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Original poster

I don't think I'm glad my sex offender sibling is dead

90 replies

nakechange · 04/04/2023 20:50

The thread about PS has been making me think.

Some years ago my sibling was charged with non contact online child sex offences. He was found to have 1000s of images of children in all categories across all his internet enabled devices. He completed suicide a few days after he was charged.

He never told me about the charges. I found out after his death as there was bail paperwork in his home which detailed the charge. Although he was never convicted, the information I now have makes me 100% sure he committed these offences.

I have children of my own. I'd never have allowed any form of contact with them. I'd protect them.

I still wish he was alive.

I often wonder about what relationship I would have with him had he not completed suicide. I'm sure I would have visited him in prison. I'd have wanted to understand why he committed these offences, and what if anything could have prevented this behaviour. There are so many questions. I'd like to think I could separate the offence from the person. He was more than just a child dec offender. I can't accept that offenders should be ostracised from society for life, however know I would protect my children from them.

Is my thinking skewed? Most on that thread would think so, even call me scum. Maybe I just need more therapy!

OP posts:
HappyJoyousFree · 04/04/2023 20:57

For what it's worth I don't think you're scum or abhorrent. You're relationship with your brother could have been positive and its that what your missing/grieving. You can love and miss your brother as you remember him whilst not condoning any crimes. Maybe it's also the fact that he kept this hidden and left unanswered questions that has you question this.

Hope you can move forward in a healthy positive way x

ChristinaXYZ · 04/04/2023 21:03

You can feel exactly how you want about your own sibling and don't let anyone call you anything.

The actions of any sex offender are 100% scum. But you are innocent and how you feel is how you feel. Love is not conditional - you can't just turn it off because of facts that have come out. When you lose that person even if they have done something really awful, you, an innocent party, will still feel pain - that's very natural.

Whilst incredibly sorry for the victims I am also sorry for the pain you feel at the loss of the sibling that you knew. I am sorry for the pain and conflict you are obviously feeling. Take care OP.

Minimalme · 04/04/2023 21:05

Sometimes people do bad shit which does define them.

Unfortunately, enjoying images of children suffering is one of those things.

What could he possibly have said to explain? He enjoyed seeing children being sexually abused?

Being related to him doesn't make you a bad person. But you need to let go of thee idea that him and his crimes can be neatly separated.

pickledandpuzzled · 04/04/2023 21:05

I understand.
I really do.

It's easy to say you'd cut them off.
But The person you thought you knew and loved, before their offences, is still alive in your memory.

Boomboom22 · 04/04/2023 21:07

He may have done so out of guilt and to stop any future worse offending. Or couldn't cope that you would find out. But you are allowed to feel however you feel.

AllIeveknewonlyou · 04/04/2023 21:07

You are entitled to how you feel. I'm opposite, I feel sorry my brother's life wasn't different but I'm glad he's at peace now.

BringItOnxxx · 04/04/2023 21:08

You've never had closure, I totally understand.

Bamboux · 04/04/2023 21:09

I have cut one of my siblings off for something less than this, but also morally and ethically repugnant.

Perhaps the fact that your brother killed himself, which indicates a degree of remorse or at least acknowledgement of wrongdoing, makes you feel more forgiving.

My sister is totally unremorseful and does not acknowledge any wrongdoing on the part of her or her husband (the primary wrongdoer). Which makes it impossible to even start to think about forgiving.

TheHoodedPaw · 04/04/2023 21:11

He was still your brother and I can understand the pain you must have felt with his loss and also how the situation can complicate that grief. Big hug.

Mincedpies · 04/04/2023 21:13

Your thinking isn’t skewed at all.

Love is love. It isn’t always rational or how we think it should be - you loved your brother and while you can despise the crimes he committed you can still love and mourn the man you knew before he did the terrible things he did.

Original poster
nakechange · 04/04/2023 21:17

Thank you all for being sensitive. I was braved for MN style attack!

I'm not convinced he killed hinself because he was remorseful. I think he couldn't face the professional disgrace and dismissal.

As you can see I'm very conflicted but don't wish him dead! I struggle with that.

OP posts:
Lefteyetwitch · 04/04/2023 21:20

I imagine he was once a boy who loved you, played with you and who you had adventures with.

When I think of my childhood I can't separate many memories from my sister. So if it's the same for you I can't imagine how you go through a life of happy memories and separate them from a crime that you never witnessed or really knew was going on.

Luredbyapomegranate · 04/04/2023 21:21

You can perfectly well hate the sin and not the sinner. I can’t think of a close friend or family member for whom I wouldn’t.

You are equally entitled to cut people off, but I don’t think it’s in anyway superior.

If you were glad he had died (I don’t think most people would be in your shoes) that would be a very complex feeling to deal with.

I’m really sorry you are dealing with all this, it’s an awful lot. Do you have support?

NeverDropYourMooncup · 04/04/2023 21:23

The trouble is that, had he still been alive, there's a very high chance that he would have used every tactic possible to get access to your children and, even if thwarted and unable to manipulate others into giving him access or images of your children, he could still have been thinking about them and what he could do to them (whether actually abusing them physically or in sharing/taking pictures for others' sexual purposes) every single day.

Comii9 · 04/04/2023 21:25

Tricky. You don't know what you would of actually done or if you would of coped to visit your brother.

I don't think there's anything to understand why he did what he did. The fact you would protect your own kids says it all you already know OP.

TheObstinateHeadstrongGirl · 04/04/2023 21:25

OP it’s absolutely fine to feel like that. It’s very sad, and it’s sad he felt that was the only way out. How awful for you all to have to process everything.

Ponoka7 · 04/04/2023 21:26

I have a heroin addicted relative, who I know must have done terrible things. He's beyond help. I wouldn't meet up with him, or speak to him because I know I wouldn't seperate him from the 14 year old boy who didn't get a birthday acknowledgement, not even a card from his Mum. She'd taught him how to steal from the age of eleven. I agree that it is about closure for you. He might not have got prison, they often don't.

PoshDoors · 04/04/2023 21:28

I know of a family that had this situation occur. When I think of them I remember them as a loving family and the brother as the sweet little boy he was as well as the (obviously complicated) adult he grew into.

The remaining siblings are lovely. Their mum and dad were / are lovely. I have huge sympathy for what happened and know that he was loved and wasn’t just the one dimensional ‘offender’ of a newspaper article. I felt so sorry for them that they weren’t able to talk to him about it and had to deal with the complexity of this alongside their grief. It’s the reason I voted (on the other thread) that I wouldn’t necessarily disown my sibling due to this. You can think the crime is abhorrent and still love them. It’s not always a choice. Anyway OP Flowers

Royalbloo · 04/04/2023 21:29

I can separate acts from love.

I also get that if you love someone and they do something so awful, you'd never contact them again and they may as well be "dead to you".

You can love someone and still wish they didn't exist ti cause the hurt they have.

I also think as a public personality he has to massively distance himself. I've seen some posts which claim that Phil had inappropriate contact with kids. Which I cannot judge him on, but the claims are out there...

glasshole · 04/04/2023 21:30

Op my sun is a convicted sex offender. He too was found with illegal images on his devices etc. For a long time I really struggled to reconcile my love for him with my disgust and my sheer anger. It's one of the hardest things I've ever done in my life. We've done a lot of talking and ours come to light that that he was groomed online as a teenager into believing he was trans ( age 12-16) and he spent a few of those years on suicide watch. We knew about the trans thing but not the grooming. The adults that were influencing him were feeding him a steady supply of porn , starting with anime then hentaii and then extreme porn. He was arrested at 19 . But in part due to his autism, he would only tell the police that he did it, he was sorry etc. he thought they were his friends, even then. It was only after sentencing ( 10 y SHPO and sex offenders register) that he slowly started opening up. It's definitely helped me to understand more, and it's helped to dispel a lot of my anger and be able to reconnect with him. He was young and her made some stupid mistakes but he is not attracted to children even though we know we can never ever leave any child with him again for the child sake.

It's a very hard place to be, the family member of a sex offender and there is very little understanding about the trauma that we go through alongside the person that commits these crimes. Even the "victimless" crimes of animated hentaii/ anime are repugnant. And a lot of proper don't understand that " making images " Is simply viewing an image in your phone. If I attached a photo of a cake to this post and you clicked on it, you would be "making" an image. It doesn't mean you have a studio on your house but that's what the public seem to believe.

I am very sorry for the loss of your brother.

Greenshake · 04/04/2023 21:32

In my experience, which comes from nearly a decade working in the field, the vast majority of partners and family members either stick by the individual from the get go, or eventually get on board and become more receptive. There are many reasons why.

Mylittlefanny · 04/04/2023 21:33

Yanbu

Grumpi · 04/04/2023 21:34

Of course it’s not wrong to wish he wasn’t dead.
He was your brother, the bond we have with our family runs so deep, it’s almost impossible to separate ourselves from it.
That is why people who have been abused or mistreated by family members find it so incredibly hard to cut contact or extricate themselves. It’s a massive, massive part of our fundamental being.

You loved your brother and regardless of what he did, you’re not wrong to be sad that he is dead. We can continue to love and mourn the person we knew before.

TomatoSandwiches · 04/04/2023 21:40

I think you would probably benefit from some therapy, this situation seems open-ended for you, you need some form of closure.
Even if he didn't commit suicide over guilt from the horrendous images he downloaded for his pleasure I would feel better that he did so rather than escalate ( which a majority of paedophiles do ) and physically abuse a child, this is surely a better outcome than that.

Cantstaystuckforever · 04/04/2023 21:47

It's easy for people to say confidently that they'd do x or y in a certain situation that they've never actually been in. I don't, because I know my mum's story

Her brother did some awful things - not child abuse, but criminal and with vulnerable victims. She didn't let us around him, he was told nothing about us, she stopped giving him money.

However she stayed in touch, because for her, she was the only one who remembered the boy who in different circumstances could have grown up a better man - the only one of her big brothers to stand up for her when her parents were drunk and angry, who took time to listen when she was too shy to speak to almost anyone, who drew little storybooks for her, took her all over town on his bike, and who had once been so full of enthusiasm and potential.

As an adult I thought he was bad news for everyone including her, and didn't want to hear about him, but respected how she felt. She eventually cut him off too, but soon after that he spiralled rapidly, and when he died a little part of her went too, perhaps because the last good shared memories of her childhood went with him.

It's never so black and white when you've lived through it