they had tried fertility treatment for their 'own' children. You really can't win.

@Neurodiversitydoctor agree it's not about cheering people up. There is literally nothing that anyone has ever said that helped me. So just say you're sorry, same for a lot of shitty situations in life.

I think there’s a lack of understanding of ‘types’ of infertility as well. Most of the ‘miracle baby’ stories are from cases of unexplained infertility. My MIL kept shoving those stories down my throat while I was fully aware that her son had no swimmers and my tubes were blocked! But not matter how many times I explained she could only cling to the number of surprise babies she’d heard about.

Agree OP and also to people that have had successful fertility treatment, don't tell other people "don't give up", "look at us, you need to keep going", "just stick with it" or worst of all "I know it will happen for you" - how? How do you know? You must be Jesus Christ himself because the fertility specialists that we were paying lots of money to hadn't a clue how the next cycle would go!