To be grossed out by human albumin in Botox?

[LittleBoPeepHasLostHerShit]

I went for a Botox consultation the other week and was just about to sign the disclaimer when I read at the bottom of the fine print that Botox contains "an ingredient derived from human blood and although no cases of viral transmission have been reported, this risk cannot be completely excluded". Yikes! 🫣 Was I unreasonable to change my mind at that point and go home? The injector (a dental surgeon) seemed very surprised about this.

Er… no they aren’t.

I've not been interested or tempted to have any fillers or botox however if I was, I'm not sure why I wouldn't go to a dentist if it's a service they offer (a dentist local to me does it)

A dentist has a vast amount of training and in-depth knowledge regarding the anatomy of the face. Probably far more than any aesthetician.

So how is the albumin obtained? Is it a waste product from blood donations or something?

I’m a donor and I like the knowledge that my blood saves lives, but it’s a bit weird to think that some of it might be used to freeze people’s faces.

There are all kinds of weird things in drugs.

Nun's wee for example is used to make IVF meds

Botox isn't for me. But if it was I'd sooner see a dentist than aesthetician.

Umm a dentist is a medical practitioner with extensive knowledge and years of training relating to the anatomy, musculature and neurology of the face and head.

I don’t even know what an aesthetician is, let alone what qualifications they have. Looking around my locality you could get Botox from a beauty therapist who’s done a 2 day course in injectables. I know who I’d rather see.

I didn’t know that OP and wouldn’t have expected it. I was offered Botox by my neurologist as a treatment for myokymia - it’s not just a cosmetic treatment - but turned it down because I didn’t want needles near my eyes!

Botox was first utilised for the eye muscles in the first place. That was its original purpose in a medical capacity.

This! Albumin is a protein in the bloody. Naturally occurring and designed to be there!! Botox is not ...

There's no way an aesthetician would be injecting me with Botox. A nurse prescriber, doctor or dentist would be the only person I would allow.

Oh, dear. Fun fact c/- the biologist David Sinclair: Just 2kg of Clostridium botulinum (from which Botox is derived) would wipe all humantity off the face of the earth.

To be fair to OP, the point someone made about injecting toxins could have made the same point by saying poison instead, and then it would have been harder to argue with OP's response to it. In conversation it's not that weird to think of poison and toxin as meaning basically the same thing, even if it's technically incorrect, and it's pretty much a truism that effective drugs have risks and "the dose makes the poison" (kinda — it does get more complicated than anything Paracelsus knew about). OP had already made her decision on the Botox part, so I guess she's not put off by the fact it's dangerous at higher doses.

I get why the disclaimer might've taken you unawares and you felt reluctant to just accept on the spot, OP — presumably you spent time thinking about whether the Botox risks you knew about were worth the benefit, and decided it was worth it, but then you were handed this form to sign with info you hadn't known, and didn't have a lot of time to assess and incorporate this new factor.

Also, if you're around my age you probably grew up being repeatedly, heavy-handedly instructed on the dangers of blood-borne or sexually-transmitted incurable diseases, with messages from school, media and government designed to put the fear of God (or at least, of drugs and sex) into you, followed by various news stories about epidemics, contaminated blood products, and that sort of thing. It's understandable to me if the disclaimer pushed some of those buttons for you. It's okay, I think, to want to give yourself enough time to work out what that disclaimer means in practice, maybe check the safeguards, safety record and alternatives, and reassure yourself that it doesn't significantly change the risks involved.

Maybe the dentist was intending using as a nerve block?
I don't know what that is OP, but it is always best to not undertake medical procedures if you are not clear on the details. Do your research first, then you can make an informed decision.

Was used to make IVF drugs. Most are now synthetic (ie Gonal-F, and Puregon).
There are still some IVF medications (ie Menopur) that use urine but not necessarily from nuns any more!

To be fair to OP, the point someone made about injecting toxins could have made the same point by saying poison instead, and then it would have been harder to argue with OP's response to it.

Except that Botox is literally named botulinum toxin or botulinum neurotoxin, and the botulinum toxins are among the most potent of known toxins.

YANBU. But then I don’t know why anyone would inject such stuff in to their bodies willingly.

I couldnt give a flying fck. I love botox!

Personally I wouldn’t have Botox anyway as I prefer to look like a wrinkled normal person

but the Botox toxin wouldn’t bother me at all; the human albumin would. I don’t trust companies nor regulators as I grew up in the 80s and 90s and there have been far too many scandals. It’s actually CJD that would bother me

Yes… but OP was responding to someone joking that OP would freak when she found out Botox was a toxin, I guess with the implications that a little bit of human goo is neither here nor there if you're deliberately injecting toxins. For the purposes of the poster's point, the poison involved wouldn't need to be a toxin specifically, so I don't think it invalidates OP's response if she replied assuming toxin=poison, and trying to make a well-known point about poisons and medicines often being much the same thing.

It feels weird to me that this thread has focussed so heavily on what botox is/does, as though choosing to use it might mean you don't get to have concerns about any other risk, and as though it really matters that much, with relation to the OP's concern, what the scientific difference is between a toxin and a poison.

OP wrote in response:

All medicines are toxins FFS

This is factually incorrect. They are not.

Toxins are produced in biological processes, so botulinum is a toxin (also snake venom) whereas arsenic, for example, is a poison.
Human blood cells are used in the purification process during production.

Yeah it's technically incorrect, but if you assume she read "toxin" to mean "poison" (which is understandable in a conversational context, since it's so close to "toxic), then it all makes sense, and still works as an argument for why you might be willing to have a small amount of something injected that in other circumstances could easily kill you.

I can see why someone might want to mention the scientific definition of toxin, to clear up any confusion. But we got post after post of people acting like OP was talking utter nonsense, rather than happening to understand a technical term slightly wrong in a way that doesn't affect her actual point.

Because they are trained to drill and fill, stick on veneers….they aren’t aestheticians

Because they are trained to drill and fill, stick on veneers
Have you any idea what dentists have to study to become qualified? Obviously not!