To not trust DH to not shout at me again

[LaMaG]

My DH is a bit stressed these days (as am I) for a million reasons but particularly cos of some behaviour problems with our teenage son. I could write a book about it but let's just say he is extremely argumentative. I have many times begged DH to not shout back or engage in aggressive talk, partly cos I can see it makes everything worse but also on advice of a number of psychologists. Yet he always shouts back and has to have the final word. If I intervene the anger can turn towards me. Recently we had a family dinner at in laws and my son started rising my DH, bringing up something he was asked to not mention in front of gran. This was done intentionally to cause a stir, this is what he does. Anyhow shortly after I unintentionally cut across DH, and he let rip, shouting at me in front of everyone saying how dare i interrupt, I have no respect etc. I was in shock and then told him to get over himself and then just sat there while he yelled again. Everyone was mortified and I left shortly after. DH apologised shortly after and now acts like all is OK. I am so angry. Less than 24 hours later when I told him how upset I was he said I was trying to drag it out again so I feel like I can't talk to him or he will shout again. I don't want to see my inlaws again and am afraid of a dinner we are throwing for some friends in a few weeks, I just feel like it's all going to happen again and I will not set myself up for humiliation again. I have no idea how to let it go or do I try to talk it through and risk another tantrum.

I HATE being shouted at. I never shout. Never ever so people can fuck of if they think they can shout at me.

I assume all the odd posts on this thread are from posters who can't control their tempers
I also don't like shouting, our house is a calm house where DH and I make a point of teaching our DC how to disagree whilst maintaining an appropriate tone of voice and volume, but can think of some situations where I have shouted because I'm human.

In this situation I can easily see how having a teenager displaying this sort of behaviour, with two parents on totally different pages on how to deal or not deal with it, is the sort of situation where someone is going to run out of fuse.

It doesn't excuse the shouting. It doesn't make it acceptable. It does acknowledge that there is a situation here that isn't being resolved and unless something drastically changes the whole household dynamic is going to be dictated by a teenager picking fights, the OP tiptoeing around so not to bother the fight picking teenager and a husband blowing his fuse.

It isn't a healthy situation so the OP and her husband need to be the adults in this situation and get to grips with DC.

I couldn't disagree more! The son is NOT the problem here.

The parents need to find a way of parenting their son, does he have any mental health issues, has something happened, is he simply struggling with teenage hormones, is it just typical teenage angst? Whatever it is, his parents should be helping him to manage his behaviour, he needs to understand his behaviour isn't acceptable. But how on Earth they can do that whilst his father sets the example that it's ok to shout at people when he's annoyed. Maybe the ds is fed up with his DF being a bully and is trying to control the narrative with his behaviour.

As parents it's our job to ensure you try to bring up a good human, firstly by setting a good example

It's a bit like getting smacked by your parents for hitting.

So, a badly behaved teen is deliberately causing arguments and you really don't think he's the problem?

The teenager knows which buttons to push, no doubt about that. The teenager said his uncle is more successful than his dad. It might be nasty but the dad has to learn to deal with this. It's not acceptable to react by yelling at his partner who tried to intervene in the argument. Why is he so touchy about this anyway. Is he insecure or ultra competitive with his brother.
Why even engage when teen is being like this. Does he react like this when he is wound up at work or in other situations.
Can not believe people saying it is the fault of the teen that an adult humiliated and embarrassed their partner in front of family to the extent people had to leave. The responsibility for the husband's behaviour lies with him and on absolutely no level was it acceptable whatever the teen was doing. The reaction, of course, was exactly what the teen wanted so he will do it again.

Maybe fil did nothing, because that's where your dh learned his behaviour

The behaviour of the teen needs to be addressed but the issue that the OP is discussing was her husbands' behaviour towards her. That lies completely with him irespective of what their teen is doing or has done. I genuinely can not understand posts saying the problem is the teen. The problem is that when the teen is challenging behaviour the husband thinks an acceptable reaction is to yell and humiliate his wife in front of his family and in front of the teen. That is the problem.

It's the response of the abuser that's the problem not the provocation

Can not believe people saying it is the fault of the teen that an adult humiliated and embarrassed their partner in front of family to the extent people had to leave
The husband is 100% responsible for his behaviour. It was unpleasant and unacceptable.

The teen is responsible for his behaviour.

The OP and her husband are responsible for allowing a teenager to get to this position by not getting to grips with his behaviour.

Identifying that an ongoing situation can be a trigger for someone losing their temper doesn't excuse them losing their temper.

Nothing in their household is going to change until the OP and her husband address the issue of the teens behaviour in a way they're on the same page.

Sooner or later then teenager will become an adult and the big wide world isn't going to accept his shit, and there's a realising chance (based on how the OP describes his attitude and behaviour) that one day he'll pick a fight with the wrong person.

Wow. I'm very direct with my advice on MN and I've upset people with it before. I call a spade a spade and hate people fannying round not telling off their (not so little) darlings and letting them get away with anything and everything. I initially thought this was going to be your OH reasonably telling off your son or raising his voice, and you and some farty doo-good counsellor thought any negative words might hurt poor little (spoilt brat) darling ears.

But wow, no, your OH is a knob. You shouldn't have to live like this. If others are looking on in horror, or shying away in awkwardness, then of course you aren't being unreasonable. If this is recent thing maybe he's very stressed and counselling or anger management could help. That's only if he genuinely realises he's out of order and wants to be different.

Be strong. I'm so glad you've said you can't stand the humiliation again. You've said you want a way of getting this across to him. Perhaps you could ask him, no - tell him- to move out until he's worked on his angry attitude? It will show him you're serious, and if he kicks off at this suggestion he's confirming what you've said. If he has to move back in with his parents or family they'll hopefully tell him they agree that what they've seen of his behaviour wasn't acceptable.

Good luck. Be strong. Be brave. Look after yourself xx

They’re both a problem, and I wouldn’t call the DH “the abuser” based on so little information.

“I don't believe that shouting is abuse when there is a stroppy teenager winding everyone up.”

Me too so long as it is a rare occurrence and only until you get the teen to improve their behaviour.

Of course shouting isn’t abuse. When mums post about shouting at their toddlers while under extreme stress nobody calls them an abuser and suggests they have their child adopted or similar. If the husband is ranting and raving at his wife constantly that’s different, but there’s no suggestion of that. Calling everyone who demonstrates anything less than 100% ideal behaviour at all times an ‘abuser’ just cheapens the word.

My teenage son went off the rails and began to behave badly when he was 14. Me and my ex tried to deal with it by being on the same page and applying boundaries and discipline.

My son left home at 17 and his behaviour deteriorated.

At 18 he dropped out of university and cut contact with us.

A couple of years later, I finally recognised that the problem all along had been the abusive parenting my son received from my ex, backed up by me as I wanted to “be on the same page” as parents. I left the abusive man and now have my son back, whose behaviour can still be challenging, but who is gradually turning into a mature adult that I like very much.

The OP hasn’t given enough information about why her son’s behaviour is as it is, to conclude that it is the son at fault and not the father. One is a responsible adult, the other is a teen. It may be that the father is perfectly reasonable in general and just cracked on this occasion, but his refusal to discuss the situation with the OP suggests there is a significant lack of communication between them. His behaviour in shouting was definitely out of order and he ought to apologize, regardless of whatever prompted the situation and however justified he might feel.

Why are people falling all over themselves to defend the ‘poor husband’?

Lots of people have stresses in their lives, lots of people have really difficult kids, and lots of people manage to not scream abuse at their spouses in front of family over dinner.

The son may be an issue, but the husband losing his shit and shouting abuse is another one. A separate one.

THIS

I fully believe there is a reason for the teen’s behaviour and from what’s been presented here I’d be surprised if it isn’t anything (or everything) to do with his father’s behaviour. As a teen my sibling (and to a lesser extent, myself) was very similar, had psychologists involved etc. due to our father’s abusive behaviour. No, one time shouting isn’t abuse, but the fact that he is unwilling to discuss it (and that the OP is unsure whether to try to out of fear of being shouted at again) is throwing up a red flag for me that this is not a one off. Either way if you are unable to communicate with your husband, this does not bode well.

@Gregorylass
So, a badly behaved teen is deliberately causing arguments and you really don't think he's the problem?

No I don't think he's the problem. It's not the teenage boy's fault that his father, a grown adult, acts in such a disgusting way. There is no acceptable reason why a grown man shouts like this, and loses his temper in such a way to frighten his wife, either behind closed doors or in front of people.

I agree that the son needs help managing his behaviour, but he's not at fault and shouldn't be blamed for his Dads behaviour. His Dad should be setting an example. We all know teenagers are a pain in the arse, and I've wanted to blow up at mine and rant and rave on many occasions, I've had to remove myself from the situation when I've felt I'm getting really annoyed.

Male apologists are out in force. DH could not control himself and shouted at his wife in front of his family, humiliating her and embarrassing everyone. Of course this is abuse and his son is copying him.

No excuse for your h to behave like that. None whatsoever. Does he have no self control?

It will only get worse......I've experienced this for many years and it escalated to violence. I'm out of it now.

Watch out op.

Your ds sounds like a right shit and a saint would just sit there taking it. Rather than undermine your dh, tackle your ds behaviour and stop excusing it. He did something intentionally to rile everyone up and you think that's ok or should be meekly dealt with?

Any man/person who says anything like 'how dare you interrupt', is a massive twat. Also, what needs to be kept from grandma that is so contentious, was that dh's idea? That's giving tricky teenager ammo

Why does your DH feel like his right to be angry superceeds your son’s psychologist’s advice and your peace of mind? In your situation I would leave.

I doubt he does. People don’t weigh up every little thing they do along those lines. This assertion that everyone should suppress their anger/sadness/frustration and be eminently reasonable and calm no matter what else they’re ‘abusive’ is just weird and completely unrealistic. I bet you’ve shouted at somebody in a moment of anger? Your husband/wife, kids, a family member or friend?

Have you not read the OP’s posts? He shouts all the time. The psychologist has told him not to do it and now DS is manipulating him into it as a result. This isn’t normal at all.

@Manichean
“Male apologists”
What do you mean by this? Do I owe anyone any apology for being female?

What a suprise the son is argumentative and lacks respect when his fathers go to response is shouting, aggression and a lack of respect for his wife.