Page 10 | Do you think you're neurotypical?

Whyx · 2023-04-11T20:06:28+00:00

Quick search didn't show this had been asked before which surprised me. A lot of neurodivergent (ND) stuff on social media these days. Got me thinking I am definitely ND maybe ADHD. I always think "surely everyone is like that though???" I struggle to comprehend how anyone could think of do things differently to me. So Mumsnet - do you think you are neurotypical or neurodiverse? Yabu - neurotypical Yanbu - neurodiverse

ShannonMcFarland · 13/04/2023 21:22

Confirmed neurodivergent. One of my earliest memories is of sensing I was somehow different from my peers and feeling like an alien. It's caused me shit at every stage of my life but would I choose to be neurotypical if I could? Fuck no!

Cattenberg · 13/04/2023 23:01

thecatsthecats · 13/04/2023 16:38

Well, I've seen Dyspraxia defined as neurodivergent, and I am definitely dyspraxic.

However, I'd say I'm basically neurotypical. I think and behave a little differently to the norm in this country, but if I was Dutch no one would bat an eyelid. Executive functioning all fine.

🤣

Is your speech very direct? Do you tell people about your talents and achievements without any false modesty? Is English understatement confusing as you take everything literally? Do you have the urge to tell colleagues about your sex life and toilet habits? If so, you’re probably ND (Normal Dutch).

AlwaysANewUsername · 14/04/2023 07:10

FloorWipes · 12/04/2023 09:02

I have been diagnosed with OCD and ADHD. However it’s complicated as probably these days my OCD would be considered sub clinical and my current psychiatrist has tried to remove the ADHD diagnosis in favour of some other anxiety diagnosis and I will now go through another assessment with the ADHD/ASD team and the whole process is very upsetting and stressful. The diagnostic process, especially for women I think, is often a really bumpy road, so no wonder people look for other sources of help.

I’m not personally on the fence about the OCD and ADHD as I feel confident these diagnoses were accurate. However, I am going through the doubt and questioning on ASD. Another psychologist suggested it and it’s true that I do have a lot of those traits (my AQ score is consistently about 34) but I go back and forth on whether I would have enough of the social challenges as in some ways I am quite socially skilled.

I really understand what you are saying about “doesn’t everyone think/feel/act like this?” Sometimes it can be quite a revelation to find out that no they don’t! I do compare my experiences to my DH a lot to try and understand what might be genuinely unusual. But I think unfortunately social media does sometimes portray “normal” experiences as though they are traits or symptoms because it attracts views as everyone can say “hey, I do that!” and so it becomes popular content. On the other hand, because the internet does bring people together to share experiences, this has actually helped to shed light on things like autistic burnout where only now researchers are finally looking into and validating something that people have always spoken about online. So again, it’s complicated.

For me, whatever condition I do or don’t have, what is clear is that I spend a lot of time and energy masking and compensating for something, and it takes a huge toll. So my current psychologist is just helping me work on the self acceptance aspect, whatever the cause, so that if I need rest time, if I want to stay alone reading about an obscure topic etc. I can accept and allow that, because I do find that hard having focused so much energy to construct a persona of what I understand to be “normal”. That might not even be an uncommon experience, but even if it’s common, that doesn’t make it easier.

This really resonated with me.

I have diagnosed OCD which has been severe at points in my life and also (rarely) managed to a sub clinical level.

I have two ND DC and I keep trying to understand some of my own difficulties in life as perhaps being neurodivergence but never score highly enough on screening.

I am exhausted with the constant masking, and faking it 'til I make it merry-go-round that I can't seem to get off though.

AlwaysANewUsername · 14/04/2023 07:17

"I have long wondered whether the struggles people face in their daily lives are due to the stresses of modern life which weren’t faced by our ancestors who could choose to leave school at 14 ,never heard amplified music (or only if they sought it out), socialised with a smaller number of people they knew well etc"

I also agree with this @notanicepersonapparently

I'm also fairly certain that a few generations ago certain standards weren't so high for everyone: not everyone had to get all As, a job could just be a job, parenthood was less focused on perfection etc

AllKindsofTrouble · 14/04/2023 08:03

I am ND. I have some learning difficulties (dyslexia, scotopic sensitivity, sequencing difficulties). I also have OCD.

I am recently feeling extremely frustrated by it all. I have a lot of strategies which I use to try and manage my life, and generally (apart from a few periods of sickness due to OCD) I do really well at work. Have always exceeded targets. But the fallout is extreme.

I really struggle with executive dysfunction. I want a clean, tidy and ordered home, but sequencing difficulties mean that every aspect and task has to be throught through and planned to an incredible degree. Honestly I often sleep in my clothes. I struggle to ever do forms or socialise. I just about manage work and cooking. But every day is really hard. My mind is constantly 'on' and the level of stress involved is exhausting.

If I have a day where I am doing something different to usual, I can often find myself sort of 'stuck' in bed unable to start my day, because my brain sort of can't compute the stages of getting the day going.

I have a PIP assessment coming up and I'm not sure how it will go. I will struggle to get the paperwork together. I will also probably struggle with admitting and describing the level of difficulty being ND poses me as I am so used to trying to seem like I am functioning.

I also object to what someone said about people saying they are ND to excuse a lack of strategic effort. I am probably the most strategic person you could ever meet. I have to plan every small aspect of my life carefully due to a lack of working memory and severe sequencing difficulties. I also work professionally as a strategist (lol). No one at work knows I am ND as I know I will face discrimination so I just force myself through. My experience is very, very different to that of NT friends with similar life situations. I simply can't do so many things in a day or a week.

Karwomannghia · 14/04/2023 08:14

It’s interesting that the poll shows NT is in the minority even though the title is asking about NT. I understand that it will have attracted those who aren’t though.
Anyway I’m NT, I find it easy to mix / ingratiate myself socially, in fact I thrive on social interaction.

doingitforyorkshire · 14/04/2023 08:29

I'm probably ND, I went through the process when my son got diagnosed when he was being assessed so much of it related to me, different to my son, but very similar issues.
I can certainly understand female's masking symptoms, there are many times I have masked my true feelings, though and ideas etc to fit in with the 'norms' of society and found it exhausting and very stressful.
Following my Sons diagnosis, I am more confident in myself, I have considered getting a diagnosis but have spent 40+ years learning just to own it and being myself that there seems little point, I m not sure if the diagnosis would actually be useful or just a label, I hate labels so unless it helps it would just be pointless.

doingitforyorkshire · 14/04/2023 08:34

ShannonMcFarland · 13/04/2023 21:22

Confirmed neurodivergent. One of my earliest memories is of sensing I was somehow different from my peers and feeling like an alien. It's caused me shit at every stage of my life but would I choose to be neurotypical if I could? Fuck no!

This describes how I felt most of my life perfectly.

splilt · 14/04/2023 08:47

doingitforyorkshire · 14/04/2023 08:29

I'm probably ND, I went through the process when my son got diagnosed when he was being assessed so much of it related to me, different to my son, but very similar issues.
I can certainly understand female's masking symptoms, there are many times I have masked my true feelings, though and ideas etc to fit in with the 'norms' of society and found it exhausting and very stressful.
Following my Sons diagnosis, I am more confident in myself, I have considered getting a diagnosis but have spent 40+ years learning just to own it and being myself that there seems little point, I m not sure if the diagnosis would actually be useful or just a label, I hate labels so unless it helps it would just be pointless.

Again like the person with 'ADHD' upthread, if there is no significant impairment it is unlikely you would meet the threshold for diagnosis. The idea that you have just learned to own it makes quite the mockery of the actual disability that people suffer from. We can't learn to 'own it' - these conditions affect our daily lives, multiple times, every day. There is no owning it.

thecatsthecats · 14/04/2023 09:08

AlwaysANewUsername · 14/04/2023 07:17

"I have long wondered whether the struggles people face in their daily lives are due to the stresses of modern life which weren’t faced by our ancestors who could choose to leave school at 14 ,never heard amplified music (or only if they sought it out), socialised with a smaller number of people they knew well etc"

I also agree with this @notanicepersonapparently

I'm also fairly certain that a few generations ago certain standards weren't so high for everyone: not everyone had to get all As, a job could just be a job, parenthood was less focused on perfection etc

I've no idea how true this is, but I read a theory that those with autistic tendencies tended to be the ones to develop tools and to make clothes/use tools etc in cave and primitive societies.

thecatsthecats · 14/04/2023 09:11

Cattenberg · 13/04/2023 23:01

🤣

Is your speech very direct? Do you tell people about your talents and achievements without any false modesty? Is English understatement confusing as you take everything literally? Do you have the urge to tell colleagues about your sex life and toilet habits? If so, you’re probably ND (Normal Dutch).

Show quote history

Well apart from the sex/toilet bit, more or less, haha!

To be fair, I wasn't always so open with it. But there were huge problems at my last work with the leadership not saying ANYTHING directly. It led to such a nightmare that when I took over and started talking plainly everyone loved it.

SquidwardBound · 14/04/2023 09:18

The reason threads like these disproportionately attract the neurodiverse is because for most people the question seems entirely irrelevant. It’s not something they think or care about. In fact, the concept of neurotypical may not be on their personal radar at all. It’s so standard that it can be taken for granted by most people.

It’s a bit like the issue that lots of BAME people raise about how who’re people simply don’t ‘see’ race. The issue is that white people don’t need to see how race inflects so much of day to day life (it’s not the dubious and dismissive ‘I don’t see race’ statement made by some whites people). ‘You don’t see race’ is a statement about how the struggles that people who do have to see race and racism throughout their everyday life are invisible to (and therefore easily dismissed by) white people. Society is structured such that white people don’t need to see race. Men don’t need to see sex.

And so NT people don’t need to see NT/D.

BertieBotts · 14/04/2023 10:53

Agree, Squidward.

It's like if you made an AIBU asking have you experienced racism personally? You'd probably also get a majority answering yes, even though the majority of MN users are white British and probably haven't personally experienced racism. But if racism isn't a large theme in your life then you probably would be less likely to click on a thread that looks like it's going to be about discussing the impact of racism.

BertieBotts · 14/04/2023 10:59

AlwaysANewUsername · 14/04/2023 07:10

This really resonated with me.

I have diagnosed OCD which has been severe at points in my life and also (rarely) managed to a sub clinical level.

I have two ND DC and I keep trying to understand some of my own difficulties in life as perhaps being neurodivergence but never score highly enough on screening.

I am exhausted with the constant masking, and faking it 'til I make it merry-go-round that I can't seem to get off though.

Show quote history

ADHD and OCD can be a tricky combination, in that many of the most stereotypically obvious traits seem opposite to each other or that they would cancel each other out. During the differential diagnosis part of my ADHD assessment this came up, and the doctor said that she wasn't keen on pursuing the OCD diagnosis because she felt it was probably coping mechanisms for my ADHD, rather than coming from a root of OCD.

AlwaysANewUsername · 14/04/2023 11:16

BertieBotts · 14/04/2023 10:59

ADHD and OCD can be a tricky combination, in that many of the most stereotypically obvious traits seem opposite to each other or that they would cancel each other out. During the differential diagnosis part of my ADHD assessment this came up, and the doctor said that she wasn't keen on pursuing the OCD diagnosis because she felt it was probably coping mechanisms for my ADHD, rather than coming from a root of OCD.

Show quote history

That is fascinating. I find a huge tension between my impulsivity and need for certainty. One example of this is that I send off emails impulsively then compulsively check my sent folder when it's already too late. It's taking up so much of my life.

SquidwardBound · 14/04/2023 11:36

thecatsthecats · 14/04/2023 09:08

I've no idea how true this is, but I read a theory that those with autistic tendencies tended to be the ones to develop tools and to make clothes/use tools etc in cave and primitive societies.

Show quote history

There’s a theory the ADHD is an evolutionary adaptation that suits hunter gatherer societies, particularly the attributes that make for effective hunters.

I think it’s often called the hunter vs farmer theory/hypothesis.

OnMyWayToSenility · 14/04/2023 11:38

I'm NT and so are my children.

JustAnotherManicNameChange · 14/04/2023 11:42

I think I am ND. Possibly ADHD, possibly effects of trauma, a mix of both or fuck knows.

What I do know is that most people don't have most of the coping mechanisms in place that I do, and don't need them. They don't struggle with stupid things. They don't cut /avoid things in their lives because they know it would end with a bad/impulsive decision, so it's easier and safer to be in that place altogether. I could go on.

My brain is a stupidly busy ,loud,exhausting place, but I'm managing ok most of the time and the thought of figuring it all out is too scary and overwhelming so I just muddle on.

doingitforyorkshire · 14/04/2023 12:52

splilt · 14/04/2023 08:47

Again like the person with 'ADHD' upthread, if there is no significant impairment it is unlikely you would meet the threshold for diagnosis. The idea that you have just learned to own it makes quite the mockery of the actual disability that people suffer from. We can't learn to 'own it' - these conditions affect our daily lives, multiple times, every day. There is no owning it.

Show quote history

Except you don't know what I've been through to get to this point. I'm 48, that's many years of turmoil that I've hidden and God knows what else to get to the point of just owning it.
Don't judge me just because I'm in a good place now and have typed a simply worded post out of ease because the other option would be a long ramble post, the later mind would have meant that you wouldn't then have seen me a making a mockery out of it, but then I don't have to really justify myself or my current situation do i.....

Original poster

Whyx · 14/04/2023 13:23

Splilt might need to look into the definition of masking a bit further...

NHS is in such a state of disaster that they will routinely reject referrals to waiting lists unless the person's life is significantly impacted by the condition. The fact that someone is coping doesn't mean that they don't have something that can be diagnosed.

OP posts:

splilt · 14/04/2023 13:24

Except you don't know what I've been through to get to this point. I'm 48, that's many years of turmoil that I've hidden and God knows what else to get to the point of just owning it.

You are right I don't know, but your post sounded very much like you were just owning it and were unbothered. The 'label' thing just grated on me.
Medical diagnoses are not labels.

Don't judge me just because I'm in a good place now and have typed a simply worded post out of ease because the other option would be a long ramble post, the later mind would have meant that you wouldn't then have seen me a making a mockery out of it, but then I don't have to really justify myself or my current situation do i.....

Of course I judged you on what you wrote. You sounded flippant and dismissive. It's not on me to understand something you didn't write. If you don't want to sound like you are minimising disability then use different words.

splilt · 14/04/2023 13:34

Splilt might need to look into the definition of masking a bit further...

Oh goodness no, it wasn't ignorance about masking I just read that comment to be quite dismissive of disability. Clearly I was wrong though.

When someone says they have a disability but they won't go for assessment because they manage/cope/are fine/own it, it can often be indicative of someone who actually doesn't have said disability. I clearly made a mistake here but let's not pretend the fashion for ND in general hadn't led to a whole host of self diagnosed people who actually manage fine and would t meet the threshold for diagnosis of any of these ND conditions

splilt · 14/04/2023 13:35

splilt · 14/04/2023 13:24

Except you don't know what I've been through to get to this point. I'm 48, that's many years of turmoil that I've hidden and God knows what else to get to the point of just owning it.

You are right I don't know, but your post sounded very much like you were just owning it and were unbothered. The 'label' thing just grated on me.
Medical diagnoses are not labels.

Don't judge me just because I'm in a good place now and have typed a simply worded post out of ease because the other option would be a long ramble post, the later mind would have meant that you wouldn't then have seen me a making a mockery out of it, but then I don't have to really justify myself or my current situation do i.....

Of course I judged you on what you wrote. You sounded flippant and dismissive. It's not on me to understand something you didn't write. If you don't want to sound like you are minimising disability then use different words.

God I'm embarrassed already.

I'm sorry for being so reactive.

I made a mistake with my initial post, there wasn't enough to tell me either way tbh, but I'm truly sorry for reacting like this . I'm such a knob sometimes

JustAnotherManicNameChange · 14/04/2023 14:08

splilt · 14/04/2023 13:34

Splilt might need to look into the definition of masking a bit further...

Oh goodness no, it wasn't ignorance about masking I just read that comment to be quite dismissive of disability. Clearly I was wrong though.

When someone says they have a disability but they won't go for assessment because they manage/cope/are fine/own it, it can often be indicative of someone who actually doesn't have said disability. I clearly made a mistake here but let's not pretend the fashion for ND in general hadn't led to a whole host of self diagnosed people who actually manage fine and would t meet the threshold for diagnosis of any of these ND conditions

The thing is a lot of people will say that ,rather than admitting going for an assessment is damn near impossible for various reasons.

I always do it,don't know why. While sometimes I admit that even the thought of one is too overwhelming, I always preface it with "but I'm ok/fine/managing" . Probably because while I am ok/fine/managing (ish) and it takes a lot of fucking work and I still end up breaking down sometimes and wishing I was dead already, I feel ashamed to admit straight away that actually it's I can't. Just how I can't do a lot of other things and I am/was told how stupid,reckless,irresponsible, lazy etc I'm being all my life.

splilt · 14/04/2023 14:19

@JustAnotherManicNameChange

Yeah, I get it, I really do.

Sometimes it comes across as dismissive, I don't mean you or the poster I quoted earlier but there are so many people who have jumped to ND when actually there is fuck all wrong with them. The idea that you can be autistic and not have impairment makes no sense and rules me somewhat.

I am reactive today though and I have apologised.