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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

Am I the villain here?

109 replies

GilChesterton · 22/04/2023 18:38

I work for a regional branch of a large company. During the pandemic I was promoted to manager of our branch, and then promoted a junior member of our team into the role I had just vacated. We worked from home all through the pandemic and various lockdowns, and only in the middle of last year did we start to look at moving to return to the office.

I have instructed our team that they can continue to work from home some of the time, but have to have a minimum amount of time in person in the office. This one member of staff is refusing to return to our office, and during one of the lockdowns actually relocated to be nearer his family, and is not in commutable distance of our office.

Our jobs can technically be done wholly remote, but I feel we lose a lot of team working, accountability and quality if we are not meeting in person regularly, and providing a proper service to our clients does mean being available in person.

I have issued an ultimatum to this team member, saying they either have to follow the guidance or find another job. I am now being accused of ruining his life.

Given the job can be done remote I have begun to doubt myself. AIBU?

OP posts:
Damia · 22/04/2023 18:43

What is in his contract? Can he apply to work remotely? Or does his contract say something about being in the office?

I can work remotely and prefer it but still go in 2 days a week to show my face. 1 team member however had to move away following needing help recovering from covid and now works 100% remotely

devildeepbluesea · 22/04/2023 18:45

Assuming his contractual base is still the office, you have every right to ask him to come in on occasion. It’s not your problem how far he lives from the office.

catgirl1976 · 22/04/2023 18:46

Why would you want to lose someone who I presume does a good job in the current labour market for things like accountability and quality which as a manager you should be able to manage regardless of where the person is?

if their work isn’t up to scratch the you deal with it through the proper processes but where they are should have no bearing on that and you need to adapt your management style if you are struggling to manage remote workers (or deal with the person if their work isn’t good enough)

Original poster
GilChesterton · 22/04/2023 18:46

Contract specifies an office base, but with provision to apply for a flexible working pattern, with approval at the manager's discretion.

OP posts:
ZeroWorshipHere · 22/04/2023 18:48

How often are you expecting him to come in?

Greensleeves · 22/04/2023 18:49

Well, you kind of are ruining his life. Even if you are in the right legally (I have no idea, it depends on his contract) I think morally you are being petty and unreasonable. If he can do the job from home, he should be allowed to.

Itsnotclean · 22/04/2023 18:49

How good are good are they at there Job and how much of an issue would it be to replace them?

but if you work for such a big company this is a question for HR

ChickenDhansak82 · 22/04/2023 18:50

YANBU but it will depend if anything specific is written into the contract about WFH.

You're actually doing them a favour and saying they don't have to be in the office every day but can WFH some days!

Just make it clear when they are expected to be in the office and if they don't turn up it will become a disciplinary issue.

Oysterbabe · 22/04/2023 18:50

I don't think you're being unreasonable. If going into the office is part of the job he needs to suck it up or leave.

Original poster
GilChesterton · 22/04/2023 18:51

"regardless of where the person is?"

If they are not available at short notice then we can offer less of a service to our clients, who are more and more expecting us to return to an in person service. If someone else then has to cover it places a burden on the rest of the team (or our clients go elsewhere).

OP posts:
Dacadactyl · 22/04/2023 18:52

Unless you have other concerns about his work then I think YABU.

However, I also feel he was a bit bonkers to move so far away without clearing it with work first!

Catsonskis · 22/04/2023 18:53

This is what annoyed me about people moving when they ended up wfh during the pandemic.

up to you what you do but if you don’t make this person come in then you have to treated everyone the same, including new hires - they don’t have to come in either.

I would tell him to apply formally through flexible working request and you can review the request with hr/your manager so it’s done formally and officially. If you all decide that business requires 1 day in for team building or accountability or whatever I’m sorry but he has to suck it up buttercup.

accusing you of ruining his life is both immature and unprofessional and would not put him in good position to be considered sympathetically.

his contract states office based, he’s signed it therefore that’s that!

Oysterbabe · 22/04/2023 18:53

If you allow him to call the shots you'll never get any of the staff into the office.

Leeds2 · 22/04/2023 18:53

Given that his contract specifies an office base, I don't think YABU to ask for specified time in the office. I am not sure he has applied for a flexible working pattern, given that he doesn't seem very flexible!
I also wouldn't take kindly to be accused of "ruining someone's life." Very immature.

catgirl1976 · 22/04/2023 18:53

You say the job can be done fully remote but then say it can’t because you can’t offer the full service if clients aren’t met in person.

If it’s the former let them WFH (ideally through a flexible working request so it’s formal and contractual) if it’s the latter then don’t but be clear about why you are refusing it in terms of impact on the service and be prepared to lose them.

IhearyouClemFandango · 22/04/2023 18:55

He ruined his own life, by that token. Very short sighted

OakleyStreetisnotinChelsea · 22/04/2023 18:56

It is like all those people we saw in sob story newspaper articles who sold their London house and moved to three outer Hebrides in lockdown then were all surprised when their offices stayed to all them to occasionally come in once it was allowed again. Fully remote covid working was a temporary measure. It is great that it has shown us how effective remote working can be but in person interaction is also important and many, many places have a hybrid approach now with some days at home but other days when the team gets together in person for certain parts of their job. The only person who is responsible for "ruining" their life is the eejit who moved away during a temporary working situation when their contractual base hadn't changed.

DDivaStar · 22/04/2023 19:01

You're not being unreasonable. The same conditions should apply to everyone. If you allow him notvyo come in ot could breed resentment in the other staff.

It is awkward but he really should have considered this before moving.

SnottyLittleMango · 22/04/2023 19:01

Was there anything in your organisation's guidance during the pandemic that indicated that WFH would be permanent? For example my company was clear that some roles would be hybrid, but others would definitely need to return to the office as soon as it was possible. If not YANBU

SquidwardBound · 22/04/2023 19:01

It’s not just about him though. If he’s allowed to live too far from the office and never come in, then others are likely to resent having to come in to the office. Especially if the people in the office are having to pick up work because he is WFH miles away.

It’s not as simple as ‘if he’s good at his job, you don’t want to lose him’. The perception of unfairness is likely to cause others to leave.

Aquamarine1029 · 22/04/2023 19:02

I have issued an ultimatum to this team member, saying they either have to follow the guidance or find another job. I am now being accused of ruining his life.

If the little prince doesn't immediately abide by the terms of his employment, send him packing. Him moving away shows a horrendous lack of judgment, and it's laughable that's he's whinging about you "ruining his life." If you give in to him, you will soon have other members of your staff trying to pull the same trick.

Againstmachine · 22/04/2023 19:06

A lot of people need to be forced back into the office.

My local council you can't get in touch with anyone these days as two thirds are still working from home and uncontactable.

This guy chose to move further away, by that token he is a idiot with no foresight, this is a him problem.

pillowpuff · 22/04/2023 19:07

You can't be seen to be treating him differently to the rest of the team, that'll create bad feeling & you'll be the target of it.

neilyoungismyhero · 22/04/2023 19:07

Surely you'll be setting a precedent allowing him to work exclusively from home.

If all the others decide it's a good idea you'll be the only one there.

FlyingCherries · 22/04/2023 19:07

Have you recruited much recently? The labour market is very tight. If he’s any good, it might be worth compromising rather than trying to recruit a replacement.