Why is there so much sneering at Americans with European ancestry?

[BrBa]

I don’t understand! I identify with all my ancestors whether they came as religious refugees or early colonisers, were already indigenous to the region or brought in as slaves.

Yours
Swiss, German, Native American North, Central and South, Sephardic, Irish, South East African, Scottish, Acadian/French, and English

Biden being ridiculous with it has raised some eyebrows here in the US, too. My dna shows that my ancestry is German, English and Scandinavian. My children, through my husband, can also claim Native American (Sac and Fox Nation,) French and Irish. If another American asks what I am, I'll go into detail because I know that what they're really asking is what my ancestry is. If a foreigner asks I say I'm American, because they're asking what country I hold citizenship in.

This. ^ They are never just AMERICAN, they have to carp on about how they're Irish/Polish/Italian/Spanish/German/Scottish lalala instead of just saying AMERICAN. My DH is three quarters Irish - dad born and raised in Southern Ireland, moved to the UK when he was 21, met DH's mom who is half Irish and half French. Never ONCE has DH said he is FRENCH or IRISH. He is British through and through and fucking proud of it. (As am I.) Anyone who has an issue with us being proud of being British, can kiss my fat ass!

But yeah, many Americans just HAVE to go on about their European ancestry, even if their great great great GRANDPARENTS were born in America, and the European link goes back 200 years! (Like bloody BIDEN.)

They must not be proud of being American, and are trying to find some other identity. Very odd. My bloodline dates back to Scandinavia - my great great great grandma was Danish, but I never blather on about 'being DANISH.'

If people DO sneer at Americans for the 'yeah I'm IRISH ' type comment (when the last 4 or 5 or more generations of their family were born in America,) then the sneering is well deserved frankly! And it's not just people whose ethnic roots come from EUROPE, who carp on about their 'roots' and how fiercely proud of them they are. 🙄

This ^

I see it in a few facebook groups. Some of it is thinly veiled racism where you've a group of Americans bragging about what % Irish or Scottish they are with more minor % of Nordic heritage and want to belong to their Clan. Some of it is revived by the Outlander and Vikings type series as well. Tracing your ancestry is in some cases an acceptable type of racial purity group of likeminded people.

No, you obviously don't understand. It's semantics.

To many Americans, saying "I'm Irish" means "I'm Irish American."

@proppy food traditions probably most common - one branch of my family has a soda bread recipe from great aunt x who immigrated from Ireland, and it is always referred to as such. It also ends up being a strong thread in family origin stories.

As a country of immigrants (mostly) the journey to America story is something that links us as Americans. Often when we talk about where they came from, the real point we are making is about how we ended up Americans. American culture is a hostel poster of different traditions, so what I am really saying is ‘this is the bit my family contributed’

then there are lots of communities within America where whole extended families settled and remained for generations through choice or ghettoisation, many of which actively hold on to some of those traditions.

Trump’s mother was Scottish (from Lewis) so the link is far more recent.
I hold dual British/Irish citizenship as my father was Irish but I wouldn’t go around describing myself as Irish as I have been brought up in Britain.

My husband's 8 great grandparents all came from Ireland. He definitely considers himself American. If asked he will say he is Irish American. I don't know that he would ever describe himself as "Irish", but in context that wouldn't be wrong, because it's understood to mean of Irish ancestry not literally from Ireland. I think that's what a lot of Brits don't understand

But so many Brits are 1st or 2nd gen immigrants so I do think they understand ancestry...

Oh I don't know, I could try to talk her around 😁

Good luck to me 💪

@Labraradabrador so food traditions as opposed to things like religion, how you raise dc etc?

What I'm saying is that they don't understand (or refuse to acknowledge) that saying "I'm Irish" (or whatever) is shorthand for "I'm Irish American" or "I have Irish ancestry". That is not claiming to be "from Ireland".

To the rest of the world, saying "I'm Irish" means "I'm Irish".

It can often feel to the rest of the world that Americans are talking to us as if we are all American.

God knows. To me it’s just another thing some like to be snobby about while knowing next to nothing about U.S history.

’But so many Brits are 1st or 2nd gen immigrants so I do think they understand ancestry.’

This And you know where a lot of those immigrants came from? Ireland. So lots of the people who live in England for example are a lot more Irish than you are!^

"To the rest of the world, saying "I'm Irish" means "I'm Irish"."

Absolutely! I totally get that. That is what I am trying to explain. It has a different meaning in the US

I think we talk about ancestry differently in the UK. In some ways we're similar in that people tend to play up the most "interesting" (usually = distant geographically) part of their family tree, but we would probably say e.g. to take the example of my SIL "I'm part Chinese" or "my [maternal] grandfather was Chinese" rather than "I'm Chinese".

Most of us would feel it was really wrong/insensitive/daft to turn up in China and announce "I am Chinese" on the strength of that connection.

So when Americans/Canadians come to somewhere in Britain or Ireland and announce "I'm Scottish/Welsh/Cornish/a Yorkshireman/Irish" it just sounds our bullshit alarm.

Maybe it's just a use of language thing?

@Anonymous48 Tbf I didn't realise when someone American says they are Irish or German they mean German American. Because in the UK if someone says they are Swedish they generally would be just that.

it’s easy to sneer at Americans clinging on to a very distant heritage but when people are forced to leave their homes and their country, knowing that they will never see their families again, they tend to place great value on passing on their cultural heritage to future generations.

Exactly. My grandparents knew they'd never see "home" again but wanted their children and grandchildren to have a sense of their history by keeping some of the traditions alive: language, food, celebrations, etc.

But they never described themselves as anything but American once they'd been awarded their hard-won citizenship. It's just a nod to your ancestry, an acknowledgment of where your parents or grandparents came from.

Thank you. Yes, that's the difference.

The British Empire only came to an end in the latter half of the 20th century.

Britain and the UK arguing over which of them has the clearer conscience when it comes to ethnic oppression is a bit like two sweaty turds arguing over who smells better.

built on the slaves of Africans

someone with a grasp of history and reality at last, recognising the slave traders of Africa.

I’ve never heard of such a thing. Certain politicians seem very anxious to emphasise any percentage of Irish ancestry, though.

Biden isn’t celebrating his equally English ancestry quite as much. Maybe it is because he loves being Irish or maybe it is because he loves those Irish-American votes.

America is a country of immigrants. There is a lot of pain in that fact. It wasn't all "america looks nice, lets move there and be americans" For many many people in the past they left family, friends, traditions, cultures and never saw them again. They were economic immigrants or fleeing pogroms or famines or war etc. It is any surprise that those immigrants would try to remember and honour their traditions?

Yeah, americans say "I'm italian" they don't actually mean they are Italian. They mean "we follow some Italian traditions, do the seven fishes on xmas eve, have pasta at every big occasion, will some day plan a trip to Italy to see where our great grandparents came from' They know they are american. They don't need brits to tell them that (despite apparently being just teenagers trying to keep up with the big older real adult countries in the world ffs)

I think Joe Biden gave the perfect opportunity for people to sneer at the Irish and at Americans - win/win. usually they have to chose.

And all that Irish americanism in politics has had a real benefit for Ireland - and for the UK. Thanks in part to american and irish american intervention, 10 years ago a civil war in the UK - that the UK seemed unable to stop and that caused untold suffering to UK subjects - ended

So what sounds arrogant and can make us sneer is when Americans assume that they don't need to consider how they talk to a non-American audience.