Are things harder for millennials?

[squidwid]

Many of my friends don't own houses and they're in their 30s. They did everything that society asked of them and still they're not making headway.

I know so many elderly people that live in 4 bedroom homes worth £400k plus. Obviously there is nothing wrong with that but families should be able to afford those houses so things can move on. No one can afford to buy them...

You could buy a house as a cleaner/on agency work and still can't see the problems we face

I can see how flats work in city centres where there are huge parks nearby. But why are they building them in my small town of 20k people which is half an hours drive from the nearest city? There are no big parks here, just a patch of grass and a few swings for the kids. People want outdoor space - if there are no parks they want private gardens. That’s why flats here don’t sell - no parks so you need a garden.

Generational wealth is going to be a lot harder to pass down soon.
People haven't got on the property ladder in time order to upgrade to the houses being sold to pay for care in old age or being split for inheritance purposes.

I am 40 and I will never buy a house even if I was suddenly able to afford a deposit and got approved its far too late for me to consider putting myself into debt for 25 plus years with all the expenses that come with owning a home. I'll rent forever now.

I feel the same, to the extent I'm considering packing in my career and just getting a "job". I don't see the point in trying anymore.

Try and buy anything on those jobs now. And good luck finding 2 jobs with fixed hours to fit around each other. 0 hours contracts make childcare really easy too....

I've had this argument time and time again with my boomer in-laws. They bought their "forever home" in the 80's for £25,000 with a £1,000 deposit. They were early 20's at the time and they always argue that life was tougher for them and they struggled.

We've just bought a new build at the age of 35. It's out of the town where we wanted to live and DC go to school and it's not my dream home but it was a case of getting onto the ladder.
We rented from the age of 20-35. I worked out that we'd already spent well over £100,000 in rent BEFORE we'd even signed for that 30 year mortgage. Makes my in-laws £24,000 mortgage look pitiful ... but yeah, it was definitely just as hard for them 😑

But that is not a fair comparison.

A TV back then was like an electric car today. New and expensive.

Clothes were made locally, much better quality, looked better, lasted longer. You could go to work in your 5 year old dress and look smart.

Go to work in your 5 year old Primark dress and you look a state. You could fork out for an expensive one but if you wore it every day for a week you’d get funny looks.

Society has changed! People could live happily and conveniently without phones and laptops then because hey didn’t exist.
Now they do exist, we need them. Not want (god knows I do not want mine and wish I could chuck all my tech into the river), NEED.

I’m Gen X and of course it’s harder for millennials because of house prices. Our house is worth about 330k but we bought it for 62k 23 years ago.

The house next door is owned by a retired couple who have lived there for 40 years they both worked in factories, we both work or worked in public sector and higher education and have lived here 24 years. The house the other side of us was bought a couple of years ago by a software engineer and the assistant director of a company. Our three houses all next door to each other are a perfect example of generational differences. There is no way anyone who worked in a factory could afford to live on my road now unless they inherited money.

I would say the expected standard of living has increased because the stuff people can buy now just didn’t exist when I was young.

@Quveas I sat down with my DS and showed him how much it cost to run the house, his girlfriend will probably be moving in for a few days every month due to her work situation. She will be asked to make a contribution. Your friend should show his DD the actual costs of running the house. I hope he gets a decent solution.

This is a bit ignorant. Plenty of people want flats. The vast majority of the population of the City of Edinburgh live in flats. If you live within zone 3 London and you’re not a millionaire you likely live in a flat. Plenty of other city centres are the same.

I live in a flat and I’d be more than happy to buy it — if I could afford it.

Not everyone wants what you want.

Yeah I think unless you have parents that have done well for themselves its very hard.

I thought it was funny that on the 'what would you do if you went back to 1983' so many people said they would buy property, I asked what about the 15% interest rates at the end of the decade and was told nah it would be fine because houses were dirt cheap. Funny as the high interest rates are often put out as a reason why boomers had it just as bad :)

Tony Blair was a warmongering tosser but those years with him in power were the best in my lifetime, and I wasn't old enough to benefit from them personally but my parents did very well for themselves and I've been lucky to benefit from that.

You couldn’t. There was no agency work and there has never been a time when a cleaner could buy a house. I’d have a lot more respect for people like you if you stuck to the facts instead of throwing this sort of nonsense out.

House prices are insane, we all know that. They’re unaffordable because of a combination of factors:

Insufficient housing
Wage stagnation
Student debt
Brexit

And ironically more women the workforce with mortgages based on two full time salaries needed.

It’s a toxic combination and none of it’s one generation’s fault.

Oh and of course selling all the social housing off to bribe people into votes Tory can’t be forgotten either.

Saw this in the Guardian today... millennials being unable to save enough for retirement, with some saying they haven't even started paying into a pension scheme. Depressing!
https://www.theguardian.com/money/2023/mar/27/millennial-generation-despairs-of-being-able-to-afford-to-retire

You're right, it's a whole cultural issue about how we use public space (and whether we're prepared to pay higher taxes to fund things like parks, cycle paths, municipal pools and leisure centres etc)

Right now, people have to scrimp for whatever they can afford, then they stay in their property unless they are driving to the supermarket or grotty high street nearby.

I'd like to live in a world where housing is more affordable, you can come out of your house and engage with local shops, pubs, open spaces etc. Walking and cycling, passing the time in public squares. Those things would be easier if housing costs were lower because there would be more disposable income. We're stuck in this capitalist system of scrounging every penny to pay rent or mortgage, working long hours, spending leisure time consuming. If it doesn't make anyone money, we don't see it as a worthwhile activity.

It's not nonsense when I'm responding to a post!

Generation Xer here. Yes, millennials have had an utterly shit deal. Although not quite to the level of boomers, we had so many advantages.

I came out of uni with no debt as my degree was paid for. I also got a full grant which I successfully topped up by working in factories in my holidays. I did not need a term time job. I only once went cap in hand to my parents, in my last ever term, when I asked them to lend me £100, which I paid back when I was able to land two fun but low paid jobs the week after graduation. Six months later I walked into a well paid graduate job where a first degree was enough. We played hard as well as worked hard as that was company culture. I had an affordable rented room with friends til I met my now husband and we bought a 3 bed house in London for £270k which I felt was extortionate but it was affordable enough that I could work part time if we had kids. Which I did. I have had two final salary pensions and an NHS pension.

This is just how things were. There are many stories like mine I’m sure.

Millennials and my own children have none of the above. My twelve year old asked me how will she ever be able to afford her own home. I have no answers. The Tory government of the last 13 years have eroded all the opportunities that we had. Our children are overworked from a young age in school and have enormous pressure to “do well” without a guarantee of the spoils of “doing well”. Plus climate change on top.

I would never EVER tell a millennial they haven’t been crapped on from a great height.

I'm 32 and I have owned my own home for 10 years. I started saving when I started work at 15 and I lived rent free with my mum until I was 18.

It's very easy to say that we have it tough at the age we're at because of X, Y and Z in society, but really, if you don't own your own home by 37, you probably just didn't get on the property ladder at the right time like I was lucky enough to when I was young.

I don't understand the thinking that millennials struggle more than other generations. More people I know have a house than don't near me in the North at our age.

I don’t have a private pension because I saved every penny to buy a house. And I still save every penny to overpay the mortgage, to insure myself against health issues that might prevent me being able to pay the mortgage until age 65 (which is how long it’ll take to pay it off if I don’t overpay).

My house is my pension basically. When I retire I’ll downsize and live off the proceeds. I can’t afford to pay into a pension when I’m paying for a house.

I would never EVER tell a millennial they haven’t been crapped on from a great height.

Totally agree but they’re blaming the wrong people for the crapping.

Had this conversation with my grandparents a couple of years before they died. They couldn't understand why, at 25, I hadn't bought a house.

They bought their (beautiful, 4 bed) forever house for £4,500 in 1965 at 30ish. At the time, my grandad earned £1500 a year and my grandma £1000 (when not on maternity with my dad & aunt & uncle). It was less than 2x their combined salary.

At 25, I earned £27,000. That same house was valued at £480k a year later. Even with a partner earning the same as me, we'd be looking at more than 9x our combined salary to buy the same house. Even if I think about the salary I was on at 30, £32k, and a partner with the same salary, it'd be 7.5x salary.

As it was, they coped comfortably (holidays in France or Italy each year, 2 cars), including at points off just my grandad's salary while my grandma stayed at home with my dad and aunt/uncle. They both had good, professional but not especially high-paying jobs. Excellent pensions. They lived a lifestyle I could only dream of now with a similar level of job.

I don't begrudge them it at all, but wish it had been the same for me!

My parents bought their first home, a two bed semi detached house, when they were aged 21 and already had me back in 1980.

DF was a quarry labourer and DM worked part time in a shop.

I thought it would be an interesting exercise to imagine a similar couple today buying the same house.

Let's assume for a similar set up today, they would be earning minimum wage. So about £18k for DF and £9K for DM.

According to my building society mortgage calculator, they could borrow £149K and it would cost them around £800 a month. It's just enough to buy my childhood home according to Zoopla, but it would leave them with around £1000 for all bills, childcare, and food, and car running costs per month. Which isn't a massive amount and presumably leaves you with nothing for unexpected expenses such as house repairs etc etc. Plus they would have needed to save up for the deposit whilst paying their boomer landlord a ridiculous sum in rent for a mouldy and damp flat!

Obviously I haven't included any benefits in my calculations because I wasn't sure where to start with that one.

We certainly weren't living the good life as a child, but I don't remember it being a terrible struggle either. I do think it's harder these days.

I had a full time nursing job in the hospital,we didn't have a car...I did buy a push bike. I worked nights,so as not to have to pay for childcare. I didn't intend to do all these jobs in my 50s.. cleaning job,was allowed to take the kids. Agency work fitted in, when DH was off work, to do the childcare, plus shifts in a nursing home.

That's all good and fine, I did the same but over 200 miles away. However this then has knock on effects on other aspects. My Dad died last year unexpectedly and has left my Mum who he was previously a career for, I've no way of moving back to where she lives as a 2 up/2 down 'starter' home is £400k, twice the price of my 3 bed semi.

Putting aside the financial and emotional cost to us (partners family also far away and he is going to find himself in the same situation), Mum now is reliant on the local social services and adult care system until I can persuade her to move nearer to me.

I don't think there is anything wrong with wanting to be able to live in the same areas you grew up and be around family and friends.

A “tiny terraced house” in some parts of the country is £700k. £400k might get you that studio if you’re lucky. So yep. Starter home prices.

www.statista.com/statistics/557882/first-time-buyer-average-house-price-by-region-uk/

I think also that many FTB rely on inheritance or family help