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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

Should I report benefit fraud?

181 replies

Greeksummer · 14/05/2023 18:49

Firstly, this isn’t a benefit bashing thread. It’s something I feel hugely conflicted about.

A couple I know is committing benefit fraud and have been for quite a few years. They live together with their school aged child however, the dad is not actually down as being at the address so their rent is paid for as the mum works part time, as well as single persons council tax discount. The dad earns a very good salary (not 6 figures but for where we live in the UK it’s a lot of money) so there’s absolutely no excuse for it. I know the mum better than the dad and she’s quite open about it all and money in general. Both of their parents’ help them out as well - regularly buying their weekly food shop, covering the costs of their child’s school uniform every year, school trips etc (no issue with parent’s helping out if they’re able to, I’m just highlighting that they’re in no way struggling financially).

It just makes me so cross as I know a disabled person who’s benefits were stopped as they were deemed not disabled enough and had a horrendous ordeal trying to get them back. I think it’s so wrong that they’re taking money they’re not entitled to and don’t need when so many people are struggling. However, I’m also aware that it’s a drop in the ocean compared to what millionaires and billionaires get away with hence why I’m conflicted as to whether I should report it or not.

YABU - keep your nose out, people get away with much worse

YANBU - it’s wrong and you should report it

OP posts:
Sparklynewcareer · 14/05/2023 22:29

Benefits should be for the vulnerable or those in hard times.
she is clearly brazen about it, so I’m sure it will be reported in the end. It’s ridiculous. Happy to contribute to the tax pot for genuinely vulnerable and needy- but not for CFs like this.
No matter how it’s positioned - they are playing the system.
i would report it.

MistressoftheDarkSide · 14/05/2023 22:35

Glad that other posters have pointed out that the child is the one who will suffer most if the result of reporting is prosecution of the mother.

In the long term the costs to the tax payer if pursuing prosecution and the possibility of a jail sentence are likely to outweigh the amount being "fiddled". Worst case scenario the amount of support and intervention required would add to that bill.

It's similar to people getting evicted for not being able to pay rent and then being placed in sub-standard yet far more expensive temporary accommodation. Illogical in the extreme if it's a pure balance sheet exercise, and can trap people into a deep cycle of low self esteem and continuing poverty, that ends up costing far more.

Every system will be fiddled. Some will be caught, some won't.

If the benefits are taken from this couple, no-one else will directly benefit. A "truly deserving" claimant won't suddenly get a visit from the benevolent state fairy.

A large amount of benefits go unclaimed.

It is hardly a walk in the park for people legitimately claiming. If this couple are living like this chances are they will be found out at some point anyway.

Ultimately in a situation like this, the well- being of the child should be carefully considered.

If the main motivation is "it's not fair" , well alot of things aren't fair.

If the partner is earning a good wage, presumably he's paying taxes?

I just think it's a very complicated area - the system is unfair and broken and the economy is going to pot.

There are no easy answers, but benefit fraud is a drop in the ocean compared to other injustices going on. Doesn't make it right, but a sense of proportion has to be applied.

Greengold123 · 14/05/2023 22:38

Benefit fraud is in the minority but you should still report it because they're taking money out of the system from those in need.

I've reported someone before who claimed they were too physically disabled to work and got higher rate mobility yet spent all of their time doing a very physically demanding hobby. Obviously you don't get details of what happens once you put the report in but they now have a job .......

MissTrip82 · 14/05/2023 22:44

GETTINGLIKEMYMOTHER · 14/05/2023 20:01

I would, OP.

@drpet49 , TBH I often think that some of the posters who are so keen to say, Keep your nose out! What’s it to you? etc. are very likely on the fiddle themselves.

Perceptions are interesting, aren’t they? I’d be interested to see how many of the people who wouldn’t take this further are actually the higher earners. That’s always seemed more likely to me.

On the other hand, the people who froth at the mouth with rage on these threads have never come across as likely to be net contributors to me.

caringcarer · 14/05/2023 22:49

I'd probably report because there is not an unlimited pot the government has. Each government department has a budget. If people claim fraudulently then there is less left for those who genuinely need to claim.

CarpetSlipper · 14/05/2023 23:01

No, you don’t know their circumstances. He may actually live elsewhere and not be contributing financially to her household at all. Just because he’s there a lot doesn’t mean he lives there and contributes.

frankgu · 14/05/2023 23:08

OP you must know the answer to this!!

Everything else: never myob, get over invested, insert yourself, overanalyse & see things that aren't there. Eg yes your BIL is being a bit cagey, he must have a love child, you need to out him & save you nieces & nephews. Your neighbour is making weird banging sounds, he's defo a serial killer, go over & collect evidence.

If you know someone is committing benefit fraud: myob & don't be spiteful.

I guess there's a high % of MNs who partake in benefit fraud! 😆

MacarenaMacarena · 14/05/2023 23:16

GoodChat · 14/05/2023 19:12

How will this impact the children? That's what would make the decision for me.

How will it impact the children?? They'll just have to live with people who have a very good wage rather than a very good wage supplemented by thousands stolen from starving children...
If the parents go to gaol that would be sad for the children, like it is for any children whose parents are criminals.

Viviennemary · 14/05/2023 23:21

If you want to report them then report them. They just sound plain greedy tbh so maybe its about time somebody put a stop to it.

Swrigh1234 · 14/05/2023 23:24

giggly · 14/05/2023 21:12

This issue always irks me. I have a close colleague who is claiming UC while her partner lives with her. Their combined income is around £65k and UC and CoL Grant on top of that.
I raised with her recently that as a single income / single parent household that her behaviour is really unfair which she agreed with but doubt that she has stopped claiming.
Pisses me off as I’d only be about £150 a month down if I dropped from 38 hours. to 22.5 and backed up with UC but then my pension and moral compass would take a hit.
There must be millions at it every day.

There are. But MN believes that there is no such thing as benefit fraud. And benefit claimants can never be so crooked so as to be fraudsters anyway. And if you call a benefit fraudster out, you are a heartless callous individual for begrudging them stealing from the taxpayer.

Swrigh1234 · 14/05/2023 23:26

MistressoftheDarkSide · 14/05/2023 22:35

Glad that other posters have pointed out that the child is the one who will suffer most if the result of reporting is prosecution of the mother.

In the long term the costs to the tax payer if pursuing prosecution and the possibility of a jail sentence are likely to outweigh the amount being "fiddled". Worst case scenario the amount of support and intervention required would add to that bill.

It's similar to people getting evicted for not being able to pay rent and then being placed in sub-standard yet far more expensive temporary accommodation. Illogical in the extreme if it's a pure balance sheet exercise, and can trap people into a deep cycle of low self esteem and continuing poverty, that ends up costing far more.

Every system will be fiddled. Some will be caught, some won't.

If the benefits are taken from this couple, no-one else will directly benefit. A "truly deserving" claimant won't suddenly get a visit from the benevolent state fairy.

A large amount of benefits go unclaimed.

It is hardly a walk in the park for people legitimately claiming. If this couple are living like this chances are they will be found out at some point anyway.

Ultimately in a situation like this, the well- being of the child should be carefully considered.

If the main motivation is "it's not fair" , well alot of things aren't fair.

If the partner is earning a good wage, presumably he's paying taxes?

I just think it's a very complicated area - the system is unfair and broken and the economy is going to pot.

There are no easy answers, but benefit fraud is a drop in the ocean compared to other injustices going on. Doesn't make it right, but a sense of proportion has to be applied.

A word salad that can be summarised as….

It’s ok to steal.

Applesandraspberries3 · 14/05/2023 23:28

No need to be so rude @Throwncrumbs 😅

frankgu · 14/05/2023 23:30

A word salad that can be summarised as….

It’s ok to steal.

🤣

Betterbear · 14/05/2023 23:30

I think your asking for trouble. What if she works out that it was you? Why endanger yourself, people can turn nasty. I would mind my own business.

frankgu · 14/05/2023 23:36

Why endanger yourself, people can turn nasty

I think if the OPs friend was with Tony Soprano she would have mentioned it

Runningupthathilljusttheonce · 14/05/2023 23:38

I would report them absolutely, but then that's my job so I pretty much have to. I have clients struggling on under £300 a month so this kind of shit really angers me.

pompypomppomp · 14/05/2023 23:45

I wouldn't.

Antisocialfluffmonster · 14/05/2023 23:51

KittyAlfred · 14/05/2023 19:18

OP most people on here will tell you not to report it, because MN like benefit cheats. But if you look at the voting YABU/YANBU you’ll get a more accurate picture of what people think (but are afraid to say!)

I wouldn't report anyone, not because I like benefits cheats, but simply because you've no idea what goes on behind closed doors.

We also have a government full of cheats, and they get off with it, repeatedly. I've also been reported myself, hilarious, really as at the time I wasn't on benefits.

These days I still get snide comments about "it must be nice to get a free car" when it's my car, I just have a blue badge but I don't get a motobility car and you just know these are they type of people who are just waiting for something to report.

At the end of the day, you can behave in whatever way you want, if someone does report them, it will be their own fault, but you don't need to revel in someone else's downfall. I'd be perfectly happy getting paid into an offshore account if I thought I was clever enough to get away with it as I hate paying tax and I hate that our glorious leaders don't pay the full amount.

People will do all sorts of things to do the best they can for their kids, rightly or wrongly.

RunningRunningRunningRunningRunning · 14/05/2023 23:58

How do you actually know exactly what they are earning, I mean really earning? How do you know someone else is buying uniform? I'd think if someone was buying them food etc they aren't as well off as you appear to think. I'd be more inclined to think she's billy bullshitting about what they earn, people who earn lots do not talk about it, they will side step such questions. People who earn very little will do their best to talk up their earnings. I'm very much against people fiddling the system but I wouldn't be surprised if they were struggling and if you are close enough to know the above information from her I'd have thought you must be a friend of some sort, would you really do this to a friend?

Axahooxa · 15/05/2023 00:26

If you feel a moral obligation, tell her to her face what you think and end the friendship. Tell her you’re going to report her. Don’t sneak around and snitch.

I wouldn’t. I would mind my own business or invest my energy in helping someone elsewhere rather than wrecking a family.
(And no- no poor, needy person will get their benefit money instead. It’s really not how it works.)

frankgu · 15/05/2023 00:28

People will do all sorts of things to do the best they can for their kids, rightly or wrongly

So we should ignore all crime then?

GoodChat · 15/05/2023 05:55

People will do all sorts of things to do the best they can for their kids, rightly or wrongly

Everything other than work more hours?

Robinni · 15/05/2023 06:19

CarpetSlipper · 14/05/2023 23:01

No, you don’t know their circumstances. He may actually live elsewhere and not be contributing financially to her household at all. Just because he’s there a lot doesn’t mean he lives there and contributes.

^ This

As I said before if he is registered as living elsewhere and pays the bills there/doesn’t contribute to the house then technically they aren’t breaking the law. Just because he earns X thousand doesn’t mean she sees any of that. I would doubt it if she is still claiming benefits. He might pay for a bit of redecorating or a holiday, but boyfriends can do that for their girlfriends.

Do you know for sure he is staying with her every night?
Is he the father of the child?
Does she or the child have any additional needs?
How long has the relationship been going on?
What is your situation? Could she feel insecure and feel the need to embellish because you have a better life than her (secure partner, nice home, job).

Username84 · 15/05/2023 07:52

There are a lot of people really stretching to not believe this.

And yes the money might not go to someone who deserves it instead but the housing association house probably will...

Robinni · 15/05/2023 08:00

Username84 · 15/05/2023 07:52

There are a lot of people really stretching to not believe this.

And yes the money might not go to someone who deserves it instead but the housing association house probably will...

Not stretching, just trying to ascertain facts about the relationship (duration/history of the woman) and why the child is having a lot bought by grandparents.

Is this all hearsay from what the woman is telling OP at school gate, or does she live across the street and physically see the partner coming “home” every night.