Are things harder for millennials?

[squidwid]

Many of my friends don't own houses and they're in their 30s. They did everything that society asked of them and still they're not making headway.

I know so many elderly people that live in 4 bedroom homes worth £400k plus. Obviously there is nothing wrong with that but families should be able to afford those houses so things can move on. No one can afford to buy them...

Your maths is a little off with the doubling of it, assuming £300 a year on hair/nails (and then applying that to men? Who then won't have a haircut for 5 years? Ditto a woman who might be trying to progress her career?), and you're assuming that the costs of eg sandwiches etc are standalones rather than displacing cheaper spending (leftovers/sandwich made from home), the cost of travel as a couple is rarely double what it is for a single person, etc etc.

And after 5 years, you've got £25k. Great. That would have been the deposit on my first flat. In 2008.

We managed fine as millennials with no parental wealth passed down, it's my children I worry for.

It’s not even debatable. It is much harder for a millennial to buy property respective to average wages than their equivalents generations ago. Unfortunately we’re a nation of NIMBYs so not enough new housing is built and, as importantly, not enough good transport infrastructure is built to make long distance commutes viable.

It’s an example of how things can add up, not exact costs. I also didn’t include other things such as car loans, lunches out, other subscriptions and regular clothes buying. Haircuts can be done at home, and no, you don’t need salon haircuts to progress your career. The £25k estimate is just from cutting out non-essentials, that would be added to other savings, even a small amount per month would add nicely to that. A £30k deposit is a good deposit for most of the country, even the Southeast, for a starter home. Maybe not London but then most people buying their first house can’t and don’t buy in London.

Yes exactly, us millennials are fine. We should be worrying about gen z and the next, not millennials.

Odd definition of fine. By that logic gen-z is also fine because whoever comes after will probably have it even worse than them.

No more churlish than me pointing out that a much lower proportion of younger voters don't actually vote

Higher not lower -duh

That would indeed be churlish as voter turnout in the 18-24 bracket has been remarkably consistent since the 90s.

It's a really weird assumption that people saving for a deposit haven't already cut out a lot of those things and those are the savings.

I think it's getting harder. My sister is 7 years you younger than me. We have earned similar salaries at similar points (public sector). In my northern city I could buy a one bed flat for 90k about 10 years ago. Now she will need more like 120/130k and has taken longer to save because rents are higher. She felt close to being able to buy this time last year but CoL and interest rates have scuppered that. Yes she has the internet and Netflix, no she isn't living on pret and having foreign holidays!

It's a really weird caricature of younger people that they are flinging money around with abandon on totally avoidable luxuries, that I 100% don't recognise in the people I know, particularly the people I work with, who appear to be remarkably frugal and canny with money in a way that I never had to be in my 'scrimping and saving' period because it was unarguably more affordable to buy properly back then.

We’re fine because the majority of us are now in our thirties, have had years to save and have had the advantage of lower interest rates and lower house prices than now. Most of us who prioritised buying a house have already got one. Those who didn’t take advantage of that on their twenties may have an issue but most of us are fine. The younger generation are just just starting to save, have the cost of living crisis and much higher interest rates, they are the ones who have the problem not millennials.

It’s a way for older people to comfort themselves that they had it just as tough. The notion that younger generations are entitled is deeply ingrained and we all succumb to it from time to time (done a lot more than other).

🤔 I paid £120/week rent in the 90s for a room in a shared house, the room was so small the base of my single bed rested on the skirting boards & I used the airing cupboard for my clothes. And I worked 2 jobs just to be able to survive London prices.

The only people I knew who were able to buy anything in London even in the 90s were those whose who had access to the bank of mum and dad.

I know people who are single, in low paying jobs but have a lot of savings. Yet they are nowhere close to buying and probably will never be until they are well into later life, if at all.
They definitely don't spend, spend, spend in places like Starbucks. They don't smoke or drink either. Good with money, well functioning adults yet can't get their own places because of the crazy prices. Even if they 'retrained' as many suggest on here, it wouldn't solve the issue.
Many of the people who were able to do it were either lucky enough to meet a decent partner in their twenties, had a high earning partner or lots of family financial help. It annoys me when I hear people say 'Well we managed it at 25. We had our priorities right.' It isn't as easy for some. That doesn't mean they are less hard working or less worthy of it.

A lot of millennials have mortgages on much more expensive houses than their predecessors with interest rates rising and have on average very young children during a cost of living and public service crisis. So again, not my definition of fine even if things will get even worse for whoever’s coming after.

@Knullrufs

Well the US and UK systems are not very democratic - FPTP and the electoral college (US) and constituency divisions (UK) actually make many people's votes meaningless.

Germany has a rather better balanced system because they lost the war and started from scratch.

History is a bit more complicated than "blame old people."

Even if you did all that and never spent a single penny that wasn't essential, i bet house prices would have gone up by more than 25k in the five years you've been saving.

This thread has been an interesting read.

Neither of my now deceased grandparents could have bought their own house, despite working, and lived in council houses. I don’t think back then that ‘owning’ a home was the be all - it was having a decent home. With the Thatcher sell offs and hers and subsequent government failures in this area, that societal shift will be monumental to put right, if ever.

The push for going to university for everyone resulted in property being needed for students but also once having left home, young people tend to carry on renting, getting work away from their parents etc. 40 years ago, it was definitely more the norm to live at home, not having gone to uni, get a job, and if you met someone likelihood would be both people could save hugely for a couple of years or so, basically putting every pound they could go saving, whilst staying living in the home you perhaps grew up in. People didn’t so much buy a property alone. People didn’t live together so much in rented flats say when they were early in a relationship, which of course makes any real saving so difficult. Many people renting just carried in renting and that was ok as home ownership wasn’t always the main thing. And another societal shift is that in earlier generations it was more the norm to find a home, get married, have kids younger than now. Again just societal shifts across different generations, and comparing then and now doesn’t really help the now.

And expectations. I am nowhere near London and hear about the shocking prices of property vs wages. I just had a little browse and came across many ads for flats in London less than 100k, including brand new ones. What am I missing as (admittedly to my quick google search) these looked fine as a first time property. Admittedly for a single person or couple, not families.

I'm a millennial - although at the older end - age 40.

I bought my house on a single wage 7 years ago. Didn't have any family money, left home and rented from the age of 16, did a HND at university, had my first child at 20, worked during the day and studied in the evenings, got a job that I love which pays well that I commute an hour for (initially on a motor bike in all weather's), had my second child at 30, all the while saving hard for a deposit. Went on to buy a good standard 4 bedroom detached home with a garage for £125k (luckily for me this was a repo, at a time when there was expected to be mass redundancies in my area, northern town, uncertainty within the steel industry).

It wasn't easy and I've made sacrifices - however, also can see that things are getting worse. My neighbour just sold his same style house for £250k. If I was looking now, I wouldn't have been able to afford a house in the same area.

I do think it is harder but there is also less willingness to scrimp and save in general in younger generations. I have expectant students in my family bombing money on takeaways, £120+ trainers and unnecessary tech which they see as essential to their standard of living. The problem is that this was normal for them growing up and going without seems hard/impossible. when I left home we didn’t have foreign holidays, cable tv or takeaways so living in utterly squalid accommodation off rice, beans and market veg wasn’t as big a drop down as it is for todays kids.

parents worried for their kids need to install a saving mentality as early as possible. As well as actually saving (even if it’s just £15 here and there in their bank account rather than an unnecessary toy or pair of sparkly trainers).

The younger generation are just just starting to save, have the cost of living crisis and much higher interest rates

Those higher interest rates ironically work in their favour. They get a better return on their savings and when they eventually buy they’ve unlikely to see horrific rises in their mortgage payments. Savers love high interest rates.

People should start saving before they are ready to buy a house. I do think some people decide they are ready to buy and then start saving so end up not being able to save quickly enough as prices rise.

btw I’m a millennial. Started saving at 18 and bought on my own at age 25 having saved a £15k deposit. Also I waited to pass my professional qualifications in my career so I had a higher salary.

i agree with a PP. it was possible for a lot of millennials to buy a house if they were determined enough and managed to get an ok job. Obviously excluding people with unfortunate circumstances or london. But for most it was possible.

i really feel for gen Z and alphas as there is no way to buy a house