To move to Italy

[Italyoruk]

Hello,

long time lurker. Probably outing but I’m so stuck with what to do…

Due to brexit my husband had to move to Italy. He’s been there a year and things are rocky between us due to lack of intimacy and him not seeing kids often and me doing everything as means us flying there or him here. The only option is divorce or uproot the kids and move to Italy - this long term thing isn’t working. The kids are half Italian but don’t speak much of it. Youngest is about to start at a highly selective secondary school which he worked for 2 years to gain entry and he’s very excited and cries if I mention moving. Eldest is about to start GSCEs but extraordinarily bright and will do well anywhere even if we move mid year. Eldest doesn’t like change but I think would love it. Obviously my elderly parents are here so that’s a consideration too. They’d be devastated if we moved.

cost of living is going up here, I think we would have a better life there. But will my husband and I reconnect? And is it detrimental to the kids to uproot them at crucial stages…. What if they hate it? Are they too old to relocate? I’d have to give up their selective places if we moved, so it is not like we can “try” it and move back if we hate it.

please help. And please be kind. I’m very fragile right now.

thank you

The sad truth OP- is that your husband has left you and you haven't accepted it. You have provided no reasons as to why it is beneficial for your family to live to Italy. None. Apart from being with your husband. You have no extended family in Italy. You and your DC's do not speak the language. Yes, they may be going to an English school in Italy. But what about the community? How are they going to build friendships with other Italians if they do not speak the language well. Most importantly, they are at a critical age where exams and friendships are established.

Stop chasing the fish. He has moved on and so should you,

I agree with you, but the OP did mention in a previous post about being concerned about her parents, which is why I posted what I did.

Hi OP,
I was in the same position as your children 20 years ago, albeit not in Italy. I think it would be a massive mistake to leave the UK in these circumstances. Admittedly I didn't go to an international school but I had a massive struggle to adapt language and culture wise, and then another massive struggle to try and adapt back when my parents decided to return to the UK a few years later! My parents had the same attitude - I was bright so I would do well wherever and they didn't need to take any of my emotional/educational needs into account, because I would cope anyway.

It sounds like your children have worked hard to try and set up good opportunities for themselves here. It would be incredibly unfair to deprive them of these and send them into a country where the culture and language is unfamiliar. There is no way of doing this that does not impact on them socially, educationally and personally. I'm a bit dubious that you would be able to register them at an international school as easily as you think given some of the financial issues you've referred to - do you have a plan for paying for all three of your children? They've said they don't want to go. Don't make them.

Some of the positive responses don't take into account that you are putting yourself into a vulnerable position by leaving the UK. Your marriage sounds like it's a bit rocky. If you go out there and stay with your children (are they registered as Italian citizens?) and the marriage fails, then you won't necessarily be able to bring them back if your husband objects. You've said that if you go you will have to sell the house - this means that you've got nowhere to return to, even if you can bring the children back. How easy will you find it to keep up your freelancing? It doesn't sound to me like you've got a safety net if this doesn't work out. You could find yourself trapped in a country where you don't fully speak the language, and the culture is unfamiliar. There is a massive difference between being at a conversational level in a language and able to fully function socially/in the workplace.

I just don't see who benefits here, apart from your husband, who will have his children in the same country. You moving to Italy is not going to force him to do his 'fair share' and he will be at an advantage navigating the court system if you divorce.

Please keep in mind…. If you do move to Italy, and your marriage broke down, then you might not be able to return to the UK with your children.
If they are Italian citizens and live in Italy with their dad then a judge might not grant you the right to take them if your husband doesn’t agree.
this scenario happened to my friend (different EU country…), husband “couldnt” find a job, had to return to home country, wife and child eventually followed, he asked for a divorce and barred child from living anywhere but his country. Friend now stuck there…

No way. I wouldn't uproot the children. You would be risking everything on one man who hasn't exactly shown the greatest commitment to you four.
Keep your house, keep your school places (well done to your dc) and keep your independence and safety nets.

I wouldn't go either, OP, for all the very valid reasons stated.

Not sure if the following is helpful but
I moved to an EU country many, many moons ago, met and married my dh and had dc.
We've gone through some very rocky patches over the years and I seriously considered leaving him more than once. At those lowest times I would have loved to move back to the UK... but I didn't because where I live is his and, more importantly, my dcs' home, where I chose to build my life. I stayed and made things work for that simple reason.

SoI think your dh is being unreasonable. I also don't believe that his job in Italy was the only solution. It sounds to me like he is putting his own wants above the family's.

Was it ever a joint plan to move to Italy one day or is this only since he moved there for his job?

I would be asking him to apply for jobs back in the UK now he has this recent experience on his CV which, presumably, makes him a better candidate, and downsizing to somewhere more affordable close to your support network if the bills are that bad. Is there any way you could increase your income to make up any shortfall between his current salary and a potentially lower one back in the UK?

Good luck making the right decision, for you and your dc. Don't be swayed by any idea of it being 'your turn' to move to Italy since he lived in the UK for X years, unless that was a deal you made when you got together. He chose a life wirh you in the UK. He should be doing everything in his power to find his way back to you, not asking you to uproot everyone and follow him to somewhere where you never planned to live, where you don't speak the language and have little support.

You can be underemployed to prevent eating into thousands of pounds of savings while applying for other jobs.

It's perfectly possible to be employed and apply for other work. Thats how promotions work.

That's so tough OP but I think it's too risky to uproot them. I feel you may have left it too late - they're too old. Imagine if they hate it and they go down a bad track after previously doing really well in the UK.

I'm in a somewhat similar situation and I understand the angst, ultimately though I'm trying to weigh up which option has the least potential for damage on the DC.

how often do you see your DH? What are his thoughts? Is he pushing for you all to move? Or is he having his cake? Do the DC really miss him or do they accept it and just get on with things?

This has been studied before in the UK.

It is detrimental for your professional career (which OPs husband sounds like they have) to take much lower paying work in a completely unrelated field.

Taking work as a junior in his field is one thing, but taking "any job" just to make minimum wage does absolutely nothing for your career. In fact, it has a negative impact as it pertains to your long-term income potential.

OPs husband basically made the same determination.

The only "workable" thing now for both parents is shuttling back and forth between UK and Italy. This would have normally been my suggestion but it looks like they are also having marital difficulties, so planning the back and forth travel would be difficult.

If a suitable job isnt available for 12 months, a suitable job isnt available for 12 months. 24 months, 36 months...

Bills gotta be paid.

I'm sure coasting long term has an impact but he can look for work in that time. No employer is going to look at a suitable candidate and say "I wonder why hes worked at Burger King for 6 months."

The believable and truthful answer is that the last contract finished and bills have to be paid. I'd think more of someone who worked in an unrelated field for 3 years to pay their way and offer up fluff about recharging their batteries or doing research that interests them as well as working than someone on their arse for 3 years with no published material to show for it as it makes them look entirely unemployable.

Don’t do this to your kids. A good education is incredibly important. The best thing is to stay put.
I am sorry but your husband has essentially ended the marriage already.

My gut feeling is you shouldn't move. And I am someone who uprooted their family including three teenagers so we could all move to a different EU country.
The difference though is mainly one of feelings rather than practicalities. We looked at every option within the UK, selling up, moving to a cheaper area, we did a stint of working opposing shifts just to try to bring in enough money to pay the bills and it just wasn't enough. Moving to a different country together was the best way we could work together to keep everything going. Six years later I am under no illusions that it would not have worked had we not been rock solid as a couple.

And as far as your kids are concerned, they'll be soon old enough to do a school year in Italy independently should they wish, or eventually university or a gap year. It's the start of their journey, it's not a closed door.